Iran needs some democracy

[bush_cheney2004]

7 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Ahh read the posts first before making idiotic comments.

The debate is whether Iran will become like Syria or disintegrate if the people wish to change the regime and revolve or like Iraq in the unlikely scenario that it is militarily invaded. No one said it can not be bombed like it has covered its skies with a protective ironic ceiling or something!!!!!. 

 

If Iranians wanted to change their Iranian Revolution regime, they would have done so by now.  

I don't care what happens about idiotic wishes inside Iran, but other nations (including Canada) will use military force to attack threats to allied nations.

Canada has attacked Syria and Iraq...it can also attack Iran.

[GostHacked]

1 hour ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Iran is not the same as Syria or Iraq. It is iran regime and its supporters who are trying to scare the people of Iran by putting the fear of Iraq and Syria and ISIS in their hearts to prevent them from revolving and so that they keep stealing their money and lives. Iran is a non-Arab and very united country whose minorities share the same history, culture and traditions for over 25 centuries. The people of Azari defended Iran with their blood when the Turks invaded. The poeple of Kurdistan (the kurdish minority) and Khuzestan (including Arab minorities) defended against Iraqi invasion. Iran is much more educated then both Syria and Iraq. Politics runnung high among Iranians for centuries while both Iraq and Syria were colonized last century Iranians kept their independence and were NEVER colonized. Iran will not become another Syria or Iraq because Iran is much more advanced than both Iraq and Syria and an ancient civilization.

According to western media,   Hussein put fear into Iraq's citizens. The Taliban did the same thing in Afghanistan. Again, same for Libya. One more time, same with Syria. And now Iran.

But since you agree that it's hard for a revolution to take place in these nations, due to tyranic leadership (but yet we are very very cozy with Saudi Arabia when do we invade them?????) lends more to the notion and facts that these are not organic internal civil revolutions.

[GostHacked]

57 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

If Iranians wanted to change their Iranian Revolution regime, they would have done so by now.  

I don't care what happens about idiotic wishes inside Iran, but other nations (including Canada) will use military force to attack threats to allied nations.

Canada has attacked Syria and Iraq...it can also attack Iran.

Like the USA, a revolution will never happen. Maybe the USA could use a dose of freedom.

[kactus]

It has to be said that everytime Iranians have revolted against the government whether due to the elections of Ahmadinejhad in 2009 or the recent peaceful protests by courageous women removing their headscarves in public it met with the brutal force of the regime.

Alot of people in the west do not simply understand the bravery these people show risking their lives for what they stand for against this alien corrupt regime that has invaded Iran. 

Added to this complexity is dealing with a misogynist, racist and narcissist currently residing the Whitehouse hell bent to undo everything Obama has done. The withdrawal from the nuclear deal and imposing sanctions by this orange buffoon will only hurt ordinary Iranians and not the apparatus of the regime. This has been the case time and time again....

Nevertheless, three of the biggest US allies namely UK, France and Germany and also another two members Russia and China have expressed their commitment to stay with the deal. This is a heavy price to pay by these European countries knowing fully well that any company that deals with Iran would be subject to sanctions by the US....However, they will endeavour to stick to their end of the bargain.

Whether Trumps end game before his speech about withdrawal from nuclear deal is ultimately sending a signal to the the clerical estsblishment that their time is up remain moot. However, this is far from over yet....

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by kactus

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, kactus said:

It has to be said that everytime Iranians have revolted against the government whether due to the elections of Ahmadinejhad in 2009 or the recent peaceful process by women removing their headscarves in public it met with the brutal force of the regime.

Alot of people in the west do not simply understand the bravery these people show risking their lives for what they stand for against this alien corrupt regime that has invaded Iran.

 

Not good enough....get the job done or somebody else will do it for them.

[CITIZEN_2015]

2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

If Iranians wanted to change their Iranian Revolution regime, they would have done so by now.  

Canada has attacked Syria and Iraq...it can also attack Iran.

1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Not good enough....get the job done or somebody else will do it for them.

Easy for you to say hiding behind your computer but if you had a machine gun in your face with thousands of well paid thugs confronting you or facing the prospects of being taken to jail and beaten to death after being tortured and raped then I could ask you hey fellow, if you wanted to change the government then you should have done so by now!!!!!!!!!

What the hell has Canadato do with all this? Canada will never bomb Iran. They may act as peace keeper after military occupation or until when a transitional government in Iran can take over elected by the nation.

Edited May 11, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Easy for you to say hiding behind your computer but if you had a machine gun in your face with thousands of well paid thugs confronting you or facing the prospects of being taken to jail and beaten to death after being tortured and raped then I could ask you hey fellow, if you wanted the change the government then you should have done so by now!!!!!!!!!

 

Other nationals have sacrificed far more to overthrow oppressive regimes....I guess the Iranians don't want it bad enough.

 

Quote

What the hell has Canadato do with all this? Canada will never bomb Iran. They may act as peace keeper after military occupation or until when a transitional government in Iran can take over elected by the nation.

 

Canada bombed Iraq and Canada bombed Syria....bombed Serbia too.   All it takes is another human rights story about "genocide".

[GostHacked]

15 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Not good enough....get the job done or somebody else will do it for them.

The USA had that chance in 53...   they blew it.

[GostHacked]

13 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Other nationals have sacrificed far more to overthrow oppressive regimes....I guess the Iranians don't want it bad enough.

 

 

Canada bombed Iraq and Canada bombed Syria....bombed Serbia too.   All it takes is another human rights story about "genocide".

Does not mean any of us agree with Canada's actions in those nations.  How many of your B2s were shot down in Serbia? I heard it was not that hard.

[CITIZEN_2015]

21 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Other nationals have sacrificed far more to overthrow oppressive regimes....I guess the Iranians don't want it bad enough.

Geez read your history and educate yourself before posting. It is not other nationals only but Iranian nationals did overthrow regime too (that is why they are in this mess now) however, it was NOTHING compare to this oppression they are in now. They even check into your bedrooms and reward your neighbors to spy on you and jail you (and a lot happens in jails including forced suicides) without any reason or proof with regime made accusations even if they suspect one in a million you may be involve in something. Not to mention forced everything including hijab.

Edited May 11, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015

[bush_cheney2004]

14 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Geez read your history and educate yourself before posting. It is not other nationals only but Iranian nationals did overthrow regime too (that is why they are in this mess now) however, it was NOTHING compare to this oppression they are in now. They even check into your bedrooms and reward your neighbors to spy on you and jail you (and a lot happens in jails including forced suicides) without any reason or proof with regime made accusations even if they suspect one in a million you may be involve in something. Not to mention forced everything including hijab.

 

Just more symptoms of the same disease.

The tree of liberty requires blood from patriots and tyrants.

[GostHacked]

26 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Just more symptoms of the same disease.

The tree of liberty requires blood from patriots and tyrants.

And yet those trees are dying by the looks of it.

[CITIZEN_2015]

On 5/4/2018 at 3:45 PM, CITIZEN_2015 said:

The people of Iran and Israel are much closer than you think. Ever since the liberation of Jews by Persian liberation army centuries ago from Egyption slavery

Cyrus the great's head on Israeli coin is a small way Israelis thanking the great Persian King who freed Jews from slavery and built houses for them 2500 years ago. Iranian imperial flag with lion and sword is also on the coin. The Persian people will free themselves from slavery too hopefully soon. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5718129/Donald-Trumps-face-feature-Israeli-coin-marking-70th-anniversary-Israel-independence.html?ito=amp_whatsapp_share_top

 

Edited May 12, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015

[kactus]

2 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Cyrus the great's head on Israeli coin is a small way Israelis thanking the great Persian King who freed Jews from slavery and built houses for them 2500 years ago. Iranian imperial flag with lion and sword is also on the coin. The Persian people will free themselves from slavery too hopefully soon. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5718129/Donald-Trumps-face-feature-Israeli-coin-marking-70th-anniversary-Israel-independence.html?ito=amp_whatsapp_share_top

 

The coin indeed has the photo of Cyrus the great. A monumental moment when he allowed the passage for jews through Babylon and rebuilding temple of Jerusalem...

He was also the founder of human rights charter...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrus_the_Great_in_the_Bible

https://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.slideplayer.com%2F34%2F10226853%2Fslides%2Fslide_4.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fslideplayer.com%2Fslide%2F10226853%2F&docid=EfPxkpuq31yllM&tbnid=Suo1YQ3FqKfb6M%3A&vet=1&w=960&h=720&source=sh%2Fx%2Fim

[kactus]

I have pointed this out before and I will say it again that democracy in the middle east does not correlate to the value system that is inherent in the western society. This is simply due to the fact that what we in the West preach about moral ethics, democracy and human rights in those countries that does not match our actions in helping to promote democratic values in those countries. Take Saudi Arabia for instance. Americans don’t give a hoot for a sheikh with no money yet whilst these sheikhs are rich it doesn’t stop the US government to sell billions of dollars of arms to their despotic regime. And to those who suggest that only China and Russia are the biggest allies of the Iranian mullah regime I say this. Either you are misrepresenting or just trying to exonerate the West because regardless of the US and Israel’s vested interest to isolate Iran, the three European powerhouse (UK, Germany and France) are going to carry on doing ‘“business” as usual with Iran’s mullahs....With UK there is even more incentive to do so with the Brexit ramifications looming...Theresa May spoke to Iranian president on the phone yesterday and today she is hosting Erdogan who is on a state visit to UK and meeting the Queen...

It would be foolish to think why would Theresa May the leader of a country with democratic values want to meet with a dictator killing and arresting intellectuals and kurds in his own country other than getting some lucrative deals signed!!! It is these selfish and short sighted moves by western countries that emboldens leaders in Iran snd Turkey and else where!

One would argue that  of course the Western governments are there to serve their own interests and don’t give a damn about drmocracy in those countries. Therefore it gives no one in western countries any rights to moan about human right issues when such double standards and hypocrisy exists.

Edited May 15, 2018 by kactus

[Rue]

I do think Kactus there are some maybe not the majority of Canadians who are aware of how many students in Iran have died or been tortured and let's of course not stop there and say trade unionists, journalists, human rights activists, etc. It's known. How well known I do not know. With fairness, former Iranians who fleed Iran in their own way try tell the story but many as you know are threatened for speaking out in Canada as they have family back in Iran.

I think it is important to say there is a temptation of smeering all Iranians for the fundamentalist regime that has hold of them. It is wrong. But then in my shoes, every time I come on this section of the forum I see the same anti Israel shrills lump all Jews, Israelis, Americans, Westerners, in negative stereotypes.

Its par for the course on political forums. I also have zero doubt as to the shrills for the Iranian government on this forum.

I openly expose my beliefs. I do not couch my religion or views. I think part of the problem with Iran is dealing with its extremist fundamentalist supporters who hide behind Anglo sounding names and don't have the balls to explain what their version of Shiite Islam actually entails not just for Israel and Jews but the entire world.

The fundamentalist extremists in Iran export a particular version of Shiite Islam that preaches hatred and violence against Christians, Jews, Kurds, Bahaiis, Bhuddists, Sunni Muslims.Yazidi, Zoroastreans to name but a few religions or ideologies. It also crushes and murders trade unionists, journalists, students, journalists, any politician who speaks out.

All that said, Iran is Persia one of the oldest civilizations of the world. Its history should not be forgotten and ironically it is.

The West tends to begin today's history of Iran once the Ayatollah came in and the Shah was replaced.

The Shah was no democrat. He supported modern democratic values but he ran a police state through his Gestapo the Savak and that should not be white-washed. Neither should the activities of Britain and the US after WW1 and 2,  turning Iran into a puppet monarchy regime to get its oil.

Its all part and parcel of today's history. Isolating it and simply looking at Iran today out of context to the long history before the Shah is inaccurate.

Again all that said, people do that with Israel, and the entire Middle East. They see the events in isolated time frames pulled from a greater context of interactions.

Now all that said, today in this present tense, I believe as much as I do not agree with many of the things Trump does or his personality, I do not confuse that with US foreign policy.

I believe the current regime in Iran is like Saudi Arabia using world addiction to oil to manipulate world events and client countries. How much of that happens without the greed of those nations I do not know.

I support a strong US presence in the world. I make no apologies. I think it offsets Chinese and Russian influences in a greater battle of hegemony between the three and while I appreciate the trendy left  hates the US I support it.

That said, I do not hate Iranians as a people and I hold in deference their culture and history and do not make actual Shiite Islam with the fundamentalist extremist version now being enforced by its ruling council.

I am not interested in anyone on this forum including you using your political hatred to rationalize demonizing any nation's people but I say we call out Iran's current regime for what it is a fascist theocracy exporting its version of violence. Ask Oncologist Hudson Jones how Dr. Jones was able to isolate the Zionist cancer gene  and demand it be wiped out but remains silent on how Iran exports violence across the world. Ask Marcus to admit his actual religious beliefs and why he supports Iran's current regime.

How about you, why won't  you admit you are a Muslim and the version of Islam you believe in and its political implications? Hmmm?

You can play high almighty with Bush Chaney over the US but I believe he is more upfront and honest about his views than you. I also believe while he is harsh on Iran's people, he'd be the first to support their attempts at achieving democracy. Then again I do not speak for him. I just read the full context of his comments as I do yours. I don't remove on response out of context. I follow his entire chain of comments as I do Hudson Jones'. Marcus' or yours.

Here let me say this so Hudson Jones hiding from this thread hears it-The Iranian REGIME is a cancer that needs to be wiped out.

Hey now. Imagine that.

[kactus]

43 minutes ago, Rue said:

I do think Kactus there are some maybe not the majority of Canadians who are aware of how many students in Iran have died or been tortured and let's of course not stop there and say trade unionists, journalists, human rights activists, etc. It's known. How well known I do not know. With fairness, former Iranians who fleed Iran in their own way try tell the story but many as you know are threatened for speaking out in Canada as they have family back in Iran.

I think it is important to say there is a temptation of smeering all Iranians for the fundamentalist regime that has hold of them. It is wrong. But then in my shoes, every time I come on this section of the forum I see the same anti Israel shrills lump all Jews, Israelis, Americans, Westerners, in negative stereotypes.

Its par for the course on political forums. I also have zero doubt as to the shrills for the Iranian government on this forum.

I openly expose my beliefs. I do not couch my religion or views. I think part of the problem with Iran is dealing with its extremist fundamentalist supporters who hide behind Anglo sounding names and don't have the balls to explain what their version of Shiite Islam actually entails not just for Israel and Jews but the entire world.

The fundamentalist extremists in Iran export a particular version of Shiite Islam that preaches hatred and violence against Christians, Jews, Kurds, Bahaiis, Bhuddists, Sunni Muslims.Yazidi, Zoroastreans to name but a few religions or ideologies. It also crushes and murders trade unionists, journalists, students, journalists, any politician who speaks out.

All that said, Iran is Persia one of the oldest civilizations of the world. Its history should not be forgotten and ironically it is.

The West tends to begin today's history of Iran once the Ayatollah came in and the Shah was replaced.

The Shah was no democrat. He supported modern democratic values but he ran a police state through his Gestapo the Savak and that should not be white-washed. Neither should the activities of Britain and the US after WW1 and 2,  turning Iran into a puppet monarchy regime to get its oil.

Its all part and parcel of today's history. Isolating it and simply looking at Iran today out of context to the long history before the Shah is inaccurate.

Again all that said, people do that with Israel, and the entire Middle East. They see the events in isolated time frames pulled from a greater context of interactions.

Now all that said, today in this present tense, I believe as much as I do not agree with many of the things Trump does or his personality, I do not confuse that with US foreign policy.

I believe the current regime in Iran is like Saudi Arabia using world addiction to oil to manipulate world events and client countries. How much of that happens without the greed of those nations I do not know.

I support a strong US presence in the world. I make no apologies. I think it offsets Chinese and Russian influences in a greater battle of hegemony between the three and while I appreciate the trendy left  hates the US I support it.

That said, I do not hate Iranians as a people and I hold in deference their culture and history and do not make actual Shiite Islam with the fundamentalist extremist version now being enforced by its ruling council.

I am not interested in anyone on this forum including you using your political hatred to rationalize demonizing any nation's people but I say we call out Iran's current regime for what it is a fascist theocracy exporting its version of violence. Ask Oncologist Hudson Jones how Dr. Jones was able to isolate the Zionist cancer gene  and demand it be wiped out but remains silent on how Iran exports violence across the world. Ask Marcus to admit his actual religious beliefs and why he supports Iran's current regime.

How about you, why won't  you admit you are a Muslim and the version of Islam you believe in and its political implications? Hmmm?

You can play high almighty with Bush Chaney over the US but I believe he is more upfront and honest about his views than you. I also believe while he is harsh on Iran's people, he'd be the first to support their attempts at achieving democracy. Then again I do not speak for him. I just read the full context of his comments as I do yours. I don't remove on response out of context. I follow his entire chain of comments as I do Hudson Jones'. Marcus' or yours.

Here let me say this so Hudson Jones hiding from this thread hears it-The Iranian REGIME is a cancer that needs to be wiped out.

Hey now. Imagine that.

Since you asked me and have an inclination to know my religious belief I tell you straight so there’s no ambiguity. I do not have a religion. I do find it absurd you want to expose me as a muslim by having a ‘foreign name’ as if that is a crime.....

As for Marcus or Hudson Jones I cannot speak on their behalf. Why would it bother me what they say as it is their opinion but it is clearly bothering you and have accused me time and time again to be the same person!?

But let’s set aside my religious or political motivations for now rue. 

What exactly is your issue with my last post stating my opinion!? 

Edited May 15, 2018 by kactus

[GostHacked]

1 hour ago, Rue said:

The Shah was no democrat. He supported modern democratic values but he ran a police state through his Gestapo the Savak and that should not be white-washed. Neither should the activities of Britain and the US after WW1 and 2,  turning Iran into a puppet monarchy regime to get its oil.

Yes this has been brought up before. But for those complaining we need to get back into Iran seem to forget that bit. And surprise surprise,  you have the UK's hands in it yet again.

 

[marcus]

On 5/11/2018 at 4:23 PM, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Just more symptoms of the same disease.

The tree of liberty requires blood from patriots and tyrants.

Some people want more blood. This is not good enough.

The moral authority has been responsible for overthrowing a democratic government to supporting a monster dictator who used chemical weapons in a war to now wanting to overthrow the current government, all against the same country.

 

Edited May 15, 2018 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

1 hour ago, marcus said:

Some people want more blood. This is not good enough.

The moral authority has been responsible for overthrowing a democratic government to supporting a monster dictator who used chemical weapons in a war to now wanting to overthrow the current government, all against the same country.

 

 

Nope...there is no "moral authority"...only economic and military power to pretend that there is.

Blood is a renewable resource...oil is not.    This has always been good enough.

[marcus]

9 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Nope...there is no "moral authority"...only economic and military power to pretend that there is.

Blood is a renewable resource...oil is not.    This has always been good enough.

I understand that you're unable to feel empathy and sympathy towards "others", considering your thirst and advocating for wars and bloodshed, but what about if you had a relative who went to war for the fossil companies, military industrial complex, and tribal b.s.? Is that blood also a renewable resource to you?

 

[bush_cheney2004]

13 minutes ago, marcus said:

I understand that you're unable to feel empathy and sympathy towards "others", considering your thirst and advocating for wars and bloodshed, but what about if you had a relative who went to war for the fossil companies, military industrial complex, and tribal b.s.? Is that blood also a renewable resource to you?

 

 

Of course...and it is not my thirst or idea. 

Cry all the tears you want or need to in comfy Canada...it changes nothing.

Edited May 15, 2018 by bush_cheney2004

[marcus]

14 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Of course...and it is not my thirst or idea. 

Cry all the tears you want or need to in comfy Canada...it changes nothing.

BC1919: It's not about my acceptance of women not allowed to vote. It is what it is.*shrug*

[CITIZEN_2015]

Iran regime mercenaries open fire on peaceful demonstrators as protest against the regime  sweeps Iran.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/703262/iran-protest-kazeroon-tehran-mullah-middle-east-politics-nuclear-deal-united-states

Reports of many dead and wounded..................

When a number arrived outside the Ministry of Intelligence and Security calling for other protesters to be released, regime forces opened fire.

At first they launched tear gas canisters before they shot into the crowd.

Horror scenes show people frantically running as a police station burns in the background. 

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/05/17/deadly-protests-continue-in-southern-iran-for-second-day-streets-look-war-torn.html

“Reports from a variety of sources are indicating anti-regime rallies and protests throughout the country, staged by people from all walks of life,” he said. “This includes teachers, college students, store-owners and bazaar merchants, credit firm clients seeking their stolen savings.”

 

Edited May 17, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015

[CITIZEN_2015]

As anti Islamic regime demonstrations and bazar closures and truck drivers and workers' strikes all spreading in Iran every day, the Islamic regime threatens that it will order its mecenary security forces to crack down on the nation even more.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-usa-unrest/iran-says-security-forces-to-clamp-down-on-protests-idUSKCN1IS0DY

In recent months many peaceful demonstrators have been shot dead by security forces and thousands arrested or forced to commit suicide in the prisons.

https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5272270,00.html

The regime as usual is using violence, threats and intimidations and mass arrests and lies (like Iran will becme Syria or Iraq) to scare and intimidate the nation away from a massive rise up or revolution who are demanding their legitimate rights and an end to the oppressive and corrupt Islamic regime.

 

Edited May 27, 2018 by CITIZEN_2015