Hudson Jones Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 (edited) Here is some good news: Natalie Portman has publicly refused to travel to Israel for the Genesis award, leading the entire ceremony to be canceled. In a statement she said "[r]ecent events in Israel have been extremely distressing to her and she does not feel comfortable participating in any public events in Israel” and that “she cannot in good conscience move forward with the ceremony." Israel's brand has become so toxic that even well-known Israeli-American cultural figures, like Natalie Portman, now refuse to blatantly whitewash, or art-wash, Israeli crimes and apartheid policies. Link Edited April 21, 2018 by Hudson Jones 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted April 23, 2018 Report Share Posted April 23, 2018 On 3/25/2018 at 10:28 PM, DogOnPorch said: The Arabs are also free to discuss terms. But coming to terms with the Israelis isn't Islam's goal. How would you feel if someone came along and took over and moved into your home and you were told that you can have the garage to live in? That is basically what the Jews did to the Palestinians. Pretty much took all their homeland away from them. The Jews are the ones that created this mess. The Palestinians are only trying to fight back as best they can. Jewish supremacy is the problem, not the Palestinians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted April 23, 2018 Report Share Posted April 23, 2018 On 3/22/2018 at 9:56 AM, marcus said: Most people already know of Israel's discriminatory treatment of Palestinians. This discrimination was highlighted very recently when the Palestinian teenager, Ahed Tamimi was taken in and sentenced for slapping an IDF soldier who wouldn't leave her property, especially after her cousin was shot in the head earlier in the day. Here is a recent comparison: Elor Azaria - Israeli soldier convicted of killing a wounded Palestinian by shooting him in the head. He'll be out in May, having served 9 months. Ahed Tamimi - Palestinian teenager arrested after slapping a heavily-armed Israeli soldier in her backyard, soon after her cousin is shot in the head by Israeli soldiers. She's getting 8 months. Justice served. More on Ahed Tamimi's sentencing: Link You are a brave and hearty soul to be taking on that taboo and sacred cow subject called Judaism and Israel. The Jews are well known for being called the pampered pooches of the world and must never be questioned, challenged, attacked or insulted over anything that they do. Blasphemy, my son, blasphemy. Fifty lashes with a wet noodle for you, fella. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted April 23, 2018 Report Share Posted April 23, 2018 On 3/22/2018 at 5:47 PM, Argus said: She'll probably be out in a couple of months. She is no innocent but a regular activist. Now would you like to compare Israel's justice system to that of the Palestinian Territories? Or perhaps Syria? Egypt? Iran? Saudi Arabia? Lebanon? Shooting and killing a wounded person lying on the ground is a major crime. But hey, if you are just one of those gentile wounded Palestinians well I guess that he deserved it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) This thread's initial topic was exposed months ago. The actual story did not deal with this woman being arrested for a slap in the face but for a continuing series of violent physical assaults on Israeli soldiers staged in front of Palestinian Authority cameras. The exercise attempted to incite the soldiers into fighting back. In fact the attacked soldiers showed remarkable restraint. The woman has been used in such set ups for over 10 years and was chosen when she was about 9 because she has blue eyes and blonde hair and does not look like a stereotype Arab woman and so initially attracted attention in the European press because of her blue eyes and blonde hair. However the Western and European press caught on this was staged repeatedly and stopped carrying the stories and set up attempts. The fact Marcus would recycle this propaganda bull shit is par for the course. The actual woman misrepresented is a self confessed believer in terrorism and jihad against Israel and fully discloses she is a propaganda agent at war with the IDF and considers any Israeli or Jew the enemy. Its also interesting to see Marcus and Hudson get into bed with a self confessed white supremacist anti-Semite, Taxme on this thread. Now here is the true irony. These Muslim fundamentalists supported by the self admitted white supremacist anti semite claim Israel discriminates so Let's start with having them explain the laws in all the Arab countries of the Middle East in regards to Jews and other non Muslims. Lol. Right. How about we start with Marcus or Hudson Jones the names they like to use explain Jordanian Civil Law No.6, which can be found in the Jordanian Nationality Law, Official Gazette, No. 1171, Article 3(3) of Law No. 6, 1954 (February 6, 1954), p.105. Have them explain it to you and why it states and I quote: " Any man will be a Jordanian subject if he is not Jewish". Have them explain to you how it is how no Jew is allowed citizenship in a Muslim Sharia law Arab nation. Have them explain how thes enations treat their non Muslim citizens, i.e., Christians, Bahaiis, Zoroastreans, Berbers, Kurds, Yazidi and so on. Better still have them explain to you the skin colour discrimination in Muslim Middle East countries and how they treat Fillipinos, Pakistanis, Bangla Deshis, Indonesians, Africans. Have them also explain how dark skinned Muslims are treated by fair skinned Muslims.. Discrimination. Right. The Middle East is a model of justice and equal treatment of non Muslims, women, gays, let alone Muslims of different sects, skin colours and national origins. Another day another piss on Israel diatribe my the merry messengers of MoeHamandeggs. Edited April 28, 2018 by Rue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 This thread is a joke because it attempts to demonize Israel as a country which discriminates ignoring that the very reason Israel was created was in direct response to Muslim and Christian countries discriminating against Jews culminating in the holocaust in Europe exterminating 6 million Jews and in the Arab-Mulsim world Between 1920 and 1970, the forced expulsion of 900,000 Jews. Jews in fact created a country to escape from being discriminated against and yet the thread makers pretend Israel just suddenly appeared with nothing better to do than discriminate against non Jews. Between 1920 and 1970, 900,000 Jews were forced out of Muslim countries and all their personal property was illegally stolen. 600,000 of those Jews fled to Israel as refuges with another 300,000 fleeing to France and the U.S, In fact the descendents of these 600,000 refugees form the majority of the French Jewish community and Israel’s population or are descendants of refugees from the holocaust. Yet the Jews of Israel are portrayed not as having escaped persecution and achieving political sufferage but colonialist invaders. How are people escaping Muslim bigotry and expulsion and a holocaust not refugees? How are they anything but refugees? The answer-for people like Marcus and Hudson Jones and the other Anglo sounding contributors on this forum, it requires a re-write of history to ignore the actual discriminatory treatment of Jews by Christians and Muslims. The re-writing of Jews as bigots and colonialist invaders is called inversion. It’s the technique of turning the enemy of Marcus and Hudson into demons that perpetuate discrimination as opposed to targets of discrimination who chose no longer to be victims and emancipate themselves through political sufferage from this discrimination. Jews created Israel precisely to liberate themselves from ever again being discriminated against by Muslim and Christian states that did not separate religion from state and so institutionalized discrimination against Jews in the name of Jesus or Muhammed. In fact Zionism, the redefining of Jews as a nationality seeking liberation did not define Jews as a religious people but a national collective identity and Zionism was not religious in definition nor did it enshrine discrimination against Muslims or Christians or non Jews but it did create a law of return to guarantee any Jew the ability to flee to Israel from any country discriminating against them and gain automatic citizenship. cont. next post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 This law of return ironically is no different than that of over 140 different nations that provide the same law of return for their identified nationals, i.e., China, Italy, Eire, Belgium, Germany, Japan, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Lithuania, Ukraine, Estonia, Russia, South Korea. Interestingly Jordan which to this day has a law forbidding any Jew from being a citizen, was created illegally by Britain out of 90% of Palestine and offered automatic citizenship to any non Jewish Palestinian until 1967 when Arafat tried to kill King Hussein of Jordan and seize the nation forcing his expulsion. It was only after that expulsion Arafat created the term Palestinian to refer to a national people who he claimed had to be Muslim and live in a sharia law nation made up of Jordan, Israel, the West Bank and Gaza and Parts of Syria and Lebanon. That belief remains to this day and yet the piss on Israel posters on this thread would have you believe this is not their agenda. They pretend there is no constitution of Hamas and another of the Palestinian Authority and another of Hezbollah which all call for the creation of a Muslim sharia law state in Gaza-Israel-Jordan and define Jihad as a holy war not just to liberate Israel of Jews, but a starting point to rid the entire world of Jews and create a one world Muslim council to run the world. They won’t reveal their actual Muslim fundamentalist beliefs but they will detract from their beliefs with the claim that Israel is racist, discriminatory, hateful, etc. Interestingly Muslims have all the legal rights NO JEW or non Muslim has in any Muslim country of the Middle East. That they won’t discuss. They also won’t discuss how the Arab League of nations between 1920 and 1970 expelled Jews from all their countries using combination of six legal, economic, and political measures aimed at isolating Jews and those were: 1-denationalization 2-legal discrimination 3-isolation and sequestration 4- economic despoilment 5- socioeconomic discrimination 6-massacres (pogroms) of Jews. In fact they can not discuss let alone admit Jewish refugees have suffered let alone in comparison have suffered far more than the Palestinian refugees in terms of the number of people hurt and killed or number of years and people the attacks targeted and went on for. These anti semites prefer to re-write history to pretend no Jewish communities were expelled either in their entirety or almost so and Israeli just appeared for no reason. They won’t discuss the role of Islam in these nations that expelled and discriminated against Jews. They ignore that the expulsion of Jews covers the large geographicl area that ranges from Morocco to Iran and from Turkey to Yemen. cont. next post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 What Marcus and Hudson Jones will not discuss is the Treaty of Sèvres (1920), which was in fact a peace treaty between the Allies that dismantled the Ottoman Empire and contemplated the creation of TWO Arab (and Israeli) states. In their re-write of history there was no plan to create a Jewish state, They won’t discuss let alone aknowledge that this treaty in article 105 in Egypt defined the concept of people belonging to a race (article 105) as opposed to a nation and this in turn led to the dissociating of Jews from the majority of the population of Egypt and stripped them of their rights as Egyptin citizens. Then came in Egypt the nationality laws of 1927 and 1929, which favored jus sanguinis (or right of blood which meant from then on an Egyptian citizen could only be one who had an Arab-Muslim affiliation. They won’t discuss that when Egypt was granted independence from Britain in 1936, King Farouk, made the nationality laws even more discriminatory against Jews and this continued under Nasser with changes to the nationality laws 1950, 1951, 1953, and 1956 which rendered all Jews in that country stateless. In 1956 all Jews of Egypt were declared enemies of the state. In Egypt, in fact the process of discrimination in the public service began in 1929 culminating In 1945-1948, when Jews were excluded from the public service. In 1947, Jewish schools were put under surveillance and forced to Arabize and Egyptianize their curricula. Community organizations were forced to submit their member lists to the Egyptian state after May 1948 and until 1950. In 1949, Jews were forbidden to live in the vicinity of King Farouk’s palaces. In Iraq, all Jews were stripped of their nationality as of May 9, 1950 and in Libya, on June12 , Jews were detached from their state. In Libya, in 1953, Jews were tehn subjected to day to day restrictions of discrimination including economic boycotts. In Libya on May 9, 1957, any Libyan with a relative in Israel had to to register at the Libyan boycott office, even though at that time, 90 percent of the Jews had already left. In Libya in 1960 Jews were prohibited from acquiring new possessions, could no longer a vote, hold public office, or serve in the army or the police and on April 2 1960, Alliance Israélite Universelle schools were closed. Also in Iraq, Jewish history and Hebrew language instruction were prohibited in Jewish schools during the 1920s. Jews were expelled from public service and education in the 1930s. The Jewish schools’ curricula were censored in 1932. In Lebanon back in 1947, Jewish students were expelled from Beirut University and discharged from public service positions. In Iran, so called “ Zionist” activities were banned in 1979 and in 2000 Jews were no longer allowed to work in public service, universities, and public companies. In Yemen, in 1913, they implemented a type of Muslim sharia law worsening that forced the conversion of Jewosh orphans between 1922 and 1928, and excluded Jews the from public service and army. In Syria, in 1947 Jews were no longer allowed to buy real property and removed from any civil servant or public position and in 1967 Syria went so far as to impoise Muslim principals to Jewish schools. (Jews could not be in schools with non Jews) In Morocco, after it declared independence from France in 1956 in passed laws preventing Jews from working in he civil and public service or having charities. In Tunisia in another country which declared independence from France on Juy 11, 1958 it passed laws saying Jews could not have Jewish communities and instead replaced them with what it called “Israelite worship commissions,” and redefined Jews as inferior to Muslim citizens. In Turkey between 1923-1945 non Muslims were forced into hard-labor battalions in their army. In all Arab countries Jews had their passports confiscated, had their businesses boycotted and were prohibited from being able to leave their country or send mail or communicate with anyone. Across the Arab League of Nations, their states unilaterally confiscated the businesses, property, assets, bank accounts of all Jews and capital taxation was imposed on Jews different from any other citizens. In fact the Arab League of Nations proved clearly t hey did not differentiate between a Jew and an Israeli. They targeted all Jews as they had started to long before Israel was created. The attempt by Marcus and Hudson Jones to pretend the Muslim world did not treat Jews any differently than the Nazis (except they did not gas them or put them in extermination camps, just house arrest) is self evident. Their attempt to pretend if this happened its only because its Israel’s fault is absurd as they have in the past. cont. next post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 It was not difficult for Muslim sharia law nations to discriminate against Jews and pretending it only arose because Jews created a nation is laughable. The Koran speaks for itself on the deeply entrenched beliefs that are the underlying roots of this hatred and discrimination Israel was created to liberate Jews from. These passages speak for themselves: Ignominy shall be their portion [the Jews'] wheresoever they are found... They have incurred anger from their Lord, and wretchedness is laid upon them... because they disbelieve the revelations of Allah and slew the Prophets wrongfully... because they were rebellious and used to transgress. [Surah 111, v. 112] And thou wilt find them [the Jews] the greediest of mankind....[Surah 11, v. 96] Evil is that for which they sell their souls... For disbelievers is a terrible doom.[Surah II, v. 90] Taste ye [Jews] the punishment of burning.[Surah III, v. 18 1] Proclaim a woeful punishment to those that hoard up gold and silver.... Their treasures shall be heated in the dres of Hell, and their foreheads, sides and backs branded with them. . . . 'Taste then the punishment which is your due. [Surah IX, v. 35] "They [the Jews] are the heirs of Hell.... They will spare no pains to corrupt you. They desire nothing but your ruin. Their hatred is clear from what they say ... When evil befalls you they rejoice." Ibid. [Surah 111, v. 117-120] Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment.[Surah IV, v. 56] Because of the wrongdoing of the Jews.... And of their taking usury ... and of their devouring people's wealth by false pretenses. We have prepared for those of them who disbelieve a painful doom.[Surah IV, v. 160, 161] Allah hath cursed them [the Jews] for their disbelief.[Surah IV, v. 46] They [the Jews] will spare no pains to corrupt you. They desire nothing but your ruin. Their hatred is clear from what they say, but more violent is the hatred which their breasts conceal.[Surah III, v. 117-120] In truth the disbelievers are an open enemy to you.[Surah IV, v. 101] And thou seest [Jews and Christians] vying one with another in sin and transgression and their devouring of illicit gain. Verily evil is what they do. Why do not the rabbis and the priests forbid their evilspeaking and their devouring of illicit gain? .... evil is their handiwork.[Surah V, v. 62, 63] O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and Christians for friends. [Surah V, v. 51] The most vehement of mankind in hostility [are] the Jews and the idolators.[Surah V, v. 82] Fight against such of those [Jews and Christians] ... until they pay for the tribute readily, being brought low.[Surah IX, v. 29] Allah fighteth against them [the Jews]. How perverse they are![Surah IX, v. 30] Believers, many are the rabbis and the monks who defraud men of their possessions... Proclaim a woeful punishment to those that hoard up gold and silver and do not spend it in Allah's cause.... their treasures shall be heated in the fire of Hell.... [Surah IX, v. 26-34] They [the Jews] spread evil in the land .... [Surah V, v. 62-66] [The Jews] knowingly perverted [the word of Allah], know of nothing except lies ... commit evil and become engrossed in sin. [Surah II, v. 71-85J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) You boys want some more? Go on, bring it. I told you. You come to this forum with your anti semitic PA scripts I will respond. Again and again. Moehamandeggs meets The Baconator. Sizzle in my grease, Edited April 28, 2018 by Rue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) On 2018-04-23 at 7:49 PM, taxme said: How would you feel if someone came along and took over and moved into your home and you were told that you can have the garage to live in? That is basically what the Jews did to the Palestinians. Pretty much took all their homeland away from them. The Jews are the ones that created this mess. The Palestinians are only trying to fight back as best they can. Jewish supremacy is the problem, not the Palestinians. This shows the depth of your ignorance. No Jew moved into any Arab home. It shows you have no clue what it is you think you talk of. Also your use of the word "Jew" and the phrase "The Jews are the ones that created this mess." reveal you as an anti semite. You blame all Jews when even if what you said is true would be the individual acts of only those Jews you think did what you claim they did. That shows you pick up on the purpose of this thread which is to attack all Jews. The term "Jewish supremacy" means what exactly coming from someone who is a self admitted white supremacist? Hmmm? Its kind of ironic a self admitted white supremacist who claims he is on this board to defend "whites" accuses anyone else of being a supremacist. What a joke, How about you tell Marcus and Hudson Jones what you really think about Muslims let alone fundamentalist extremist ones What a pathetic joke but then flies are attracted to garbage left out. Edited April 28, 2018 by Rue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CITIZEN_2015 Posted April 28, 2018 Report Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) Let me first start by saying that I am not anti-semitic. In fact I am no friend of Arabs as it is their actions in the past and present that I hate rather than people themselves. That said we cannot justify forceful actions or discriminations by Israeli military and government by saying that Arabs are worse (which indeed they are by far worse. If the situation is ever reversed there would have been massacre). Why I say what I say is because Israel is claimed to be a democracy and we don't expect force and discrimination (or shooting civilians) from a democracy as opposed to Arabs (and some Islamic states but non-arabs too) have proven records of discrimination and much worse like invading and forcing and many other evil actions past many centuries. It reminds me of my Russian girlfriend who justfied Russian soldiers rapes in Berlin by saying that many Germans also raped Russian Women when they captured Russia. My answer was well there were Nazis. It was expected of them but Russia was hold to better standards because they were fighting nazis so we expected better of them. Just saying. Edited April 28, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted April 29, 2018 Report Share Posted April 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Rue said: This shows the depth of your ignorance. No Jew moved into any Arab home. It shows you have no clue what it is you think you talk of. Also your use of the word "Jew" and the phrase "The Jews are the ones that created this mess." reveal you as an anti semite. You blame all Jews when even if what you said is true would be the individual acts of only those Jews you think did what you claim they did. That shows you pick up on the purpose of this thread which is to attack all Jews. The term "Jewish supremacy" means what exactly coming from someone who is a self admitted white supremacist? Hmmm? Its kind of ironic a self admitted white supremacist who claims he is on this board to defend "whites" accuses anyone else of being a supremacist. What a joke, How about you tell Marcus and Hudson Jones what you really think about Muslims let alone fundamentalist extremist ones What a pathetic joke but then flies are attracted to garbage left out. The Rothchild's wanted a home land for the Jews. They were able to grab what is Israel today from the Palestinians to give a home land to the Jews.They stole that land from the Palestinians and it was the Rothchild's and others who are the ones that created the mess. There was once a country called Palestine. Learn your history. Why or how is questioning or challenging anything that has to do with Judaism or Israel is some how attacking Jews? Why do Jews get so upset every time someone dares to say something negative about Jews? Are you people that touchy that nobody should dare say anything negative about Jews? The Islamic religion is a cruel, sadistic and archaic religion. So we should all just stay quiet and not say anything negative about Islam because to do so that person can be considered to be anti-Muslim? Jews are not perfect, live with it. Hey, I could call you a Jewish supremacist also for standing up for Israel, just like you like to call me a "white supremacist" for standing up for my gentile white people. And just where did I ever say that I was a "white supremacist" anyway? Show me where I have said this, and verbatim please. You do this all the time and I have asked you on a number of occasions in the past to show and explain to me as to why you keep calling me a "white supremacist". Where is the beef, chief? Fork it over. You are the only one here who is always using the words "white supremacist" all the time in your attacks and insults on me. What a joke is right. Why don't you ask them yourself instead as to how they feel about regular Muslims or about the religious crazy extremist ones. You can do your own asking. Are you now calling me garbage? I can always expect the worse from you or your tribe. Pathetic indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted April 29, 2018 Report Share Posted April 29, 2018 18 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: Let me first start by saying that I am not anti-semitic. Don't even bother trying to say you are not antisemitic. No matter how many times you say it, there are some here that will never take your word for it. Watch, I will be called anti-semite buy Rue for even saying this. Criticize Israel? No you are an anti-semite. And even when you explain your stance clearly, it's not accepted. So I would make no aplologies and just continue posting normally. There is only one person in this thread that can't seem to bring his language out of the gutter and makes him look really fucking childish. You will continually be attacked by that one poster. But you've been here long enough to understand that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maymoon Posted April 29, 2018 Report Share Posted April 29, 2018 18 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: Let me first start by saying that I am not anti-semitic. You are one if you speak out against what Israel has done. I agree that you cannot try to excuse the actions of one group by using another person's actions. That said, I see that the false context of 50/50 blame is being used here in many of the discussions. To me, the dynamics and the relationship between the Palestinians and Israelis is much different. I see one as the occupier and the other as the occupied. One as the aggressor and the other as the victim. One as the human rights abuser and the other as the abused. Some try to change the facts on the ground, like "Palestinian homes have not been stolen and taken over", when it's clear that this is happening on many fronts. Like the State sponsored seizure of land, by declaring Palestinian areas as "military zones" and then eventually a post is created and then another Jew-only settlement is born. You also have the take-over of Palestinian houses in Palestinian East Jerusalem and Hebron by extremist Jewish settlers, which are being backed up shady municipal governments and the Israeli police. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hudson Jones Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 On 4/28/2018 at 3:15 PM, Rue said: This law of return ironically is no different than that of over 140 different nations that provide the same law of return for their identified nationals, i.e., China, Italy, Eire, Belgium, Germany, Japan, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Lithuania, Ukraine, Estonia, Russia, South Korea. You are spreading misinformation again. The law of return in Israel only requires that the person is Jewish. Whereas these other countries, like Japan, require that you are the child of a Japanese citizen. Meaning that a person who has no family ties to Israel, can gain citizenship in Israel, only because they are Jewish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centerpiece Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 (edited) So much noise and misdirection - year after year - decade after decade. You want peace - and justice? Pretty simple really - Iran and their Hamas and Hezbollah proxies just have to drop their goal of the total destruction of Israel - and openly accept the right of Israel to exist. How can you continually turn the other cheek when someone is trying to exterminate you? Everything else is just a bunch of Chamberlain-like bleeding heart BS. Edited May 1, 2018 by Centerpiece Spelling 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 On 4/28/2018 at 7:07 PM, CITIZEN_2015 said: Let me first start by saying that I am not anti-semitic. In fact I am no friend of Arabs as it is their actions in the past and present that I hate rather than people themselves. That said we cannot justify forceful actions or discriminations by Israeli military and government by saying that Arabs are worse (which indeed they are by far worse. If the situation is ever reversed there would have been massacre). Why I say what I say is because Israel is claimed to be a democracy and we don't expect force and discrimination (or shooting civilians) from a democracy True. However, democracies are mostly peaceful places with peaceful neighbours. Israel is anything but. Nor do democracies, at least, western democracies, have well-armed insurgencies within their borders. In most democracies, if the police wish to discourage some behaviour, they will make arrests. If the Israelis go into Palestinian territory to make arrests they will be shot at, so that's kind of a difficult proposition. The Israelis are determined to keep the Palestinians away from their border. That's a justifiable goal given that a number of Israeli border guards have been murdered. Not to mention the number of times Palestinians have managed to sneak into Israel and go on a killing spree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 14 minutes ago, Argus said: True. However, democracies are mostly peaceful places with peaceful neighbours. Israel is anything but. Nor do democracies, at least, western democracies, have well-armed insurgencies within their borders. In most democracies, if the police wish to discourage some behaviour, they will make arrests. If the Israelis go into Palestinian territory to make arrests they will be shot at, so that's kind of a difficult proposition. The Israelis are determined to keep the Palestinians away from their border. That's a justifiable goal given that a number of Israeli border guards have been murdered. Not to mention the number of times Palestinians have managed to sneak into Israel and go on a killing spree. Only if the western democracies stop supplying and training well armed insurgencies in other nations. But if Israel wants to re-draw their borders via the fences and barriers, then they also run the risk of being killed. Israel is occupying these areas and will eventually claim it all their own and drive out the remaining Palestinians. If born in the occupied territories, most likely they are going to die there, there is simply NO way out for those people. I have to roll my eyes everytime a Jew or Israeli saying they are a victim and their existence is in constant peril. Israel has been in 'peril' since day one of it's inception. and yet 70 years later, a formidable nation with a big sophisticated military with some big sponsors backing them. And over 6000 years since Ancient Israel, Jews are still here. So, you know, hats off, good job for remaining alive through the eons. But my question remains. Does slapping a soldier demand more time in jail compared to a solider killing someone else? Seems... disproportionate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxme Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 17 hours ago, Centerpiece said: No much noise and misdirection - year after year - decade after decade. You want peace - and justice? Pretty simple really - Iran and their Hamas and Hezbollah proxies just have to drop their goal of the total destruction of Israel - and openly accept the right of Israel to exist. How can you continually turn the other cheek when someone is trying to exterminate you? Everything else is just a bunch of Chamberlain-like bleeding heart BS. Maybe it should be the other way around and that Israel should stop with it's goal of the destruction of the Palestinian people and openly admit that Palestinians have a right to exist also. Indeed, Israel needs to turn the other cheek instead of trying to exterminate the Palestinian people learn to live with them in peace. You just have to go on the internet to find out all the crimes against humanity that have been committed against the Palestinian people by the Jews of Israel. You will find no bull chit by doing so. It never hurts to get the other side of the story unless you are one of those who refuse to want to learn or get to know the other side of the story. Sadly there are too many that refuse to read and get the other side of the story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 4 hours ago, GostHacked said: Only if the western democracies stop supplying and training well armed insurgencies in other nations. That is a silly old left wing canard. Most of the weapons flowing into the third world are coming from the Russians, Chinese, North Koreans, etc. Western stuff just costs too much for most. 4 hours ago, GostHacked said: But if Israel wants to re-draw their borders via the fences and barriers, then they also run the risk of being killed. At what point in time since Israel came into being did Israelis NOT run the risk of being killed, either at home or everywhere they went? 4 hours ago, GostHacked said: srael is occupying these areas and will eventually claim it all their own and drive out the remaining Palestinians. If born in the occupied territories, most likely they are going to die there, there is simply NO way out for those people. So maybe they should stop fighting and supporting terrorism. Life in the Palestinian territories was a lot better before the intifada started. There was no wall, far fewer security restrictions, and many found work in Israel. Life was arguably better for them there than in the surrounding Arab states. 4 hours ago, GostHacked said: But my question remains. Does slapping a soldier demand more time in jail compared to a solider killing someone else? Seems... disproportionate. We seem to have lots of disproportionate sentences in Canada based on different judges and different political motivations behind the laws, not to mention the perpetrator's legal history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CITIZEN_2015 Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, Argus said: True. However, democracies are mostly peaceful places with peaceful neighbours. Israel is anything but. Nor do democracies, at least, western democracies, have well-armed insurgencies within their borders. In most democracies, if the police wish to discourage some behaviour, they will make arrests. If the Israelis go into Palestinian territory to make arrests they will be shot at, so that's kind of a difficult proposition. The Israelis are determined to keep the Palestinians away from their border. That's a justifiable goal given that a number of Israeli border guards have been murdered. Not to mention the number of times Palestinians have managed to sneak into Israel and go on a killing spree. Well as I have said many times Israel is surrounded by very fierce and violent enemies (who don't even have mercy for their own people) so it has the right to defend itself on the battleground however, the border guards (soldiers) who referred to being killed are SOLDIERS whose duty is to fight the enemy and sometimes get killed too. There is a state of war between Israeli Army and various Pelestinian liberation fronts (not sure about their names like Hezbolah, or Hamas or whatever). However killing defencess civilians who have no part in the battle by Israeli soldiers from the air in particular who have no place to take refuse is not justifiable by any means and I cannot defend for any possible reason no matter how much I may see Israeli right to self defence (in the battle with Armed fighters) or may dislike Arab actions in the past and future against other nations who they invaded and destroyed. Edited May 1, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centerpiece Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 1 hour ago, taxme said: Maybe it should be the other way around and that Israel should stop with it's goal of the destruction of the Palestinian people and openly admit that Palestinians have a right to exist also. Indeed, Israel needs to turn the other cheek instead of trying to exterminate the Palestinian people learn to live with them in peace. You just have to go on the internet to find out all the crimes against humanity that have been committed against the Palestinian people by the Jews of Israel. You will find no bull chit by doing so. It never hurts to get the other side of the story unless you are one of those who refuse to want to learn or get to know the other side of the story. Sadly there are too many that refuse to read and get the other side of the story. Wow! Israel has the capability to wipe out the Palestinians any time they would choose to do so. Instead, Israel legally employs about 50,000 Palestinians in Israel and the occupied territories. It's estimated that a further 25-30,000 work illegally. Now turn it around - if the roles were reversed, Hamas would not think twice of completely obliterating Israel - or at least all the Jews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 1, 2018 Report Share Posted May 1, 2018 1 hour ago, CITIZEN_2015 said: However killing defencess civilians who have no part in the battle by Israeli soldiers from the air in particular who have no place to take refuse is not justifiable by any means and I cannot defend for any possible reason no matter how much I may see Israeli right to self defence So propose an alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CITIZEN_2015 Posted May 2, 2018 Report Share Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Argus said: So propose an alternative. Battle the armed resistance and avoid civilian casualties by any means necessary. When Israelis shoot randoml;y into civilians or drop bombs over populated areas where the coward terrorists are hiding behind women and children it causes innocent deaths and many of them include women and children. Can you detend that? Fight them on a one to one basis even though it will be higher casualties n Israelis but that is what should distinguish a democracy from a dictatorship?. Good from evil?. Netanyahu and Assad? If they both do the same that is killing innocent civilians then they are not different Edited May 2, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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