building Chinese cars here in Canada....

[John Johnston]

9 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

As I say, talk to anyone with real expertise in a particular area, eg, scientists, engineers, classical musicians. They are going to tell you the same story: China is where it’s at. I’m afraid that’s how things are. 

Yup. 

China leads the US in the research of 37 out of 44 critical technologies, claims think tank

China has a "stunning lead" over the US. 

And we better get off our asses here in Canada as well. 

[CdnFox]

6 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

But that’s a huge deal.

Well, if you mean being able to take something existing and mass produce it is a 'huge deal' in the sense of it being an important factor in our supply chain or being 'industrially disruptive' globally or the like then sure. 

If you mean it's a big deal innovation wise then good lord no   Paying people like crap, having near slave labour in many cases and having gov't subsidies requires very little brain power 

6 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

What matters is what China can do now with drones and similar technology and what they will be able to do in coming decades.

They can't do anymore than anyone else can. In fact arguably they can do less.

The thing is, drones and their use plate relatively well to defensive uses. However their offensive capabilities are somewhat limited. And by defense I mean they're great at blunting an attack and denying the enemy the ability to control the conflict in and around the battle line.

But they haven't given the ukrainians the ability to go over to the offensive, have they. Other than localized counter-attacks and the like. There's no danger of Ukraine marching on Moscow anytime soon. The drones have played a harassing role strategically causing some damage for the Russians but it's pretty minimal.

China's not worried about defense. And if china wants to attack another neighboring nation such as Taiwan drone technology is going to work against them rather than for them.

 

Quote

Britain pioneered the Industrial Revolution but was overtaken by other countries who copied its innovations.

No, that would not be an accurate statement. Britain did indeed Pioneer the Industrial Revolution but nobody copied their innovations. Or at least to be more accurate that's not where they fell behind. It would be well over a hundred years later and other countries have their own industries at that point and develop their own Technologies. But really it was capacity more than anything, written fell behind places like America because America became larger and during world war II really leaned into its industrial base

So no it wasn't anything to do with copying

There may come a day in the future when china becomes a world leader in technology and innovation. But that day is not today and it's not going to be tomorrow.

[Moonlight Graham]

You'd have to kill me before I buy a Chinese car.

21 hours ago, John Johnston said:

Yup. 

China leads the US in the research of 37 out of 44 critical technologies, claims think tank

China has a "stunning lead" over the US. 

And we better get off our asses here in Canada as well. 

China stole the vast majority of it.

[eyeball]

6 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

China stole the vast majority of it.

Bullshit, the West's manufacturing sector was handed to them on a silver platter, by companies who complained that western workers wouldn't work as hard, and always felt entitled to higher wages and more benefits.

Sycophants cheered at the thought of sticking it to unions as governments told us to make the switch to the service economy...polishing one another's shoes basically.

I remember local protests against the log barges hauling 500 logging trucks worth of wood off to Asia mills every month or so.

 

[Moonlight Graham]

12 hours ago, eyeball said:

Bullshit, the West's manufacturing sector was handed to them on a silver platter, by companies who complained that western workers wouldn't work as hard, and always felt entitled to higher wages and more benefits.

Sycophants cheered at the thought of sticking it to unions as governments told us to make the switch to the service economy...polishing one another's shoes basically.

I remember local protests against the log barges hauling 500 logging trucks worth of wood off to Asia mills every month or so.

China steals research and IP from everyone.  It's rampant and it isn't a secret and has been going on for many decades.

Name one piece of technology China has ever invented on its own in the last 40 years.  I'll wait....

Go into any Chinese-owned store or a mall with goods from Chinese companies.  Or go on Temu or even Amazon.  It's all cheap counterfeit garbage.

Sorry bud you can call us naive but you can't lay all the blame on the West when thieves commit theft.  The thieves are still criminals and responsible for their crimes.

Edited June 2 by Moonlight Graham

[Moonlight Graham]

Here's the Chinese business model for cheap EVs (and every other piece of tech):

Steal the tech via corporate espionage from companies from other countries who have invested in the R&D. Then undercut them on price and sell it cheaper because you didn't have to invest in the R&D (and your quality sucks).

[eyeball]

11 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Sorry bud you can call us naive but you can't lay all the blame on the West when thieves commit theft.  The thieves are still criminals and responsible for their crimes.

I can certainly blame the West for not doing anything about it.

LMAO!

It's been like listening to you people incessantly whine about the left for over 50 years while commies and Marxists moved into every level of government in the land without anyone firing a single shot in resistance.

[Moonlight Graham]

57 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I can certainly blame the West for not doing anything about it.

LMAO!

It's been like listening to you people incessantly whine about the left for over 50 years while commies and Marxists moved into every level of government in the land without anyone firing a single shot in resistance.

The West has been woefully weak in protecting themselves from Chinese information theft, that id agree.  But you seem to be intent and laying all the blame on the West.

You can keep your doors unlocked out of naivety but a burglar is still responsible for their crimes.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said:

But you seem to be intent and laying all the blame on the West.

That's right, we never should have been wheeling and dealing with China in the first place. We have no one to blame but ourselves for choosing too.

[herbie]

You can't lay all the blame on the West?

GM led the BEV in 1991 with the EV1 then scrapped it. It led the Hybrid with the Chevy Volt, did zero promotion and let that go.My cousin worked for Ballard as one of th4 first female engineers on fuel cells back when Flock of Seagulls was on the air every 40 minutes, Dodge, the eveeryman's car now only sells to macho jock that never grew up after High School.

"The West" ,less so Europe spent over a decade with their thumbs up their ass and watched any leadership and sales go in the tank. Only tool things to heart when the govt kicked in huge rebates and quickly reverted to their old ways went they were ended.
It took another oil crisis to revive interest in electrified cars.

Like I said years ago, the sheer greed of the big car makers and the oil companies do more for EVs than any incentive. And the hypocrisy of those condemning Chinese incentives to manufacturers while handing subsidies to consumers and pretending the money doesn't really end up with the car maker.

[herbie]

PS

Don't you hate it when you write a long reply, click submit and end up with that Gateway TimeOut error?

[CdnFox]

7 hours ago, eyeball said:

I can certainly blame the West for not doing anything about it.

No you can't. The consequences of taking action could have been far worse than the theft itself. That's a complicated issue.

Quote

LMAO!

We accept your admission of defeat  

[eyeball]

42 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

No you can't. The consequences of taking action could have been far worse than the theft itself. That's a complicated issue.

It's real simple, no truck nor trade.

42 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

We accept your admission of defeat  

You and your appliances have come to terms?

$10 sez they're from China.

Edited June 2 by eyeball

[Moonlight Graham]

5 hours ago, eyeball said:

That's right, we never should have been wheeling and dealing with China in the first place. We have no one to blame but ourselves for choosing too.

We should have ended a lot of trade relations with them decades ago and banned any of their citizens and state officials from our country given that any person from there can be extorted to do their government's bidding.

[eyeball]

22 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

We should have ended a lot of trade relations with them decades ago and banned any of their citizens and state officials from our country given that any person from there can be extorted to do their government's bidding.

We certainly should have left the door open but just with a couple of Prime Caveats that should be a paramount feature of any trade we engage in or allow.

Of course since then the number of human beings living under the thumbs of dictators and autocratic governments has grown to some 70% or more.

That's a real cost that is due to the sloppy morals and ethics of countries like ours who've chosen to turn a blind eye to things.

 

Edited June 3 by eyeball

[CdnFox]

14 hours ago, eyeball said:

It's real simple, no truck nor trade.

Simple as one word for it. Stupid and juvenile would be another couple. But then again you're a simple kind of guy

14 hours ago, eyeball said:

You and your appliances have come to terms?

Yes, me and my appliances both accept your admission of defeat 😆😆🙄🙄🙄