NDP kills Prop-Up deal.

[CdnFox]

13 hours ago, eyeball said:

Almost half a million Canadians have received dental care since the NDP saw to it that Canada's national dental care plan was established.

That seems like a pretty huge problem solved to me.

Nope.   A sizable portion of them qualified under various provincial plans. 

ANd of the rest they got a cleaning and that's great but....  that's really not dental care. 

So we spent billions trying to get a handful of people the absolute basics that most already had. 

Meanwhile they can't afford rent or food. 

Any more achievements like that and we won't have a country left. 

[Moonlight Graham]

3 hours ago, eyeball said:

More of them. And they can thank the NDP for making their lives better.

Provide evidence for this claim.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Provide evidence for this claim.

Nearly 450,000 eligible Canadians have received care under the Canadian Dental Care Plan

News release

August 7, 2024 | Ottawa, Ontario | Government of Canada

I fluffed it up to nearly half a million eligible Canadians given the date of the release.

Presumably these were ineligible for their provincial plans. The link says up to 9 million Canadians could benefit from this.

It's 2024, Canada is finally getting closer to being or par with many of our more progressive peers, who long ago rolled dental care into their national healthcare plans, and it took Canada's left wing to get it done.

Of course PP could just as easily cancel the whole thing because it's too woke.

Edited September 11, 2024 by eyeball

[CdnFox]

33 minutes ago, eyeball said:

 

Presumably these were ineligible for their provincial plans.

Nope. Not at all. Most were receiving dental benefits under provincial plans. 

The feds didn't want to make elegibility for provincial plans a factor becuase it would reduce the number of people they could claim they've  'helped'/ 

sez so right on their website:

If you have dental coverage through government social programs

If you have dental coverage through a provincial, territorial or federal government social program, you can still qualify for the CDCP.

So there you go.  If you get your free teeth cleaning through the feds they send a note to the province so you don't get two free ones, but other than that most of the people helped were already qualified and receiving benefits provincially.

 

You....you didn't think the liberals were being HONEST with  you did you??   

[herbie]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Nearly 450,000 eligible Canadians have received care under the Canadian Dental Care Plan

Why point out facts like that to people opposed to having evil communist social programs at all? They don't give a damn who benefits, it wasn't them.

[CdnFox]

37 minutes ago, herbie said:

Why point out facts like that to people opposed to having evil communist social programs at all? They don't give a damn who benefits, it wasn't them.

Wasn't really anybody.  

Meanwhile people can't afford food or housing.  Almost one quarter of all canadians will use the food bank this fall.  But sure - a few people got their teeth cleaned by the feds instead of the province so yaaaaaay trudeau!  You lefites are so weird. 

[Moonlight Graham]

8 hours ago, eyeball said:

Nearly 450,000 eligible Canadians have received care under the Canadian Dental Care Plan

News release

August 7, 2024 | Ottawa, Ontario | Government of Canada

I fluffed it up to nearly half a million eligible Canadians given the date of the release.

Presumably these were ineligible for their provincial plans. The link says up to 9 million Canadians could benefit from this.

It's 2024, Canada is finally getting closer to being or par with many of our more progressive peers, who long ago rolled dental care into their national healthcare plans, and it took Canada's left wing to get it done.

Of course PP could just as easily cancel the whole thing because it's too woke.

We don't have national healthcare plans because healthcare is a provincial jurisdiction constitutionally.  We've literally had low income dental plans through provinces for decades.

Presuming all 450k people on the plan were ineligible for provincial plans isn't evidence.  I'm not against low income folks getting dental, I just think the NDP and Liberals aren't doing nearly what they say they are.  Same with pharmacare.

Meanwhile our main healthcare systems are in crisis in part due to jacking up the immigration rate to historic levels

[CdnFox]

25 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

We don't have national healthcare plans because healthcare is a provincial jurisdiction constitutionally.  We've literally had low income dental plans through provinces for decades.

Presuming all 450k people on the plan were ineligible for provincial plans isn't evidence.  I'm not against low income folks getting dental, I just think the NDP and Liberals aren't doing nearly what they say they are.  Same with pharmacare.

Meanwhile our main healthcare systems are in crisis in part due to jacking up the immigration rate to historic levels

most people were covered to some degree or another by provincial plans. 

And we are spending 4.4 billion a year, or about 110 dollars for every single canadian of all ages to do it, or about 10 thousand dollars per beneficiary (not including the fact they had provincial plans). 

That's  about 8 times what me and my employer pay for my medical, and i get dental and vision and full pharmacare with that.  We could literally buy full group insurance benefits for these people for what the feds are buying limited 'dental' benefits for. That's how screwed up this program is. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

PP will probably get a majority of seats in the House next time but that looks like being the exception going forward. If we want to avoid the instability of minority government and the increased frequency of elections it brings, we should start getting over our collective phobia of formal coalitions in this country. Nothing stabilizes a multi-party government as much as Cabinet posts - give an MP a seat at the top table and they will be loath to leave it. Coalitions are a fact of life in European politics and the roof hasn’t fallen in over there. 

Edited September 16, 2024 by SpankyMcFarland

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

PP will probably get a majority of seats in the House next time but that looks like being the exception going forward. If we want to avoid the instability of minority government and the increased frequency of elections it brings, we should start getting over our collective phobia of formal coalitions in this country. Nothing stabilizes a multi-party government as much as Cabinet posts - give an MP a seat at the top table and they will be loath to leave it. Coalitions are a fact of life in European politics and the roof hasn’t fallen in over there. 

Looking at european politics HARDLY is a recommendation for formal coalitions  

Coalitions are generally not a good idea.  To be honest, ways and means deals like the ndp did aren't that great either.  

And there really isn't anything wrong with going to the polls every couple of years if that's what it comes to. 

The moment you get a coalition you get a party that nobody at all voted for.  THat flies in the face of representational democracy. 

Harper went 5 years without any kind of coalition, and the people decided they trusted him enough to give him a majority. Trudeau started off with a majority and the people decided they wanted him put on notice and gave him a minority. For years that meant he had to do deals with the other parties to get by. 

Jagmeet's deal with him let him behave as if he had a majority WHICH IS NOT WHAT THE PUBLIC WANTED TO GIVE HIM.  

If two parties want to run as a coalition  then campaign on it during the election.  Otherwise, you have to work it out in the house and the public can punish any party that sends them back to an election without a good reason. Europe is a model of how NOT to do things. 

[eyeball]

11 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

If we want to avoid the instability of minority government and the increased frequency of elections it brings, we should start getting over our collective phobia of formal coalitions in this country.

Just how collective is it though? I suspect many people who vote strategically do so with the hope a coalition government will be the result.

I really do think the arrival of dental-care is a huge accomplishment and the best reason we have for not fearing minority governments.

Edited September 17, 2024 by eyeball

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

Just how collective is it though? I suspect many people who vote strategically do so with the hope a coalition government will be the result.

 

Then they should run on that.  "We intend to win a majority but if necessary we'll form gov't with the ndp -  (ndp nods their heads)." 

But they didn't. So the coalition was never voted for.