Why does Canada allow itself to be influenced and propagandized by Communist China?

[blackbird]

5 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. So Christianity is the only moral way of life ?  That's demonstrably false... many non-religious and other-religious folks are moral.

Guess you have not heard or read what Jesus and the Bible said.   Quote  23  For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;  Unquote Romans 3:23 KJV

God considers every single person an immoral person, a sinner, and with a wicked heart.  You have not understood this.  This is a central teaching of the Bible/Christianity.  Your claim of non-religious or other religious folks being moral is diametrically opposed to this central teaching from God in the Bible.  As far as God is concerned there is none righteous. 

When you use the word "moral" you should make it clear you are using it in reference to earthly standards and not God's standard.  The only completely righteous or moral person that ever walked on earth was Jesus Christ because he is God.  The Bible says unless one is born again by faith in Jesus Christ and his atonement for sin for the one who believes, he will not be saved or go to heaven.    Thank God he said man does not live by bread alone, but by every word of God (the Bible).  If it had not been for this, nobody would know.

Edited January 2, 2022 by blackbird

[Michael Hardner]

7 minutes ago, blackbird said:

1. As far as God is concerned there is none righteous. 

 

1. Except you.  You shun the sinner, despite the example of Jesus.

The rest of your post doesn't support shunning LGBTQ, nor does it say anything about Marxism.  I guess you're going to stop talking about this part?

[blackbird]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Why?  Because you say so?

 

I say the opposite.

 

I have known many religious people who support LGBTQ rights and hard left politics.  And that includes clerics.

 

If you want to interpret scripture as excluding sinners and embracing wealth, well enjoy that.

 

But you are plain wrong, IMO

quote 8  He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9  Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. {is born: or, has been born} 10  In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.  Unquote 1 John 1:8-10  KJB

I am not saying someone who claims to be religious and embraces sin can not be forgiven.  Of course there is forgiveness.  But blatantly rejecting God's word does not place one in a good place.  It is rebellion against God and needs to be repented of.  I am also not saying one who believes those things cannot be saved.  I am not the judge of men's hearts or motives.  But I am simply pointing out that you have a contradiction in your mind if you think it is OK to believe things like LGBTQ are not seriously contrary to God's word.  Liberals support abortion on demand and same-sex marriage.  These things are clearly opposed by Gods' word.  It is indefensible.  I am not sure where you are coming from but you need to seriously reconsider your beliefs.   Nobody is perfect in this world and Christians do fall into sin as well, but we need to repent and believe God's word.  We need to take it seriously and not dismiss it as trivial or unimportant.  When one becomes a Christian, he accepts Christ and His Word.  Not just saying he believes in Christ but has no use for his word.  That is illogical.  Jesus and his word go together.  Read the first chapter of John.  Jesus is the Word made flesh.

[Michael Hardner]

1 minute ago, blackbird said:

1. Liberals support abortion on demand and same-sex marriage.  These things are clearly opposed by Gods' word. 

2. I am not sure where you are coming from but you need to seriously reconsider your beliefs.   

3.  Jesus and his word go together.  Read the first chapter of John.  Jesus is the Word made flesh.

1. So is divorce.  Should we disallow that?  Is it a sign of our decline that we allow it?

2. I have done, and I'm in great shape thanks.

3. Jesus did not speak out against homosexuality in any direct way.

[Yzermandius19]

27 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

2. Not sure how you got there after claiming Buddha was influenced by a guy born 500 years after was

I didn't claim that

I claimed that Christian influence on Buddhists has made the Buddhists more moral throughout history

and that without that influence they would be significantly less moral

they same can be said of Buddhism's influence on people of pre-axial age religions as well

better religions come around and improve the morals of societies throughout history

not all religions are created equal

some drive more moral progress than others

and Christianity has driven more moral progress than any other religion

objectively speaking

to not give it that credit is proof of a bias against it getting in the way of an objective evaluation

[blackbird]

10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. So is divorce.  Should we disallow that?  Is it a sign of our decline that we allow it?

2. I have done, and I'm in great shape thanks.

3. Jesus did not speak out against homosexuality in any direct way.

Try Google :  homosexuality and the Bible.  You will find lots on it.  Jesus didn't have to personally say something about it because the whole Bible is inspired by God, which means Jesus Christ wrote the Bible.  It even says in places in the New Testament that he is the Word (of God).  

Divorce is a complicated issue.  In some cases there may be good reasons why it is necessary.  It is also forgivable  if it is a sin.  Laws need to allow for divorce because it is sometimes the only solution.  I know there are churches that don't believe in divorce in any circumstance, but I can show biblically why they are wrong.  But that is a whole big subject.

Edited January 2, 2022 by blackbird

[eyeball]

5 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Really.  I have never seen that written.  My reviews of religious analysis have always said that the two are so similar as to spark curiosity as to whether they have a common root.

Both are rooted in alleviating suffering and more like ritualized forms of psychology.  Bhuddists in Tibet, who view their particular version as the highest form, were horrified at the amount of suffering they saw in the west.

[blackbird]

22 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Except you.  You shun the sinner, despite the example of Jesus.

The rest of your post doesn't support shunning LGBTQ, nor does it say anything about Marxism.  I guess you're going to stop talking about this part?

Are you a Buddhist or a Muslim?   

 Where did I shun the sinner or shun LGBTQ?  Now you are inventing accusations.   I said I believe it is contrary to the Bible.  Didn't say anything about shunning, whatever that is supposed to mean.  

Edited January 2, 2022 by blackbird

[Yzermandius19]

there are plenty of contradictions in the Bible

Jesus was a reformer who disagreed with things stated in the Old Testament

and many Jews ostracized him for it

assuming that because other parts of the Bible had a certain stance on homosexuality that therefore Jesus must have agreed doesn't hold water

Edited January 2, 2022 by Yzermandius19

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

1.;Try Google :  homosexuality and the Bible.   

2. Divorce is a complicated issue is some cases because there may be good reasons why it is necessary.

3.   but that is a whole big subject.

1. Once you start going back to the old testament, you're losing ground... because there are tons of things there declared 'sins'. 

2. Oh sure... And...

3. Right.... So the whole word of God stuff goes away... Because it's a 'whole big subject' and all of a sudden men (not God) are deciding what is to be listened to and what is not.  And it all starts with the biases of the people who call themselves Christian today but are not.

 

I don't suppose you would add the emergence of these new self-described Christian interlopers as a sign of the decline now would you?

 

 

 

 

[Michael Hardner]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Both are rooted in alleviating suffering and more like ritualized forms of psychology.  Bhuddists in Tibet, who view their particular version as the highest form, were horrified at the amount of suffering they saw in the west.

I was brought up devout Catholic, but whenever I take a 'which religion are you ?' quiz it says that I am Buddhist.

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Are you a Buddhist or a Muslim?  

I am Christian.

[Yzermandius19]

calling yourself a Christian doesn't make you a Christian

actions speak louder than words

many who claim not to be Christian nevertheless act more Christian than many of those who claim to be Christian

the actions are important, not the label

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, Yzermandius19 said:

1.calling yourself a Christian doesn't make you a Christian

2. actions are important, not the label

1. I'm glad we agree on that.

2. Most definitely.

[blackbird]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Once you start going back to the old testament, you're losing ground... because there are tons of things there declared 'sins'. 

2. Oh sure... And...

3. Right.... So the whole word of God stuff goes away... Because it's a 'whole big subject' and all of a sudden men (not God) are deciding what is to be listened to and what is not.  And it all starts with the biases of the people who call themselves Christian today but are not.

 

I don't suppose you would add the emergence of these new self-described Christian interlopers as a sign of the decline now would you?

I suspect you are trying to divert the subject away from what we have been talking about to divorce.  Divorce is another big subject.  It is useless to got there when you still haven't accepted the facts I have pointed out already.  Do you have any evidence you accept the Bible as authoritative or are you willing to accept it as such?

I am not that interested in talking about homosexuality but for the fact that it seems to be a central platform of liberals and left to promote it.  Therefore it is a clear proof to show they are not interested in defending a Christian civilization or nation.

As far as what is a sin, I already said you can use Google.  Why do you think we need to explain the obvious.  I already quoted Romans ch1 which clearly shows homosexuality is opposed by God and therefore a sin.  Google will point you to many parts of the Bible which show that it is a sin.  Romans chapter one could not be clearer or louder.

Edited January 2, 2022 by blackbird

[Yzermandius19]

6 minutes ago, blackbird said:

I am not if you are trying to divert the subject away from what we have been talking about.  It appears you are.   Divorce is another big subject.  It is useless to got there when you still haven't accepted the facts I have pointed out already.

As far as what is a sin, I already said you can use Google.  Why do you think we need to explain the obvious.  I already quoted Romans ch1 which clearly shows homosexuality is opposed by God and therefore a sin.  Google will point you to many parts of the Bible which show that it is a sin.  Romans chapter one could not be clearer or louder.

yet he who is without sin cast the first stone

put the stone down blackbird, you're a sinner too

stoning the gays is a Muslim extremist thing

not a Christian thing

Edited January 2, 2022 by Yzermandius19

[eyeball]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I was brought up devout Catholic, but whenever I take a 'which religion are you ?' quiz it says that I am Buddhist.

I was brought up an atheist and get the same answer.

[Yzermandius19]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I was brought up an atheist and get the same answer.

well as I pointed out

Buddhism is a rather atheistic religion

so don't be terribly surprised by the venn diagram crossover

Edited January 2, 2022 by Yzermandius19

[blackbird]

7 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

yet he who is without sin cast the first stone

put the stone down blackbird, you're a sinner too

I know I am a sinner and never said I wasn't.   But the subject at hand requires me to point out why liberals and left are supporting evil/ sin as a central part of their platforms.  Michael refuses to acknowledge that.  The Bible teaches us to have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness but rather rebuke them.  That's all I am doing.  The liberals / NDP would accuse believers of being hateful and bigoted for pointing out these things but you know who the accuser of the brethren is?   If you haven't accepted Christ as your Savior and believe he died for you and rose from the dead for your justification, I would encourage you to and resolve a central issue.  Otherwise you will be torn in the middle forever.

Edited January 2, 2022 by blackbird

[Michael Hardner]

8 minutes ago, blackbird said:

1. I suspect you are trying to divert the subject away from what we have been talking about to divorce.   

2. I am not that interested in talking about homosexuality but for the fact that it seems to be a central platform of liberals and left to promote it. 

3. Therefore it is a clear proof to show they are not interested in defending a Christian civilization or nation.

4.  Romans ch1 which clearly shows homosexuality is opposed by God and therefore a sin.  

1. Only because you have articulated a number of principles, only to jettison them when the subject of Divorce comes around.

2. I don't think that it is.

3. Given that you frame separate church and state as 'promoting' something, your assessment that clear proof is here doesn't work.

4. As is Divorce, eating shellfish etc.  You pick the sins you want to, without principle it seems to me.  Christians can eat lobster, get divorced or marry the same sex these days.  What I think of that is immaterial, as Christ told us not to judge remember?

[blackbird]

When men, political parties, campaign to govern us and make the laws for us, then their beliefs and policies are fair game for examination and critical analysis in accordance with the light of God's written revelation.  That is not false judgment or unreasonable judgment of any kind.  We are not be dumb asses and be silent when evil things are happening all around us.  It is time Christian wake up.

[Michael Hardner]

8 minutes ago, blackbird said:

 liberals and left are supporting evil/ sin as a central part of their platforms.  Michael refuses to acknowledge that.  

They allow Divorce and you are ok with that because it's a 'big issue'.

 

You are already embracing the principle of separate church and state, which is a liberal keystone.

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, blackbird said:

1.  We are not be dumb asses and be silent when evil things are happening all around us. 

2. It is time Christian wake up.

1. You leave the sinner to find their own morality.

2. You really have no answer for the divorce thing.

Why don't you just say that you find LGBTQ disgusting, and you will at least be consistent... Nobody is asking you to like it.

[blackbird]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. Only because you have articulated a number of principles, only to jettison them when the subject of Divorce comes around.

2. I don't think that it is.

3. Given that you frame separate church and state as 'promoting' something, your assessment that clear proof is here doesn't work.

4. As is Divorce, eating shellfish etc.  You pick the sins you want to, without principle it seems to me.  Christians can eat lobster, get divorced or marry the same sex these days.  What I think of that is immaterial, as Christ told us not to judge remember?

I have already answered most of that.  If you want to know more about divorce, I have the information or I can refer you to a website that goes into it probably better than I can.   But it is immaterial at this point.  You are using the old trick of trying to silence anyone who opposes you by saying not to judge.  That is unbiblical.  This is a debate over government policies and Biblical truth, so of course it is necessary to point out what God teaches in the Bible.  Don't let the Devil silence you or keep you knowing the truth.

[Yzermandius19]

8 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

They allow Divorce and you are ok with that because it's a 'big issue'.

 

You are already embracing the principle of separate church and state, which is a liberal keystone.

it's a Christian keystone

render unto Caesar what is Caesar's

render unto God what is God's

separation of church and state is a principle is rooted in Christianity

it's no coincidence that Christian nations are where the church and state are separated

nor is it a coincidence that the enlightenment occurred in those countries and not elsewhere

Edited January 2, 2022 by Yzermandius19