betsy

Ignore me. Pleeeeaaasssssse...I beg of you. I implore you. :lol:

It was Al Gore who found himself in the spotlight not too long ago....over an alleged incident that happened in 2006. http://nashvillecitypaper.com/content/city-news/oregon-masseuse-accuses-al-gore-sexual-assault Whether you are innocent or not will not matter in the end. Your name will get tarnished. So if you've got a reputation to protect, you've got to be more careful. The media will lap it up....sensationalism sells!

The bad guys can set you up. Much more easy if the massage girl is an accomplice. Gets you photographed in compromising situations. Then they shake you down. They either ask for money....or "favors." If you're a politician, those "favors" could be anything! http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop

As I've said. So, give me the meaning of "premature" allegation! That's two of you who've used that word....I never heard of that. So what does it means? In my view, this is not a sex scandal! I've explained my position...but I couldn't help the pun on the premature-thingy! Are you a priest? Are you in politics? Why of course! That's why you need to know the reputtation of the establishment or the person giving you the massage! What more when you're in politics! Who was that US politician (or was he a celebrity) just recently who got allegedly exposed by a massage-lady who met him at a hotel? I can't remember his name!

Please take note "criminal past." And please take note "may have been," it's still under investigations I assume? Therefore he is still deemed innocent -just like that bawdy house- until proven guilty! Bruce Carson is not working anymore with Harper, and it was the Conservative who forwarded this to the RCMP. However, we've yet to see how the NDP Party will handle this emerged scandal against Layton. Will they call for an inquiry just so to settle this issue once and for all?

It's the optics! Well, that's up to the political party if they want to run with a leader who can be torpedoed during election! I'm assuming that political parties will be more discerning on who they choose to run as their leader. It's hard to campaign on the issues of trust, sound decision/judgement, ethics, women's rights, crime, fighting organized crime, rape....when your hands are tied. But of course we'll never know at this point since he's already the leader.

Exactly! What more being married to an asian - he must know about asian culture. They live in Toronto, don't they? Assuming he doesn't know, well that only makes it worse! It means he's ignorant of pressing issues in his own community! So what's he doing in politics?

Yes. I was just explaining that so far this information about Jack being in the massage parlor is not an allegation. It's already established fact! What is "premature" allegation? What does that mean? You don't mean premature ejaculation? I can't help that....what with the wad of kleenex! Whether he's having sex or not, is not the point for me....that's what I mean by I don't care to know! That part of info is just the titilliating part of any sex scandal I guess - the sordid sleazy details - but as I said....it's not what concerns me about the whole thing. Look, if you're in political office, wouldn't you be more discreet....and cautious? He's naive in the sense that he didn't realize how easily he could've been victimized in blackmail scheme? With a reputation and political ambition, how many young politicians would rather go to the police to report blackmail....or would just rather be coersced into doing "favors" just so not be exposed? That's one way how crime organizations get some politicians under their thumb! That's one way how politicians get corrupted! Furthermore, how humiliating can it be to LECTURED by cops about the possibility of that? What, he never watched The Godfather? Goodfellas? Or Jackie Chan?

No, the article didn't state that he was having sex. The implication with the kleenex, that's just implied allegation. He didn't get charged with anything. How did this story in the news came out? Who originally leaked it? Was it the cop talking to the newspaper? I only found out about this right here on this forum....then just googled for more info.

Yep! I guess we're saturated with all these campaign slogans!

If they're serious about ever getting into power....why wouldn't they? You think they'll choose him as their leader if that came out then? He'll have that baggage...

If that story came out earlier, I don't think Layton would've become the Leader of the NDP. Now it's been dugged up. Look what else got dugged up concerning other leaders. That's politics nowadays. It's hard for any politicians now when their every move....including stupid online post made when they were still teeners.... could be used against them. It's been done to Harper, and being done as to his past comments when he was a young man.

I don't know how this story came out exactly, but obviously the newspaper got it from the horse's mouth! The cop who talked to Layton! Why did it come out just now? Who knows maybe one of those people who worked in the Police Department at the time felt compelled to bring this out now ....because they too got scared of an NDP-led government! Read the article. http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop

You go ahead and concentrate on the other fodder. I've got something to say and I'm gonna say it! After all, this isn't China...yet. I don't think this is "premature" allegation - whatever that means! Olivia Chow confirmed that she knew about this appointment! So that places Jack on the scene, as admitted by his wife! As to the real nature of his visit to the establishment....that's another story. And I don't care to know whether it's for sex or just pure massage. My problem is about the naivete' and stupidity in judgement that a councillor exercised in going to this place. You want a message or sex, go for it....just don't place yourself - and your office - in jeopardy!

The aricle indicated that the cops were looking for UNDERAGED prostitutes in that establishment! That implies that the bawdy house may not just be a common bawdy house but may be dealing with far more sinister operations such as slave trade or human trafficking! Organized crime syndicate may ve been involved....and as the cops pointed out to jack, he may've placed himself as a target for black-mail! Imagine the cops...LECTURING this councillor...to possibility that he could've placed himself -and his office for that matter - to blackmail scenario! Careless. Reckless. Keep in mind that he was already in politics at the time - a councillor - and married to an asian - which means he shouldn't have been that naive! Carelessness. Recklessness. That puts a question as to his skills at decision-making, especially when the possibility is real that he could be the next Prime Minister! The prostitute (?) was allegedly UNDERAGED at the time.

How is it inappropriate? Instead of just giving emotional outburst, you ought to explain! Never mind my Christian values or my faith....I don't think you're in a position to know much about that. Let me worry about that, after all it's me who'll answer to my God when the time comes, not you. Just stick to the discussion. We're on federal politics.

I find this very much relevant! After all, weren't the Opposition - and that very much include Jack - talking about TRUST when they brought down the government and thrusted us into another election? Isn't this election all about TRUST? Who can you trust? If Layton was stupid enough - and yes we can say it was stupid - to have placed himself in that awkward situation, being a councillor at the time, of course that's a question of his ability to exercise sound judgement especially if you are the leader of a nation....in a time of economic recovery? If Layton is - at the very least - naive about bawdy houses that pose as massage parlors...how can we trust he knows what he talks about when it comes to crime issues??? Who among the leaders was admonishing you gotta "walk the talk?" (I can't remember who....but that's a pie on Layton's face!) What, are you saying there aren't enough threads that address those issues??? That's what makes it worrisome that nobody gives a damn about the deeper implications of Jack's past reckless decision. If the cops decided then to go public to hurt Jack....I don't think there would've been a Layton at all on the NDP helm.

Well then, it seems you are being obtuse and don't want to engage in a real discussion. Bye.

Scribblett raised this important point which I think should be added here. Yes, what about women's right? If there is no demand, there wouldn't be any need for supply! If no customers, no victims! I'm not saying Jack knew about the reputation of this particular place, that it's being investigated for alleged underaged asian hookers....but being in politics (especially one who knows and understands the asian culture far more than any ordinary Canadians), he should've been more careful. 1996 was not that too long ago. He would've been still an adult then, and not some naive young lad out for an adventure. That was lack of better judgement.

You've raised a very important point. I'll help myself and quote you in the new thread.....

I don't think it's my business if a politician wants to have massage, whether he prefers to be naked or not when he has it...that's personal. That's not the problem for me. Detailed report... http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop My problem is about the reputation of the place. And this word: underage. I've got a lot of questions for Jack. Don't you know - even then - that a lot of Asian girls were/are being lured or forced into the sex trade? Didn't you know about the Triad - especially being married to an asian woman? The asian crime organizations that's been plaguing the west and victimizing Chinese immigrants with extortions? Granted that you are innocent of any wrong-doings, how can you place yourself in such a situation considering that you're already in politics then? As what the cop explained to you, you put yourself in a possible black-mail scenario. Couldn't you have been more discreet and cautious than that?

It's not his nakedness that's problematic about this. It's the reputation of the place where he was found.

If Jack becomes Prime Minister, this scandal will resonate all over the world. Berlusconi debauchery allegations (hving sex with a minor) will compare with this bawdy house that's been allegedly involved in sex trafficking of minor girls!

When will I see an ad of a naked Layton? Transparency and Openess of government...nothing to hide! Literally.

Your posts doesn't make any sense. They are mish-mash reasonings/interpretations, at least that's how they seem to me. I want to understand where you're coming from.... Do you consider yourself a Christian? If not, what do you believe?