Japan 1945? Avoiding a Iran Ground War: Drop the bomb

[John Johnston]

7 hours ago, John Johnston said:

It is about to get much worse I'm afraid. The two top people, Trump and Hegseth are absolute and complete Id*iots with massive amounts of power. One is senile the other is a Child. And one does not cancel the other. 

And they are interchangeable. Just like toy Transformers. 😄

[August1991]

14 hours ago, Barquentine said:

No, it doesn't. London, Dresden, Ukraine, now Iran. In fact it can have the opposite effect. And even if it did, bombing civilians is a war crime. Nothing short of murder.

Dresden?

Uh, Hiroshima?

=====

Disagree. Air power can change regimes. 

[Barquentine]

23 hours ago, John Stone said:

re: 'The Roman Empire was way more successful based on inflation of money, technology, etc"

I didn't realize the Romans walked on the moon, developed  nuke energy and buffalo wings .............. nod to pizza. 

The Roman Empire was colonial .........but certainly not Global  ......... the US is global largely due to grooming of their international military bases........... and by extension, their commerce. (weapons sales).

AI
The Roman Empire lasted for nearly 500 years in the West (27 BC – 476 AD) and over 1,400 years in the East (until 1453 AD). While often cited as ending in 476 AD, the empire continued as the Byzantine Empire in the east, lasting until Constantinople fell in 1453

And they were so fukking rich!

"I didn't realize the Romans walked on the moon, developed  nuke energy and buffalo wings... "

Well Duh, FFS. And the Egyptions didn't watch Youtube. You didn't understand what I said? You can only judge an empire's technology on what was available at the time

"The Roman Empire was colonial but certainly not Global."

Nothing was but the Romans controlled pretty well every advance society at the time, for a long time.

Wikipedia: The Roman Empire was a state that controlled the Mediterranean and much of Western Europe, Western Asia, and North Africa during the classical period.

And they didn't have any serious rivals for centuries. The Us has depended on Nato for 80 years and are now being matched or overtaken by China in some ways.

[John Stone]

 

Oh, indeed. Geo-conquest regularly leads to treasure. 

Its interesting to study what were the  causes of the utter collapse. 

The empire suffered from political instability, many reasons of course but inconsistency in leadership was primary -many emperors gained power thru violence, corruption - the 'people' just didn't believe it was worth defending. Additionally, authoritarian rule reduced civic engagement - public service ........ the oxygen environment for corruption, grift. 

To paraphrase, the Roman Empire collapsed thru the stench of grift and corruption.

.............although the Roman Empire was not a democracy, per se, it was close enough. 

The caution is that historically, most democracies, in time, commit suicide ......... globally it is on the decline now. 

[Moonbox]

4 hours ago, John Stone said:

.............although the Roman Empire was not a democracy, per se, it was close enough. 

The Roman Empire was never a democracy.  It was an Empire...with a despot leading it. 

The Roman Republic wasn't even a democracy.  At best it was a deeply corrupt aristocratic oligopoly.  That being said, it was still better than a lot of systems.  

[John Stone]

51 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

The Roman Empire was never a democracy.  It was an Empire...with a despot leading it. 

The Roman Republic wasn't even a democracy.  At best it was a deeply corrupt aristocratic oligopoly.  That being said, it was still better than a lot of systems.  

off topic counselor. 

[Moonbox]

but i like talking about Rome...and this thread was dumb from the OP

Edited April 7 by Moonbox

[herbie]

Trump = Nero?

with shades of Caligula...

[Moonbox]

He's a hybrid.  

[John Stone]

16 hours ago, herbie said:

Trump = Nero?

with shades of Caligula...

I'd label Trump  reminiscent of Mussolini in terms of bombast, posturing, ideology.

The use of mustard gas by the Italian forces during the Italo-Ethiopian War is a significant aspect of Mussolini’s military strategy.  Although Italy had ratified the 1925 Geneve Protocol against the use of asphyxiating chemicals in war. Mussolini was willing to use mustard gas to expedite the conquest of Ethiopia.

"A whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again. I don't want that to happen, but it probably will," / Trump. 

The guy is insane, vindictive ................... and in possession of the most destructive weapons in history. 

[Goober National]

On 3/6/2026 at 7:28 PM, August1991 said:

In 1945, America avoided a ground war, boots on the ground - an invasion - by dropping the A-bomb.

Should Trump drop an A-bomb somewhere on Iran?

====

One bomb made it plain that the US was serious. Truman? Two bombs made it plain to the world that a US president is serious.

  

Japan was signalling they wanted to surrender. But by then US wasn't listening. When the rabbit's on the run, and you got a gun, you know.

As to Iran I wish them good luck. Let's see who loves Allah more than their own life.

[paxamericana]

On 3/6/2026 at 11:57 PM, August1991 said:

This thread is dead serious.

There were plans drafted for sending in ground troops to extract the Uranium dust. Not impossible just difficult. Trump opted to block the Iranian port so they dig it out and bring us what we want.

[August1991]

On 4/12/2026 at 9:55 AM, Goober National said:

Japan was signalling they wanted to surrender. But by then US wasn't listening. When the rabbit's on the run, and you got a gun, you know.

As to Iran I wish them good luck. Let's see who loves Allah more than their own life.

Disagree.

In May 1945, the Japan's regime/Emperor did not signal any surrender.

Heck, at Potsdam, Truman - honest American guy, poker player - told Stalin about this.

(I suspect Stalin didn't believe Truman.)

====

Truman approved dropping both bombs.

[August1991]

As a tourist, I have been to the room at Potsdam where Truman and Stalin met.

It still exists.

[John Johnston]

Billy? Do you like Gladiators? 

[August1991]

On 4/30/2026 at 9:25 AM, John Johnston said:

Billy? Do you like Gladiators? 

In early 1945, FDR arrived by boat to Malta, then flew to Yalta.

Churchill arrived by air - like Hitler, both flew often in the war.

Stalin arrived by train. He feared airplanes.

===

The famous picture of the three sitting is in fact a very small courtyard.

Modern rich Americans would describe it as a summer home in Hampstead, on Long Island.

I have been there.

 

 

 

 

[August1991]

The meeting room in Potsdam is very different.  It is much larger. (I have been there too.) 

Potsdam is outside of Berlin - near the famous Wannsee Conference, and Frederick's Sans Souci.

At the time, summer 1945, Berlin was destroyed. There was no nowhere else to meet.

Stalin arrived by train, car. I am surprised that Truman managed to fly in, drive through Berlin's remnants. Churchill was in the midst of an election.

It was here in this room that Truman approved both drop, and then passed the note to Stalin's interpreter about the A-bomb.

I wonder whether either knew exactly what was happening.

[Army Guy]

On 4/6/2026 at 9:22 AM, Barquentine said:

If they are civilians, NO!

Back then total war had no rules, everyone was a target, ....you seem to think that war is some kind of gentlemen's agreement, it is clean and only those in the military die...here is an unfortunate fact in most if not all conflicts the civilian population suffer the most...more than both military sides combined....you naive if you think only military die in war...