maple_leafs182

I would say that is a fair statement.

They will just print money devaluing their currency. I guess it comes down to Keynesian verses Austrian economics. I don't believe that Keynesian method works, I can guarantee that it won't work in this recession. I think it is more important to look at what lead to the creation of the booms and resulting busts. Too bad many people on this forum only blame the private sector but don't look at the nearly free money being a major factor causing many financial corporations becoming over leveraged. Probably not very much.

I disagree with you but why do you say so? SS has trillions in unfunded liabilities, where is the money going to come from to pay for SS? I disagree with you again, why should the government spend in a depression? It is the inflation associated with the debts that steals the wealth from the middle class and transfers it to the rich. Look at all the money that was given to the big banks and corporations, where did those dollars get there value from, those dollars took the purchasing power away from the other dollars in existence. The purchasing power of the dollars the people had, their wealth, it was stolen and given to the corporations. The people then suffer more when they have to pay higher prices at the store as a result of the currency being devalued. The people who benefit are the people who own the corporations...the rich.

The poor choice to opt out of SS? Why must governments borrow money? Maybe in time of war but that is it...and when I say war I mean when there is an actual threat to the nation, not these wars where they go into foreign countries to over throw governments so they can take their oil. Also, fiat currencies haven't been serving us well, look at the States, they went from being one of the most egalitarian countries to having one of the largest wealth gaps between the rich and the poor in the world. That is because fiat currencies redistribute the wealth from the middle class and lower classes to the rich. You may not see it over here yet but wait till you see the inflation from all the cheap money flooding the system. Look at the inflation rates of places like Tunisia when the "pro democracy" movements started occurring, their inflation on food was some of the highest in the world, that is why the people were angry. This will all come here to Canada and America too, more so in the States I believe, these trillions of dollars that are being pumped into the economy will just make the cost of living sky rocket. Ron Paul has been warning about this for a long time and I don't think people are taking his warnings seriously.

Social security can't work in the long run, its a ponzi scheme. Ron Paul is asking to let people opt out of social security if they wish, what is wrong with that? But you dismissed or ignored what I was saying about fiat currencies. Do you have some of your savings in dollars?

I just want you guys to realize how much having fiat currencies is hurting us. I want you guys to realize that the monetary system we have inherited steals our wealth and gives it to the banks, corporations and governments. I don't know why you guys don't think this is important...this world boggles my mind.

The wealth of the middle and lower classes is being redistributed to the rich threw inflation. Inflation is the hidden tax on the people that nobody seems to talk about.

You are right. Economist aren't really economists...if you look at the definition of what it means to economize "To practice economy, as by avoiding waste or reducing expenditures". What we call economist today, all these economist know how to do is study monetary patterns, economist know nothing about how to try and reduce waste. If we want to have a sustainable economy which I think we should work towards, the solution isn't to simply lower the population as many people have suggested, what we need to do is have engineers and scientist at the forefront of the economic decisions we make as a community and the greater society. Right now we have politicians and businessmen at the forefront, they have no understanding of how to create a sustainable economy. We need a radical change in the way we think and our value system but I don't think people are ready to make that change, we are not educated enough about the state of our technology.

I get what your saying but if the government was on an actual gold standard and didn't cheat the system by printing too many dollars then this would of been adverted. I am starting to think a gold standard may not be the best idea...chances are governments would start lying again and print more certificates then the actual amount of gold they have in reserve. Eventually we would probably end up back to where we are now. Maybe we should just let the market decide what money is and not let the government have any say in it. Based on our history I would assume we would flock to gold and silver and use that as money.

Nope, that is not what I want.

It was the banks, rating agencies, the government and Federal Reserves fault for creating the bubble...the whole disaster could of been avoided if the US was on a gold standard...too bad people think that honest money is a bad idea.

Fiat currencies are hurting us the most, they turn the economy into a giant ponzi scheme. All the wealth is being redistributed to the top. How do you guys not see this? The belief that central banks and fiat currencies are necessary in a modern society to create stable and prosperous economy is a lie...I wish you guys could see this truth.

Can you Americans please stop complaining about Canadians talking about an the US politics while they are on a Canadian forum and in a sub forum labeled United States Politics. You guys keep saying "you don't know whats best for us" or "focus on your own government", those statements add nothing to the conversation.

Ron Paul is pretty awesome all around, best part is he speaks his mind. One area where I do not agree with him is on environmental issues, I don't like things like nuclear power plants. Most of the stuff he says is good though. When he says he is against gay marriage it is because he doesn't think the government should have a role in marriage. He doesn't think you should need to get a marriage licence issued by the government and that marriage should be left up to the church which clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women. As for abortion, in many cases the fetus does have rights, as a physician he was legally responsible for the life of the fetus...if you are in a car accident and you kill someones unborn baby then you will be charged, the fetus does have rights and he does not like it that people can choose when and when not the fetus has rights. That being said I still don't agree with him on this issue. To me it isn't even a big issue. As for you liberals who keep saying that him taking away the welfare programs would doom the country then you don't understand economics. These welfare programs which are suppose to stop people from falling threw the cracks only make the cracks bigger and allow more people to fall threw. they create a dependency on government and they are often paid with using debt which devalues the currency which ends up hurting everyone. And Ron Paul isn't for big corporations, he is against the corporatism that is occurring in the states, he understands that their fiat currency is the enabler to having these massive corporations which have monopolies in almost every sector.

These booms and busts are not natural to the economy, they are created by central banks. You should really look into Austrian economics and the business cycle. Do you think the problem was that there was not enough regulations, that the government wasn't involved enough in preventing the banks from being so reckless?

We are getting screwed, well the American people are getting screwed because of the actions the central bank are taking...I guess we are getting screed too because of the actions the BoC is taking. Printing currency doesn't create new wealth, it simply takes the value from the other dollars in existence...who holds the other dollars, it is the middle class, their wealth is being stolen and it is being transferred to the big corporations. All central banks can do is redistribute the wealth in society and they are taking the wealth from the middle class and give it to the rich.

What is your point? I understand what you are saying and that is why I advocate for a gold standard, the banks wouldn't be able to create so much debt that way. Also, American banks can lend at a 10:1 ratio, not 15:1 ratio, Canadian banks don't even have to have a reserve to create debt.

joeblack, you are right, millions would of suffered if they did nothing. The thing is they did nothing to solve the problem, they simply propped up a failed economy by throwing cheap money at it, all they are doing is delaying the inevitable. Millions if not billions will suffer when the economy crashes again, now this is all dragging out for a longer period of time then if they had just let the banks and corporations fail in the first place.

I'm not assuming, I am basing it off of monetary policy, silver and gold will go up.

Nicely written. That is the reason why many of these riots have started around the world. London, Greece, Egypt, Israel, you name it, these riots have started all around the world because the youth have realized that they are getting screwed over. I don't think the youth have quite figured that out yet here in Canada or in the US because things aren't that bad here yet.

People aren't buying bonds, why do you think there was QE1 and QE2, the banks used that money to buy US bonds. QE3 will be the same thing, the banks will use that money to buy US bonds. I think QE3 will be significantly larger then QE2. It just came out that the Fed gave 1.2 Trillion Dollars out in loans after the collapse. All that money was given out and it was all done in secrecy, what is to stop them from giving out more secret loans. I guess QE3 doesn't have to be that much bigger then QE2 if they just go out and give secret loans anyways. The economy is a ponzi scheme for the rich yet you guys keep defending it, why?

Ron Paul was right before, he was warning about the collapse of the housing market for years before it happened. I don't know why people continue to discredit him. This is a video or Ron Paul making predictions http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSEvrloBetw

Anyways, what Ron Paul is saying is that there is a bubble in the bonds market. He is saying that people won't continue to buy up US debt forever and when the bubble bursts the only one left to buy up the bonds will be the Fed and that will lead to the destruction of the currency.

Yes it would have been. Wait till the bubble bursts in the bond market and you will see the collapse of the dollar which will be far more devastating then letting some banks and big corporations fail.

So you are assuming that people will continue to buy its bonds forever