Army Guy

Bullshit...Why is it Bullshit....Because this is a volunteer war, don't want to go just say so.....or come up with dozens of other reason not to go....nobody force him to go....anyone saying so is a liar.... Lets not forget his family is grieving thier son....thier loss, and may or may not be clearly thinking out exactly what they are saying....and the media is just waiting to suck it up....."finally as soldier that does agree with the mission" front page.... Well he must have agree with something.....first he is a soldier....you know close with and destroy the enemy....not with water ballons and flowers , but bombs and bullets....Secondly he volunteered to go .....that means stepping forward and saying yes i want to go.....And finally if he is married his Wife also has to sign off to agreeing with his going..... So i call bullshit....and this soldier was either lying or is being misrepresented by the media and now you sir....

Not to mention Nov 11, and all them great battles dates such as D-DAY, Dieppe, to name but a few all taken up TV time, or messing with traffic for thier parades and shit.........and don't get me started on all the discounts that them Vets get on airfare, car purchases, free medical care, shit they even got thier own hospital .... and you know it's a conservative propaganda plot again'st all Canadians because the liberals don't use the military....shit they don't even like them....I'm with you man, hey pass me some of that weed....Sooooooooo what great debates is the Canadian public being distracted from again....US health care right......your right lets get out our pickets mannnnn...i'm with ya..... I want to ask you just how much of your tax dollars you think you pay into Afghan mission or for that matter the military.....Considering that last year the bill for Afghan was under 2 Bil.....I think it works out to each Canadian puts in under 20 dollars out of thier total tax bill into this mission.....send me your address and i'll send you your 20 bucks if it bothers you that much..... Japans miltary budget last year was twice as high as ours is. Calling Ireland and Austria a middle global power is somewhat a reach don't you think....

One would have to admit we are always "behind" the 8 ball when it comes to sending the right equipment over for the right job...One of those reasons is there is simply not enough of it...and while there is alot of semi modern equipment in Afghan there is only a couple of examples of this equipment in Canada for the troops to train on.... And while you are correct the enemy will always adapt his IED's to the equipment we are using, we should atleast give our troops a fighting chance, or allow for a open casket any ways ...As for better armour, our LAVs are generation III or third gen....GM is now producing Gen V plus an upgraded version of gen 5 known as LAV -H....much more armour, better wpns, more speed....they are also replacing the T-Lav's ( modified M-113) with perhaps CV-90's but only a handeful will be purchased....

Historically it has always taken the price of soldiers lives to get the government and people of Canada to release the purse strings...what scares me is it may take hundrds more to get our military into shape...what we should be asking is why ?

Justice had nothing to do with the disbandment of the CAR, justice was served when those soldiers where charged in a court of law, where found guilty and sentenced, including those found guilty of not doing anything ....that was justice...the decision to disband the Regt was made to score political pionts, nothing more... I'm curious to know what message was sent....or what message did you recieve....As for the loyality to the rule of law, a soldier is responasable to 2 layers of law, civil law, military law, and to top all of that off the code of conduct within the Dept of National Defense. So i'm sure every soldier is well aware of where the rule of law stands in the grand sceme of things. I'm just not sure how collective punishment fits into this so called rule of law, because it's not in any Canadian law, or inter national law, or for that matter the Genva convention...in fact all of the above laws strictly state that collective punsihment is indeed unlawful....so much for that rule of law being supreme, but i guess that only go's when it seems polictically acceptable to do so....so one would have to ask are you really for the rule of law or are you for whats political acceptable ?

Perhaps you should educate yourself on the Regiment, those responsible for the somolia incident where charged and tried in a court of law and punished....And the others where removed from the military, by the time the politicasl decision was made to disband the entire regt was cleaned up... Your right it's not a boys club....the CAR was our nations elite unit, one comparable to some of the best in the world....in fact alot of it's members went on to serve in what is known as the JTF today, As for it being just another job your wrong....it was'nt a job but a way of life, these men recieved elite training from around the world...and they where very good at it.... Regimental Loyalty may be a childish anachronism to you, but then again how do you explain it to someone that has not been exposed to it....many members spend thier entire carears with the same regt, it picks up where the tax payer leaves off, offering many things not available thru public fuinding, such as loans for those members in need, higher education assistance for dependants, looking after members that have been injured the list is endless.... i guess to sum it up they look after it's members long after the tax payer has forgotton them....and that sir is worth alot for those that give up almost everything in the service of thier country....Lets not forget that these men and women develope a bond that is equal or greater than family. and it's this bond that allows them to do there jobs, knowing that every sacrafice they make will not be forgotten....

Lets talk about due process shall we, since we are talking about ensuring that Mr Khadr has every option available to him to defend himself again'st all the charges brought again'st him here in Canada...and yet nobody has even thought about making it a level playing field ....ensuring that the proscution has the same rights and abilities.... After all we are talking about a battlefield here, they're is no such thing as a combat CSI team, or the net works would have made a 4 th CSI special....Soldiers don't gahter evidence after a fire fight, they gather intel two very different things....we move on to the next battle field or continue the mission....which is what happen here, sure a tape was found some other intel gathered....but not to cover soldiers asses or ensure this wounded Terrorist got a fair trail.... but to see if this intel would lead them to another IED bomb making network.... So NATO may of scewed up a bit trying out these new laws and testing out new conventions by sticking mr Khadr into a pigion hole marked terrorist or illigal combantant....had he been declared a POW legally he could been held for the duration of the war providing he was not guilty of war crimes...and this whole thing would have been where....Canada demanding his return from a POW center , i don't think so... SO they went down the wrong road, and may of lost all abilities to sink Mr Khadrs ship....soon he will test our justice system which is geared towards the criminal anyways....with the victim suffering once again....yes i say victim as Sgt Speers wife is watching this closely, along with those US soldiers that where there that day...and they want to know that Omar and those like him pay a price for thier decisions...they also want to see us as a nation step up to the plate and send a clear message to the world....Terrorist your not welcome here and we support our NATO allieds....

Mine: Yours: Answer the question do you think they had in mind Mr Khadr's rights and freedoms....or was the orginal intent for law biding Canadians. Canadian soldiers Rules of engagement are based upon Canadian law, inter-national law, and all the conventions in which Canada has signed....it governs whom and what our soldiers do on the battle field....MR Khadr was a legal target according to those same laws and freedoms we are speaking about...meaning he could be engaged with deadly force... Perhaps i'm seeing this through the eyes of a soldier....and you thru the eys of a civilian....here is my issue if he meets all the legal means for me to take his life on the battle field then why, is our current justice system which can not find it's ass with both hands, and convict him of some crime to keep him off our streets....let me remind you it is the same justice system that has clearly stated any soldier would be legally correct to kill him, and on the other hand says there is not enough evidence to convict him in a court.... there is a big gap here would you not say.... No, i'm not royalty, nor a demi god, nor am i asking you to kiss my feet or my ass....all most soldiers want is alittle respect , be it on NOV 11 , or a hand shake maybe even a thanks ....i mean even i give out a thanks to all that make my life a little easier....As for having a job like most Canadians , your right i do have a good job and it pays well, much like most canadians, but then again few have a job which requires they put thier lives on the line every day....most Canadian do not have to sign an unlimited liability contract...a contract that states i might have to give my life for my country upon recieving an order, a contract that may see me taker a life upon recieving an order.... As for the SO what....well you've said it all above Soldiers have faught and died for those very freedoms you enjoy today....that same fight todays soldiers are fighting to give the Afghan people today....i think down deep, you know it's it's a big gift, and it's a big deal. The disbandment of the CAR is nothing the miltary takes pride in, nor is it something you should....it would be like tearing down toronto because of a few criminals, and gangs....The CAR regt had a history that dated back to WWII, it's that reputation and all those that where part of that now have been tarnished because of a few individuals....and i know that means squat to you....but to those in the military it means everything....as it means that all there sacrafice blood, sweat , and tears could be erased by the actions of a few some time in the future....in this case those actions of of those that took place during the Normandy landings, and the other countless Airbourne landings thru out WWII, until the present ....is all given a black eye....it's colors now retired, placed in some warehouse, it's traditions forgotten, it's vets remembered not for playing a part in earning our freedoms and rights but rather for a small incident in Somolia some forgotten African country most Canadians could'nt find on a map.... no not a day to rejoice but a day of mourning....all done to score some political pionts.... . I really hope young Mr Khadr lives a long and productive live here in Canada, or what ever country he decides to go to....but if he does decide to exact his revenge as his brother puts it....i hope you can look his victims in the face and explain to them that our need to keep a clear state of mind, to enforce our rights and freedoms trumped they're lives and safety.... Because your version of rights and freedoms differ a bit....from mine here in Canada includes going down to the local store without fear of getting blown up...that some whacko will not use his child to strap explosives to make some political statement or plant IEDs on the side of the road....that they (the terrorist) deserve the right to force there way of life on whom every they wish....sorry thats not freedom....thats living in terror....and current our rights and freedoms are protecting just that, a terrorist....and if need be they (our laws) should be tweaked to stand up to these scumbags....

Thats an interesting twist, dont you think....Using the deaths of dead soldiers who paid the ultimate price fighting for and establishing our current rights and freedoms....but it brings up one question, do you think that they had Mr Khadrs rights in mind when they where orginally written. Do you think they would approve, of us now twisting those very rights to protect a terrorist, allowing him to walk free in the very nation him and his family hate ...the very nation those very same soldiers help build and protect.... I can see your respect for the military runs deep even after you've stated some of your family is still serving....in high ranking postions....in spite of that you print this shit....That Regiment you talk of is the Canadian Airbourne Regiment Disbanded because of a few individuals broke the faith....and for that over 700 soldiers paid the price , along with one of our nations finest combat units disgraced and disbanded....That political decission along with many others set our military back to it's present state now... I think we all see the writting on the wall, if we grant or exericise those rights granted to every Canadain and bring young Khadr back to Canada, he will be set free....Because of lack of evidence or how some of it was gathered....it does not mean he is innocent like the famous OJ Simpson....but at the cost of ensuring everyone's right and freedoms this kid will be free to roam our streets, waiting to exact his revenge....i hope those thatbecome his next victims agree with what you advocate..... The needs of the many out wieghs the needs of the few....

I'am no liberal, but i think he hit the nail exactly on the head with that statement which still rings true today....

Is it just me or does anyone else see alittle contradiction here...Topaz are you not one of those that are advocating to bring young Mr Khadr back into the country..."you know an already proven terrorist of sorts"....but your again'st bringing someone back from afghanistan that has helped out our Mission by risking thier lives for our soldiers....because they might become a terrorist.....

I think we all agree that we are at war with terrorism, and our nation is currently carring out it's duty in regards to our NATO, and other defense related agreements in Afghanistan....If we agree to this, then you can clearly see that there is a divide within Canada and it's people in supporting both our soldiers and the mission.... Without both you are wasting our lifes and resources for nothing regardless how noble a cause it is.....as we can not win anything without a clear majority of support for both .... Many people have stated they support one but not the other....and yet they have forgot just how our country works...how politicians think, and what is the end state for them....which is getting re elected regardless of cost and policy.... So when the polls continuely state that the majority of Canadians do not support this mission then "they" the politicians are not going to go again'st the grain, be it get the funding needed to win this thing, or get us the equipment and assets we need now.... with out this we the soldiers will continue to struggle to uphold our end, knowing in the end it will be for nothing...without the support we need.... I think your getting your facts mixed up, every NATO commander thats commanded the Afghan mission has stated sreveral things over and over, they need more troops....(part of the effort) , they need more funding (part of the money) they need more equipment again part of both effort and money....so while we can say there is alot there needs to be alot more... Yes , lets bring that up again, the Soviets could not do it....so our mission is impossiable...yes the 10 ft tall Soviet soldier who's very smile brought death to all that observed it.... Fact is the soviets dotrine is not flexiable enough to fight terrorism....there is no room for independant thought by any of the chain of command, they where using cold war tactics such as division size attacks , wiping out entire villages , towns , cities.....anyone who has study or for that matter read anything about the Soviet experiance in Afghan will see why they did not win in the first few pages.... Afghan is not a mission impossiable....thats a media myth supported by those that do not want us in Afghan....everyone of our soldiers does not think we may win....but knows we will win if everyone does ther're part....that includes those at home....I know our soldiers are doing there part....Canadians need to get off thier asses and do thier part....support us and the mission or bring us the f### home.... until they do something / anything perhaps they can stop whinning and complaining..... No, our progress is interputated by the media, all Canadians do is reguratated the media shit....and take it as gosple...and close out any other sources....Aug was not the worst month, I'm sorry Operation mudusa was the worst month not only for Canada but for NATO as well...how soon we forget....But hey splash it in the media and poof it's fact.... The Taliban do not maintain any hold in the south, another media myth, while it is true they do operate there, NATO has control, of a large majority of the south, and with more US troops pouring in the Taliban so called control is fading very quickly.....As for gaining ground around the capital BS.....there is enough NATO troops in Kabul to start another small war....while the Taaliban may operate in Kabul they do not control anything .... There is no exit strategy, because there is none, we are not going any where soon....despite what any politician says....we may be re roled slightly....but Canadian soldiers will always be in the fight......the only way we will withdrawal is if the NDP get voted in....and thats very unlikely....

How is this death any different than any of the others....some said the same thing when the first Female Soldier died in combat...each and every death is a blow to moral, and each and every time we have bounced back. As far as not winning....each day that goes by that the taliban is not in power is a win....for the Afghan people and for us....not winning my ass.... So was vimy ridge, ortona, Juno Beach....almost a no win situation...good thing we did't throw in the towel back then.... Those bodies that continue to pile up (your words) are our nations soldiers....those same soldiers that volunteered to go over, those same soldiers are among the few Canadains that believe in this mission, those same soldiers that have the courage to risk everything including thier lives for this mission....perhaps it's time that the rest of Canada show the same courage and support this mission so we can get it over and done with.....

Sure it is if your flushed with cash....which we are not....I think the Airforce guys figured out the plane would not fit in current hangers built for the C-130's .....however there is more to DND than trenton and other infra structure took priority....I don't think they sit long enough to gather snow and ice, regardless aircraft and equipment are not always sheltered.... Actually if you read up on the contracts you'll find we did purchase or lease new Leo A6 tanks off the Germans, then purchased used dutch leo's because at the time they where much cheaper than buying new, plus they where available sooner.... As for the Chinooks, there is several contracts regarding helo's one for renting Hips off a civilian contractor....to allow our forces limited resupply helo's ....then there is a purchase of 6 Chinnoks d models to act as a stop gap measure for afghan....then there is a contract for now 15 new f models once they are produced with the first ones in sewrvice around 2012 or 2013....but hey nice try.... OK worn out seems like a good excuse to purchase more....it is still a reason to buy is it not....if you had looked at the report dated in 2000 you'll see the liberals also had plenty of reasons to buy equipment.... No check the contracting sight once again you'll find the requirement is still for 4 resupply ships what has been canceled is a mulit purpose re supply ship/ troop carrier... WOW had to reach back over 20 years for that one....i thought we where talking about just the last 4...considering we were flying F-104 , and f-105 aircraft at the time....shit even the 1 st generation Warsaw pact stuff was better.... Was a DND funded research project, and due to lack of funds took over 10 years to implement , in fact they are still ongoing .... once again your reaching way back on this one....considering at the time our Fn's where built in the 50's and 60's and NATO had long since adapted the 5.56 mm round as the standard.... Lav III is a nice veh , but not enough where purchased to cover all the regts in Canada.... now your really reaching even the youngest in the class must be 15 years or older.... , What coastal patrol boats....you mean those mine sweepers.... which we still don't have ? Nice helo, And the total for all those projects still does not come up to 38 bil....not even close....thats 38 bil over what 4 years....and all your projects are over what...20 years... . We have a very small army, that can not deploy any where with out lots of help....even if we had everyone in one spot... Which is why i guess the members of our armed forces remember the liberal days of power as the dark years....not because we are allowed to wear sunglasses but rather on how tight the liberals where in regards to our nations defense..... How about you keep your liberal projects to the last say 10 years that should be about fair....

Everone deals with taking a life differently, most vets lock it up, and bury it deep, remember it's not acceptable behavior on civie street, it goes again'st all or moral values....and although it was done in the name of Queen and Country, it's not something most people want to talk about, or understand....atleast not at a wine and cheese party....found out that the hard way....one of my wife friends asked me those same questions, i was just back from my third tour...see for me i live thru that every night, it's still very fresh and very vivid.....What i learned that night was know your audience and it's easier to not to talk at all...It upset the women i was talking to, it upset my wife....and it took along time to regain both thier trust....including my wife.... today even my wife does not talk about it, she does not want to know more, and when someone else asks her about she'll smile and say he's as normal as the day he left....want to get your friend to open up, get him alone with lots of booze.....but remember be careful what you wish for you might not like the answers to your questions....but also remember first and foremost he is a friend, as it will test your freindship.... Training and health services are getting better by the day, and for most cases you can turn off the switch that transforms you from a soldier to a civilian when you go home....but remember on this mission they are taking you out of a war zone, sleeping in Poo Dust covered with tics, and fleas, getting shot at , then the next day introducing you back into Society noraml life, drinking beers and girls in Bikinis.....nothing can prepare you for that....except time... I just want to explain something about my statement of firing a round off in anger....it's an army expression used to explain anytime we need to fire a round at the enemy.....it's always done in anger, much like a war face and growl....i hope i explained that right...That being said, i'm not going to say it does not happen.... The normal emotion for combat is fear....to much and the soldier freezes...to little and the soldier becomes careless.... right in the middle is where you want it....cautious but not to cautious.....the other is Anger....angry replaces fear....making a soldier do acts or actions without regard for his life, or those around him...dangerous emotion for combat... hope that gives you some more insight....

Major DND/CF Investments Date Location Summary of Announcement Amount June 25, 2006 CFB Halifax, NS Announced by MND and Min PWGSC: Three Joint Support Ships (supply ships), and in-service support. $2.9 billion June 26, 2006 CFB Valcartier, QC Announced by MND and Min PWGSC – 2,300 Medium-sized logistics trucks, and in-service support. $1.1 billion June 27, 2006 CFB Edmonton, AB Announced by MND, Min Public Safety and Min PWGSC 16 medium- to heavy-lift helicopters, and in-service support. $4.7 billion June 28, 2006 CFB Trenton, ON Announced by MND, Min PWGSC and Min Industry - four strategic and 17 tactical aircraft, and in-service support. $8.8 billion April 12, 2007 La Citadelle - Quebec City, QC Announced by MND and Min PWGSC – Purchase of up to 100 Leopard II Main Battle Tanks $650 million April 21, 2008 Halifax Shipyards, NS Victoria Ships Ltd., BC Announced by MND (East) and Min PWGSC (West) – Refit portion of the Halifax Class Modernization / Frigate Life Extension Project (HCM/FELEX). $900 million August 7, 2008 St Hubert, QC Announced by MND and Min PWGSC – Afghanistan Air Capabilities: six Chartered Helicopters (MI17s), six Chinook Ds, small UAV (Scan Eagle), and two-year tactical (Heron) UAV lease. $438 million January 9, 2009 CFB Valcartier, QC Announced by MND and Min PWGSC – Medium Support Vehicle System (MSVS): 1300 Military Commercial Off-the-shelf vehicles (MilCOTS) $274 million February 13, 2009 CAE Inc. HQ - Montreal, QC Announced by the Prime Minister and Min PWGSC – Operational Training System Provider: simulation training for the new CC-130J Hercules fleet $346 million March 9, 2009 NDHQ -Ottawa, ON Announced by MND and Min PWGSC – Two long-term support contracts for the Army’s Land Command Support System (LCSS) $525 million July 2, 2009 Montreal, QC Announced by MND and Min PWGSC - the awarding of a contract to Weir Canada Inc. for the operation of the Naval Engineering Test Establishment (NETE). $600 million May 7, 2007 News Release – 16 Enhanced Road Opening Capability (EROC) vehicles. $29.6 million May 10, 2007 News Release - 82 new Armoured Heavy Support Vehicle Systems (AHSVS) $87 million May 31, 2006 News Release – 25 additional RG31 Nyala Armoured Patrol Vehicles $31 million July 9, 2007 News Release – Purchase of six to eight Arctic Offshore Patrol Ships (AOPS) in support of Prime Minister’s Announcement Event $4.4 billion July 8, 2008 PWGSC News Release – LAV III Service and maintenance contract. $374 million September 5, 2008 PWGSC News Release – Combat Systems Integration and Command and Control System Portion of the HCM/FELEX project. $2.0 billion July 8, 2009 News Release - Current fleet of Light Armoured Vehicles (LAV) III will be upgraded and three new fleets of land combat vehicles will be acquired. $5.2 billion Total major investments announced to date: $34.68 Billion All done by the Cons and Mr Harpers Government... here is a report written in 2000 well into a liberal tour, it explains what the liberals knew about the condition of our military back then....if you could name the liberal projects that address some of these issues....perhaps even the total value of those projects. 2000 report. Infra structure projects are not very high on anyone's list....that being said one could hardly blame the government for DND's lack of planning.... Lets not forget who's mission this was, and how unprepared our military waqs to take on that task, so your comment about a bulk of the purchases being bought are for afghan really reflects on all levels and parties.... Acceptable standard is what can the Canadian tax payer afford or want.....it has nothing to do with NEEDS.... do we need the 3 rd largest navy in the world....NO, but we do need one that can defend our coast lines., and carry out of foreign policies.....and that requires more than a few ships we have now....even a die hard liberal can see that...So nobody is asking to keep up with the jones....just able to do the job assigned to them....

I don't think all that stimulas cash is even all spent yet, most of it should be still tied up in the procument process still....yes it's planned to be spent but is it spent yet i don't think so....which may give the cons an ace when annoucing the true figures at years end....

Not sure , i don't think it will be as aggressive as the liberals plan....besides i'm not convince this recession is over just yet, and i'm not convinced that an aggresive reduction plan is what we need now, lets finish off what we started...

No the Candian tax payer, paid 45 billion dollars of debt down, with major cuts to programs , and services..... Lets all not forget we spent most of the current harper debt to keep us out of the resession....a plan that all parties agreed to or had similar plans.... I for one am not ready for another liberal plan to reduce debt...

Nor will he under our current justice system.....

I find it hard to believe that both groups that are profit driven would spend hundreds of bils of dollars seeking revenge for a project that would not see that amount of profit.... does that make sense to "anyone" ....or do i need to adjust my tinfoil hat again....

I disagree i think it was that cold war struggle and all the meddling that went with that trying to secure NATO's key areas such as the middle east ....one of the cornerstones to ensuring europes safety...Had thier been no meddling i don't think the cold war would have played out the way it did , I think Russia would have had a stronger postion....maybe enough to sway it's decission to sieze europe....

Really, other than terrorism that is internal from some entity wanting it's freedom....what Terrorism is russia faced with that is orginated out of the middle east...

What your videos dont show: The actual taking of a life is the easy part , get into postion, run thru your internal check list, got cover, check, got a good sight picture, check, check freindly forces , check...control your breathing , check....wait for target to expose it self and then squezze the triger....release the triger hear the click, check to see if target is down....if not repeat, if so find another target repeat until someone yells area cleared.....training takes over and your on auto pilot.... nothing to it.... After the action is over and the area cleared there is lots of high fives, lots of did you see that guy go down, lots of cheering like 14 years do playing paint ball, or thier x box, and to an outsider it may even look like a cruel ritual .... What your videos don't show or what our training does not cover is well after the moment when were back in the lav or helo, those same soldiers are now alone thinking to themselfs on the long trip home or base camp......coming to grips with taking a human life....in most cases young men such as your self, whom had wifes or girlfreinds, mothers and fathers....all now preparing to bury thier son, or sons.... And you pulled the trigger....you took that life....Ya i know it's what i get paid for....we are at war, it is what soldiers do.....it is what my country wants me to do....ya da ya da ....for most soldiers they will play that engagement out in thier minds most nights while sleeping , over and over, we will see those faces over and over again....and for most they will either make friends with those images and file them away deep in the back of thier minds during the day.....and carry on with soldiering.... those that can not come to grips with it , it will consume them, until they can no longer soldier....to some it's called PTSD....And as a soldier the next morning your expected to do it all over again.... I did'nt post this to prove anyones statements right or wrong , or change your postion on the war........i posted it to give everyone a glimspe into what it is like to be on the battle field, and squezze a round off in anger....and what it's consquences are when you do... it's not glorious , or cool it justs need to be done....

For all the intervention that went on during the cold war i just curious to know why is it that the US is to blame for all the problems within the middle east ....i mean there was 2 sides was there not, Mother Russia had her paws over alot of middle eastern countries as well and yet you never see anyone burning any Russian flags or suicide bombing any Russian interests....or is it that we only pick on the guy on top, with all the cash....History has always had 2 sides of the story.....and thru out that period it had the red white and blue on one side and the Red Russian bear on the other....