Communism vs the Free Market

[August1991]

Reagan defeated the Soviets.

Far more important, the free market won.

Around the world, there are fewer black markets.

Nowadays, numbers are more accurate.

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, August1991 said:

Reagan defeated the Soviets.

Far more important, the free market won.

Around the world, there are fewer black markets.

Nowadays, numbers are more accurate.

The last two points are interesting.

 

What else?

[Old Guy]

10 hours ago, August1991 said:

Reagan defeated the Soviets.

Far more important, the free market won.

Around the world, there are fewer black markets.

Nowadays, numbers are more accurate.

You've made 4 assertions with no evidence.  Reagan obviously didn't roll up his sleeves and defeat the soviets. In this context what do you mean by soviets.? The people of the USSR? the country Soviet Union? You could make a case that the arms race between the USA and the USSR contributed to the collapse of the USSR.  In this regard the US could produce more arms and maintain a high standard of living while the USSR could not.  Capitalism, in this context demonstrated its superiority over Communism.  I would also contend that the free market economy became less free during this arms race. Due in part to the fact that big companies grew bigger and absorbed smaller companies willowing down competition. 

Your 3rd and 4th assertion don't deserve comment because they are so vague. How many black markets then compared to now. When was then? What is a black market and why should there be fewer under a free market economy than under a communist economy. 

What numbers? 

This could be an interesting topic but how about rephrasing it:  Capitalism Vs Socialism Which is better? Then there is the question of measurement. You could use Gross National Product but that doesn't say tell how individuals within a country are doing. You could go for a broader picture and use the Human Development Index which blends social and economic wellbeing by measuring:

• The health aspect of the HDI is measured by the life expectancy, as calculated at the time of birth, in each country, and normalized so that this component is equal to zero when life expectancy is 20 and equal to one when life expectancy is 85.
• Education is measured on two levels: the mean years of schooling for residents of a country, and the expected years of schooling that a child has at the average age for starting school. These are each separately normalized so that both 15 mean years of schooling and 18 years of expected schooling equal one, and a simple mean of the two is calculated.3
• The economic metric chosen to represent the standard of living is GNI per capita based on purchasing power parity (PPP), a common metric used to reflect average income. The standard of living is normalized so that it is equal to one when the GNI per capita is $75,000 and equal to zero when the GNI per capita is $100.

Whatever you measure you would have to contend with the fact that there are no purely capitalist or socialist states in the world, some countries are more capitalist than others and some more socialist than others. 

Cheers

 

[August1991]

On 10/3/2024 at 3:45 PM, Old Guy said:

You've made 4 assertions with no evidence.  Reagan obviously didn't roll up his sleeves and defeat the soviets.

 

 

I agree on this first point.

IMHO, if Andropov had lived, the Soviet Union could have managed much longer.

Our Canadian health system still works.

[August1991]

On 10/3/2024 at 3:45 PM, Old Guy said:

...

Capitalism, in this context demonstrated its superiority over Communism.

,,,

Capitalism ?

Rather, free trade. Markets with prices. Numbers. Maths.

[August1991]

On 10/3/2024 at 3:45 PM, Old Guy said:

....

Whatever you measure you would have to contend with the fact that there are no purely capitalist or socialist states in the world

....

 

In my opinion, some 100,000 years ago smart people invented numbers to trade.

These guys didn't need negative numbers. They didn't need a zero.

They invented a term of trade.

[August1991]

Our entire view of mathematics is based on economics, trade.

Yet our universe is defined by mathematics.

[August1991]

I am a real person - maybe too much wine.

I suspect that Old Guy is an AI bot.

[Mathieub]

There is also the center, the entrepreneurship. Free-market is too wicked to me. And no money with equity is too kind.

[Michael Hardner]

On 10/3/2024 at 3:45 PM, Old Guy said:

•  

Whatever you measure you would have to contend with the fact that there are no purely capitalist or socialist states in the world, some countries are more capitalist than others and some more socialist than others. 

At the moment, we're going through a time when assumptions are questioned.  In economics, concepts like economies of scale, Monopoly, free trade are all being looked at over again.

[Old Guy]

11 hours ago, August1991 said:

I am a real person - maybe too much wine.

I suspect that Old Guy is an AI bot.

No not nearly smart enough to be an AI but I do believe that evidence that support assertions make any discussion more productive. Name calling (and I'm not talking about you August) will always ensure that the discussion goes sideways. I really am an old guy and have learned a few things in my 78 years. If you don't mind me asking, is 91 the year of your birth.  

Cheers

[Old Guy]

12 hours ago, August1991 said:

Capitalism ?

Rather, free trade. Markets with prices. Numbers. Maths.

I used Capitalism because it better describes the US than free markets. This short article is interesting in that, according to the Heritage Foundation, which compiles an index of economic freedom, ranks the US as 25th. Since it was the US under Reagan that engaged with the USSR in an arms race which the US won with its robust manufacturing ability and since the OP wanted to compare communism I took the liberty to insert capitalism. 

The article also lists countries that are often considered socialist, because of their well developed social welfare systems, in the top ten of countries on the economic freedom index. Showing that free markets can exist in socialist systems. 

[herbie]

It's 2024 and 'communism' has absorbed the free market concept. Chinese and Vietnamese billionaires. The managed economy is threatening classical capitalism.
How the people's standard of living has improved more than ours in the last couple decades.

[Michael Hardner]

44 minutes ago, herbie said:

  The managed economy is threatening classical capitalism.
 

Adam Smith warned against both of the current forms.

[August1991]

On 10/5/2024 at 6:27 PM, herbie said:

It's 2024 and 'communism' has absorbed the free market concept. Chinese and Vietnamese billionaires. The managed economy is threatening classical capitalism.
How the people's standard of living has improved more than ours in the last couple decades.

Huh?

Managed capitalism - what a term.

===

We Canadians get along.

[August1991]

On 10/5/2024 at 3:57 PM, Old Guy said:

...

I really am an old guy and have learned a few things in my 78 years. If you don't mind me asking, is 91 the year of your birth.  

Cheers

No, I was not born in 1891.

[herbie]

Going by the weird and obscure nature of his posts, more like his mother's year of birth was 1991....

[Old Guy]

On 10/6/2024 at 5:27 PM, August1991 said:

Managed capitalism - what a term.

I guess in 1891 they didn't have the term Managed Capitalism.  Amazing, given that has been practised widely after world war ii.  I provided a link that explains it. 

[eyeball]

On 10/5/2024 at 1:00 AM, August1991 said:

Our entire view of mathematics is based on economics, trade.

Yet our universe is defined by mathematics.

Don't forget economics is just another social science.

Our stance towards and within the universe is social.

Oddly enough economics says the universe is an externality.

[Michael Hardner]

7 hours ago, Old Guy said:

I guess in 1891 they didn't have the term Managed Capitalism.  Amazing, given that has been practised widely after world war ii.  I provided a link that explains it. 

No, but antitrust legislation is a form of management of free enterprise in place since Roman Times.

 

[August1991]

On 10/5/2024 at 6:01 AM, Mathieub said:

There is also the center, the entrepreneurship. Free-market is too wicked to me. And no money with equity is too kind.

Another bot!