Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 41 minutes ago, Hodad said: Half the country is aggressively anti-merit. I'm thinking that politics does not work for abstractions and things that aren't readily apparent. Conspiracy theories do though. National security, climate, economy are pretty complex issues and so is easy for someone to jump in with a simplistic answer such as "Bush did 9/11". The Soviet crew are taking advantage of this landscape. 1 Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: I'm thinking that politics does not work for abstractions and things that aren't readily apparent. Conspiracy theories do though. National security, climate, economy are pretty complex issues and so is easy for someone to jump in with a simplistic answer such as "Bush did 9/11". The Soviet crew are taking advantage of this landscape. It takes time, energy, patience, and some fortitude to read, analyze, question, possibly debunk yourself, read some more, and give things time to materialize. That is not the way of the world right now. Folks want strong, adamant, impassioned opinions based on what they see right now. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 4 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: It takes time, energy, patience, and some fortitude to read, analyze, question, possibly debunk yourself, read some more, and give things time to materialize. That is not the way of the world right now. Folks want strong, adamant, impassioned opinions based on what they see right now. Intellectual and spiritual laziness seems to be ok with most people. If you were physically unfit though, people would look down at you... Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Intellectual and spiritual laziness seems to be ok with most people. If you were physically unfit though, people would look down at you... Lets not lie to ourselves though. We both have done the same thing. Read a headline or two and then blast away. Also, both sides are full of these intellectually lazy types that are wanting your visceral, raw, emotional responses. They give you strong, uncompromising takes and the audience gets outraged and they will not put up this s__t any longer.. until tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 4 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: Lets not lie to ourselves though. We both have done the same thing. Read a headline or two and then blast away. Also, both sides are full of these intellectually lazy types that are wanting your visceral, raw, emotional responses. They give you strong, uncompromising takes and the audience gets outraged and they will not put up this s__t any longer.. until tomorrow. All people suffer from it but not all recognize that. I have strong visceral reactions to people who think that it's okay to be this way. 1 Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 13 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: It takes time, energy, patience, and some fortitude to read, analyze, question, possibly debunk yourself, read some more, and give things time to materialize. That is not the way of the world right now. Folks want strong, adamant, impassioned opinions based on what they see right now. More than that, it takes the willingness to seek/accept the truth, rather than just seek that which satisfies one's rabid confirmation bias and ignore everything else, especially when a person's cherished beliefs are fuelled by disinformation from sources which one should reasonably be able to trust. It took many months and tens of thousands of covid deaths in Canada for some people to acknowledge that even one multi-vaxed person died of covid here. People who were extremely passionate about the topic of covid and followed it closely were completely out of the loop. Quote If CNN gave an infinite number of monkeys an infinite number of typewriters, leftists would believe everything they typed. If you missed something on the Cultist Narrative Network, don't worry, the dolt horde here will make sure everyone hears it. Kamala didn't get where she is because of her achievements or anything that came out of her mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 (edited) 8 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: More than that, it takes the willingness to seek/accept the truth, rather than just seek that which satisfies one's rabid confirmation bias and ignore everything else, especially when a person's cherished beliefs are fuelled by disinformation from sources which one should reasonably be able to trust. It took many months and tens of thousands of covid deaths in Canada for some people to acknowledge that even one multi-vaxed person died of covid here. People who were extremely passionate about the topic of covid and followed it closely were completely out of the loop. True. To further this.. folks get very indignant when it appears (real or perceived) that someone has more information or expertise than them. This could be to simply caring more about a topic (like yourself with Covid), being more intelligent, or just having a knack or gift for a topic. They can't be getting shown up so they have to match your intensity, vigor, emotion. I am mostly ok with folks knowing more about certain topics than myself. Examples being Covid and Israel-Hamas. Lastly.. if you come on to a forum, facebook, message board and admit that you do not know about the topic.. the onslaught is brutal. Edited September 4 by impartialobserver 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: All people suffer from it but not all recognize that. I have strong visceral reactions to people who think that it's okay to be this way. We're all targeted by disinformation campaigns. Eg., when CBC says "The trucker convoy is running rampant, destroying things and debasing statues and monuments", it's our duty to make sure that they have proof of that level of activity before we quote them. 1 Quote If CNN gave an infinite number of monkeys an infinite number of typewriters, leftists would believe everything they typed. If you missed something on the Cultist Narrative Network, don't worry, the dolt horde here will make sure everyone hears it. Kamala didn't get where she is because of her achievements or anything that came out of her mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 12 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: True. To further this.. folks get very indignant when it appears (real or perceived) that someone has more information or expertise than them. This could be to simply caring more about a topic (like yourself with Covid), being more intelligent, or just having a knack or gift for a topic. They can't be getting shown up so they have to match your intensity, vigor, emotion. I am mostly ok with folks knowing more about certain topics than myself. Examples being Covid and Israel-Hamas. Lastly.. if you come on to a forum, facebook, message board and admit that you do not know about the topic.. the onslaught is brutal. There's an appeal to authority epidemic in NA. "Trust the science", "97% of scientists agree", etc, is the final word for some people, and I can't really blame a 20-yr-old for believing that when it's broadcast on a national network. Quote If CNN gave an infinite number of monkeys an infinite number of typewriters, leftists would believe everything they typed. If you missed something on the Cultist Narrative Network, don't worry, the dolt horde here will make sure everyone hears it. Kamala didn't get where she is because of her achievements or anything that came out of her mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 Just now, WestCanMan said: There's an appeal to authority epidemic in NA. "Trust the science", "97% of scientists agree", etc, is the final word for some people, and I can't really blame a 20-yr-old for believing that when it's broadcast on a national network. Some of this is being intellectually lazy. Trust authority.. that takes 2 seconds at best. Now, tearing through page after page, learning new concepts, struggling with the material because it is not exactly light reading.. that takes weeks, months, years, or longer. For example, Das Kapital by Marx. That is some hard reading ( I know, I have done it). Lots of very circuitous reasoning and poor writing. To finish this is more a testament to your masochism than one's intelligence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 1 minute ago, impartialobserver said: Some of this is being intellectually lazy. Also appeal to authority is a fallacy. That means it's an appeal to authority and nothing else. Presumably, institutions and leaders from public health and science have studies and data to backup their positions as well.. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 Just now, Michael Hardner said: Also appeal to authority is a fallacy. That means it's an appeal to authority and nothing else. Presumably, institutions and leaders from public health and science have studies and data to backup their positions as well.. studies and data are not always perfect. Ideally they have been vetted and given time to be validated. Not all data is good data or of no value. For example, if you want to know how well educated your populace is.. using graduation rates as your sole metric can be awfully deceptive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 23 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: studies and data are not always perfect. Ideally they have been vetted and given time to be validated. Not all data is good data or of no value. For example, if you want to know how well educated your populace is.. using graduation rates as your sole metric can be awfully deceptive Right, but anyone presenting a case would still refer to said assumptions, methods, etc. That's not appealing to authority although it can lead to that. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 24 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Also appeal to authority is a fallacy. That means it's an appeal to authority and nothing else. Presumably, institutions and leaders from public health and science have studies and data to backup their positions as well.. When you have the head of the NiH being cited by the US and Canadian governments and CNN, CBC, CTV etc as an expert, it shouldn't be foolish to believe him, but now we know he was intentionally deceiving us. Quote If CNN gave an infinite number of monkeys an infinite number of typewriters, leftists would believe everything they typed. If you missed something on the Cultist Narrative Network, don't worry, the dolt horde here will make sure everyone hears it. Kamala didn't get where she is because of her achievements or anything that came out of her mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impartialobserver Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Right, but anyone presenting a case would still refer to said assumptions, methods, etc. That's not appealing to authority although it can lead to that. the point is that the populace has to be more discerning and skeptical. Blindly following anything is probably not the best solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 10 minutes ago, impartialobserver said: the point is that the populace has to be more discerning and skeptical. Blindly following anything is probably not the best solution. This is how you do it. You put together two or more knowledgeable experts who can explain the points, and the assumptions to a thinking public. They can break down The subject in the public forum and people can make up their own minds based on the points made. It would be even better if You did it online. And you used a broad swath of the thinking public To bring their expertise to the discussion. It would be amazing actually You could call it regarding politics or repolitics for short.. Of course you'd have to ban the chuds. And the people who don't think of themselves as Chuds but somehow get angry when you mention Chuds... 🤔 Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted September 4 Report Share Posted September 4 1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said: Of course you'd have to ban the chuds. And the people who don't think of themselves as Chuds but somehow get angry when you mention Chuds... So you wouldn't be there to see it you're saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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