Vatican Calls on Catholics to Stop Funding

[cybercoma]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,2102583,00.html

A senior Vatican cardinal said yesterday that Catholics should stop donating to human rights group Amnesty International because of its new policy advocating abortion rights for women if they had been raped, were a victim of incest or faced health risks.[

[snip]

Amnesty changed its neutral stance on abortion in April, but its Italy chairman Paolo Pobbiati insisted its new position had been misinterpreted by the cardinal.

[snip]

"It was partly inspired by our experience in Africa where soldiers rape women in communities they attack to force them to have their children. We also believe women who have had abortions should benefit from medical care regardless of the reason for the abortion. Moreover we aim to promote education and contraception to reduce abortion rates."

[snip]

"The Church teaches that it is never justifiable to kill an innocent life. Abortion is murder," [Cardinal Martino] said. "To selectively justify abortion, even in the cases of rape, is to define the innocent child within the womb as an enemy, a 'thing' that must be destroyed. How can we say that killing a child in some cases is good and in other cases it is evil?"

Well, the Catholic Church is choosing to punish a human rights organization, while offering no solutions of its own to the problem at hand. Surely there must be some people that are disgusted that the Catholic Church goes tax free, while systemically turning a blind eye to the plight of women in Africa.

[Riverwind]

A senior Vatican cardinal said yesterday that Catholics should stop donating to human rights group Amnesty International

I don't give money to Amnesty International because I constantly hear the group advocating things that I disagree with. In my case, I tend to disgree with the group's tendency to turn everything into a 'human right'.

I dislike the Catholic Church policy on abortion but I have to defend their right to deny funding to a private charity for any reason.

[BC_chick]

I wish the Catholic Church cared as much about the little alter-boys.

[geoffrey]

I wish the Catholic Church cared as much about the little alter-boys.

Oh please.

[ScottSA]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,2102583,00.html

A senior Vatican cardinal said yesterday that Catholics should stop donating to human rights group Amnesty International because of its new policy advocating abortion rights for women if they had been raped, were a victim of incest or faced health risks.[

[snip]

Amnesty changed its neutral stance on abortion in April, but its Italy chairman Paolo Pobbiati insisted its new position had been misinterpreted by the cardinal.

[snip]

"It was partly inspired by our experience in Africa where soldiers rape women in communities they attack to force them to have their children. We also believe women who have had abortions should benefit from medical care regardless of the reason for the abortion. Moreover we aim to promote education and contraception to reduce abortion rates."

[snip]

"The Church teaches that it is never justifiable to kill an innocent life. Abortion is murder," [Cardinal Martino] said. "To selectively justify abortion, even in the cases of rape, is to define the innocent child within the womb as an enemy, a 'thing' that must be destroyed. How can we say that killing a child in some cases is good and in other cases it is evil?"

Well, the Catholic Church is choosing to punish a human rights organization, while offering no solutions of its own to the problem at hand. Surely there must be some people that are disgusted that the Catholic Church goes tax free, while systemically turning a blind eye to the plight of women in Africa.

What rot. They are hardly turning a blind eye to the "plight of women in Africa". It's just that they're not turning a blind eye to the plight of the unborn.

[BC_chick]

I wish the Catholic Church cared as much about the little alter-boys.

Oh please.

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

[bush_cheney2004]

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

Really? The record speaks otherwise:

VATICAN CITY (CNN) -- Pope John Paul II has acknowledged mistakes in the handling of the U.S. priest sexual abuse scandal plaguing the Roman Catholic Church.

"The abuse which has caused this crisis is by every standard wrong and rightly considered a crime by society; it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God." — Pope John Paul II

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/...ndal/index.html

[geoffrey]

I wish the Catholic Church cared as much about the little alter-boys.

Oh please.

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

You obviously don't listen to the Pope much if that's the all the message you hear.

The scandals are as apart of the religion as self-detonation is of Islam. These people are obivously looked down upon by the Church and are a few bad apples (it's not as widespread as you think, there is alot of priests and even more Catholics).

[jazzer]

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

Really? The record speaks otherwise:

VATICAN CITY (CNN) -- Pope John Paul II has acknowledged mistakes in the handling of the U.S. priest sexual abuse scandal plaguing the Roman Catholic Church.

"The abuse which has caused this crisis is by every standard wrong and rightly considered a crime by society; it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God." — Pope John Paul II

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/...ndal/index.html

The pontiff was addressing American bishops. Where is the apology for sexual abuse by priests worldwide?

[ScottSA]

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

Really? The record speaks otherwise:

VATICAN CITY (CNN) -- Pope John Paul II has acknowledged mistakes in the handling of the U.S. priest sexual abuse scandal plaguing the Roman Catholic Church.

"The abuse which has caused this crisis is by every standard wrong and rightly considered a crime by society; it is also an appalling sin in the eyes of God." — Pope John Paul II

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/...ndal/index.html

The pontiff was addressing American bishops. Where is the apology for sexual abuse by priests worldwide?

Where are the apologies for the rampant beheadings and violence in just about every country in Asia from Islam? Let's see...sexual abuse or having one's head sawn off with a paring knife...I wonder which is worse? Hmmmm....

[Peter F]

Where are the apologies for the rampant beheadings and violence in just about every country in Asia from Islam? Let's see...sexual abuse or having one's head sawn off with a paring knife...I wonder which is worse? Hmmmm....

After spending so much effort to show the Western-Christian moral superiority to Islam you prefer to emulate your perception of islam. Since they don't apologize for chopping heads there is no need for us to apologize for raping children.

But then what would anyone expect from a sheep-shagger.

[cybercoma]

Where are the apologies for the rampant beheadings and violence in just about every country in Asia from Islam? Let's see...sexual abuse or having one's head sawn off with a paring knife...I wonder which is worse? Hmmmm....

What does it matter which is worse? Yes, Islam is worse, likely because the people are far less educated than those in predominantly Christian nations. Blowing yourself up and beheading innocent civilians is horrible.

But, you know what? So is molesting children. And it's appalling that you would justify child-molesters by saying, "at least they're not beheading people."

It is possible to find both morally reprehensible. Unless of course you're religious and aren't supposed to question your 'faith' and find everyone else's beliefs wrong and find yours to be morally superior.

[sharkman]

The point is the church has been doing something about it. And the admission by John Paul did more than just apologize, it started a change.

Edit: Funny how any thread with the Catholic church usually ends up with some flippant remark using the child molestations to score cheap points.

[Remiel]

Where are the apologies for the rampant beheadings and violence in just about every country in Asia from Islam? Let's see...sexual abuse or having one's head sawn off with a paring knife...I wonder which is worse? Hmmmm....

Asking any one Muslim leader to apologize for all Muslims is like asking a Lutheran or Anglican or Presbyterian to apologize for all Protestants. There is no equivalent to the Pope.

[Renegade]

Well, the Catholic Church is choosing to punish a human rights organization, while offering no solutions of its own to the problem at hand. Surely there must be some people that are disgusted that the Catholic Church goes tax free, while systemically turning a blind eye to the plight of women in Africa.

The Catholic Church, (or any religious organization for that matter) has the absolute right to advise its members on where or where not to donate.

However, I don't beleive that any religious group should be stage-subsidized through tax-exempt status.

[jazzer]

deleted

[jazzer]

deleted

[ScottSA]

Where are the apologies for the rampant beheadings and violence in just about every country in Asia from Islam? Let's see...sexual abuse or having one's head sawn off with a paring knife...I wonder which is worse? Hmmmm....

Asking any one Muslim leader to apologize for all Muslims is like asking a Lutheran or Anglican or Presbyterian to apologize for all Protestants. There is no equivalent to the Pope.

No there isn't. Yet lets imagine for a moment that the escapist fantasy that the terrorists are "a small minority" and that the "vast majority" of Muslims are "peaceloving, yada yada..." is true. That assumes that a small isolated sect within Islam is perpetrating all the hullaballoo all over the globe, and that every other Muslim is standing aghast at the violence. Now lets switch it around and imagine that it were a small protestant or Catholic Christian sect doing this. Would there be a deafening silence from mainstream Christianity?

I daresay not. So where are the apologies from Islam?

[kuzadd]

ah, the catholic church....my religion.

born and raised.

The catholic church has done zip, wrt child molestations, except cover-up.

A little lip-service here and there, make a little noise, but, really nothing.

As for women's rights, again, the church fails.

There is nothing new under the sun.

The catholic church is a patriarchal church, touting a patriarchal hierarchy.

Men first and always.

The church doesn't care one whit, about the kids, or women.

In a May 25 letter to supporters of Catholics Against Capital Punishment, Larry Cox, executive director of Amnesty International USA, said that "in the context of war, rape has been used as a brutal instrument of domination. It is committed with the deliberate intention of causing pregnancy, thereby destroying community and family bonds through the pernicious influences of humiliation and shame."

now why would the catholic church wish to support, rape with deliberate intent of impregnation, as a means of a woman being dominated/subjugated, by a male?

[cybercoma]

thank you kuzadd for getting this back on track.

[Mad_Michael]

I wish the Catholic Church cared as much about the little alter-boys.

Oh please.

It's true, all I hear from the Pope is birth-control, chastity and abortion. Not once has the Catholic Church acknowledged the scandals that plague that denomination.

That is because actual scandals don't actually plague that denomination.

A few isolated cases of priests abusing minors have been identified and addressed. The Catholic Church has publicly taken responsibility in those cases and paid enormous settlements and whatnot.

However, statistically speaking, the Catholic Priesthood in North America has a statistically lower rate of sexual offences than would be considered 'statistically average'. Ergo, there is not a significant actual problem here.

As it stands, your own child is ten times more likely to be abused by your husband, brother or father than any Catholic Priest.

[jazzer]

.

A few isolated cases of priests abusing minors have been identified and addressed. The Catholic Church has publicly taken responsibility in those cases and paid enormous settlements and whatnot.

How do you know? As far as public responsiblity the church seems to be lacking there. How many bishops have openly addressed the diocese and publicly apologised for the specific conduct of individual priests? Much of the cases that settle out of court have been sealed permanently regarding specific details of the case (i.e.,settlement amounts, arbitration transcripts etc.) requiring a confidential agreement not to release informtion on threat of lawsuit. I know because my wife signed one. And her lawyer indicated that the Church intimidates most claiments to settle for very little after using various stall techniques. My wife's case took 11 years. The church obstructed justice 94 times in that period. That record was swept under the rug after my wife agreed to settle for an undisclosed amount. At any rate, there are tons of unsettled claims still in litigation. But the church has made sure very few know about them.

[jazzer]

The point is the church has been doing something about it. And the admission by John Paul did more than just apologize, it started a change.

Edit: Funny how any thread with the Catholic church usually ends up with some flippant remark using the child molestations to score cheap points.

What has the church been doing about it, specifically in Canada? What change are you talking about? I find your post flippant to say the least.

[ScottSA]

.

A few isolated cases of priests abusing minors have been identified and addressed. The Catholic Church has publicly taken responsibility in those cases and paid enormous settlements and whatnot.

How do you know? As far as public responsiblity the church seems to be lacking there. How many bishops have openly addressed the diocese and publicly apologised for the specific conduct of individual priests?

What you really mean is why hasn't the Church donned sack cloth and ashes and flagellated itself through the streets on its knees while passing cash out hand over fist. Meanwhile, out there in burning car land, Islam has yet to utter a mere squeak of apology over the sawing off of numerous heads in numerous countries all over the globe. Yes, I know, it has no pope or bishops, so it's not fair to expect anything of the sort from Islam. Besides, its Mullahs are far too busy waving swords and calling for more heads...preferably ones formerly attached to the shoulders of pigs and apes from the Zionist entity.

[jazzer]

.

A few isolated cases of priests abusing minors have been identified and addressed. The Catholic Church has publicly taken responsibility in those cases and paid enormous settlements and whatnot.

How do you know? As far as public responsiblity the church seems to be lacking there. How many bishops have openly addressed the diocese and publicly apologised for the specific conduct of individual priests?

What you really mean is why hasn't the Church donned sack cloth and ashes and flagellated itself through the streets on its knees while passing cash out hand over fist. Meanwhile, out there in burning car land, Islam has yet to utter a mere squeak of apology over the sawing off of numerous heads in numerous countries all over the globe. Yes, I know, it has no pope or bishops, so it's not fair to expect anything of the sort from Islam. Besides, its Mullahs are far too busy waving swords and calling for more heads...preferably ones formerly attached to the shoulders of pigs and apes from the Zionist entity.

I think you and geoff are quite confused. You've dragged Islam into this thread to serve some purpose known only to yourselves. Since you obviously know nothing of which I speak, I suggest you find another topic to hijack.