Trump and Vance Loudly Rebuke Zelensky in Oval Office | The New York Times

BeaverFever · February 28

3 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

at the end of the day, the MAGA base does not want to fight Russia for Ukraine and views Zelesnky as a bad actor

essentially, Ukraine became the cause celebre of the international Woke Progressive left

now Ukraine is simply caught in the inevitable Go Woke Go Broke effect therein

There’s nothing woke and progressive about defending Europe from invading dictator. Are you proclaiming WW2 a woke project also?

robosmith · February 28

11 minutes ago, West said:

Zelensky has suspended all elections under the guise of national emergency. His ratings are in the tubes

Zelenskyy has a 57% approval rating. You've got to stop believing FOS LIES and/or pathological LIAR Trump.

Are you really stupid enough to believe a foreign invasion is NOT a national emergency? LMAO

eyeball · February 28

11 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

the point is that he was all in favour of invading and occupying a country to steal its resources, until he wasn't

After, as was pointed out, he came to his senses.

Or another way to look at it, when the GOP started losing its shit.

BeaverFever · February 28

20 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

after the American backed overthrow of the elected government, the local proxies consolidated power

then several Oblasts in the Donbass revolted against the that regime in Kiev

You’re parroting Russian lies now too? When did that start?

I am Groot · February 28

3 hours ago, gatomontes99 said:

The left is going apeshit. It must be a good thing he did.

And therein lies the definition of what MAGA stands for. If the 'left', however defined, doesn't like it, then it must be good. For example, the Left doesn't like rape, so it's a good thing MAGA is led by a leader who operates under no such belief. Rape is good because the left doesn't like it.

3 hours ago, gatomontes99 said:

Zelensky is delusional. He just is. He thinks the world will save him from Russia. The truth is, the world doesn't have enough to gain by saving Ukraine. Everyone outside of Ukraine is better off negotiating a deal and moving forward. It won't be an ideal deal. It will ne better than fighting a war though.

The rest of Europe doesn't have an ocean between them and Russia. They have an awful lot to win by saving Ukraine, which next to Russia now has the most powerful military on the continent. Added to Russia's own, it would make the Russians much more dangerous to the West, especially with the US now a Russian ally in the process of transitioning to a Russian client state.

Edited February 28 by I am Groot

BeaverFever · February 28

14 minutes ago, West said:

Zelensky has suspended all elections under the guise of national emergency. His ratings are in the tubes

So did Churchill during WW2. Five times. But as a typical MAGA dumbass I bet you didn’t know that either.

I am Groot · February 28

2 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

the Bushie Neocon who fervently supported the Iraq War

he's been totally discredited in America as a result

Does his being intelligent scare you? Or does it just make you jealous?

Dougie93 · February 28

Just now, BeaverFever said:

There’s nothing woke and progressive about defending Europe from invading dictator. Are you proclaiming WW2 a woke project also?

in WW2 we were allies to the Kremlin, even after they invaded Poland with the Nazis in 1939

meanwhile, their failure to invade and occupy Ukraine

actually proves that the Kremlin is no threat to invade Europe after all

tho it is amusing how you woke leftists keep invoking the Domino Theory hysterically therein

suds · February 28

7 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Trump AND Vance are WRONG to side with Putin against Ukraine. Esp after Putin's Russia RENEGED on the Budapest Memorandum.

Well of course. At least that's the way I've seen it all along. But sometimes depending on the situation, diplomacy demands a different set of rules. We can either keep arming Ukraine with the hope of Russia running out of bullets and missiles, or try and find a diplomatic way.

BeaverFever · February 28

3 hours ago, Scott75 said:

The New York Times, being the New York Times, then goes on with typical BS, in this case saying that Trump has "sided with Russia" and other falsehoods

He sided with Russia at the UN in 2 separate votes this past week, dummy.

Dougie93 · February 28

2 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

You’re parroting Russian lies now too? When did that start?

not everything the Russians say is a lie

the Donbass is an ethnically Russian enclave which fought for the Kremlin against the Maidan Revolution

eyeball · February 28

11 minutes ago, West said:

Probably. Trump lost some credibility with the Epstein debacle yesterday and this was his shot at quickly turning the media cycle to something that will quiet the base momentarily.

Lots of MAGA are disgusted that there's been no arrests when there's all this talk about pedos

You people haven't seen anything yet. Hey look there go the Tate bros!

....who?

I am Groot · February 28

1 hour ago, suds said:

You can spin it that way I guess.

You don't get to have alternate facts.

1 hour ago, suds said:

In reality these 'democratic countries' opted into a proxy war with Russia and no endgame in sight.

By daring to defend a country attacked without provocation by a murdering butcher, you mean?

1 hour ago, suds said:

At the very least, Trump's plan offers some type of endgame although the details are still rather sketchy. Both sides are likely going to have to give things up, and a means to finance the rebuild of Ukraine. I cant speak for Ukrainians but at this point I fail to see any better alternatives.

Because Trump is Putin's puppet, you mean?

Dougie93 · February 28

3 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Does his being intelligent scare you? Or does it just make you jealous?

I simply point out that he was all in favour of invading a country to steal its resources, back in 2003

I am Groot · February 28

1 hour ago, Deluge said:

Trump isn't trying to assassinate people or imprison people who secretly wish they could kill him.

Give him time. He's setting up all the federal agencies that might investigate such a thing with loyalists. Doing the same with the army and intelligence services, and stacking the courts. He and his frat boy VP are also starting to make noises like only he can say what's legal and how the courts should not dare try to judge him.

BeaverFever · February 28

2 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

the populist right views Russia & Ukraine as being the same corrupt Eastern European dictatorship in two parts

Because the populist right is mostly low-education know-nothing dumbasses who have never read so much as read a book cover to cover and therefore lack even a basic understanding or knowledge with which to judge the lies of people like Putin, Trump, and their armies of online trolls, influencers and fake news propagandists.

I am Groot · February 28

1 hour ago, Dougie93 said:

the regime in Ukraine was not founded by democracy

there was a CIA backed violent revolutionary overthrow of the elected government in Kiev

the Maidan Revolution of February 2014

You hear this on RT?

Zelensky was democratically elected. There's no question about it.

1 hour ago, Deluge said:

Oh, there's animosity. When a group of a$$holes weaponize the legal system and try to disrupt a presidential campaign, there's definite animosity. lol

The left is bad; the right is not. Let that settle in your brain for a while.

You aren't 'weaponizing the legal system' by allowing it to investigate and charge a notorious criminal with the crimes he committed.

Dougie93 · February 28

7 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

So did Churchill during WW2.

Churchill fighting for the British Empire rather than universal democracy & freedom

I am Groot · February 28

1 hour ago, gatomontes99 said:

Do we have anything to gain by keeping Taiwan free?

Jesus, you're ignorant.

Dougie93 · February 28

1 minute ago, I am Groot said:

Zelensky was democratically elected. There's no question about it.

so was Donald Trump

I am Groot · February 28

56 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

no, David Frum was a W Bushie speech writer whom vehemently advocated for the Iraq War

And how many Republicans were against the war? In round numbers.

I'll wait.

Dougie93 · February 28

3 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Because the populist right is mostly low-education know-nothing dumbasses who have never read so much as read a book cover to cover and therefore lack even a basic understanding or knowledge with which to judge the lies of people like Putin, Trump, and their armies of online trolls, influencers and fake news propagandists.

so long as the Woke Progressive Marxist sacred cows are slaughtered ; mission accomplished

Dougie93 · February 28

Just now, I am Groot said:

And how many Republicans were against the war?

very few, after those like your "smart guy" David Frum talked them into it

eyeball · February 28

14 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

The rest of Europe doesn't have an ocean between them and Russia. They have an awful lot to win by saving Ukraine, which next to Russia now has the most powerful military on the continent. Added to Russia's own, it would make the Russians much more dangerous to the West, especially with the US now a Russian ally in the process of transitioning to a Russian client state.

Wait until Trump is sending military aid to Putin.

suds · February 28

5 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

By daring to defend a country attacked without provocation by a murdering butcher, you mean?

'Aiding a country' can mean a number of different things. Sort of like when Obama gave the Ukraine blankets when they were invaded by Russia in 2014. 'Opting into a proxy war' requires no further explanation. That's what 'spin' is.