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Providing proof/evidence that supports the US 911 Conspiracy Theory


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44 minutes ago, Omni said:

You do see that some of the pilots were actually trained in the US though. And I have explained how easy it would be to fly an airliner into a building even with a basic pilot training.

Again, I will quote a real expert, an actual pilot/aeronautical engineer who will clearly illustrate that you are not a pilot or you are lying in order to defend the most nonsensical conspiracy theory ever put forward. 

 

Quote

The Impossibility of Flying Heavy Aircraft Without Training
by Nila Sagadevan

Nila Sagadevan is an aeronautical engineer and a pilot.

There are some who maintain that the mythical 9/11 hijackers, although proven to be too incompetent to fly a little Cessna 172, had acquired the impressive skills that enabled them to fly airliners by training in flight simulators.

 What follows is an attempt to bury this myth once and for all, because I’ve heard this ludicrous explanation bandied about, ad nauseam, on the Internet and the TV networks—invariably by people who know nothing substantive about flight simulators, flying, or even airplanes.

...

A common misconception non-pilots have about simulators is how “easy” it is to operate them. They are indeed relatively easy to operate if the objective is to make a few lazy turns and frolic about in the “open sky”. But if the intent is to execute any kind of a maneuver with even the least bit of precision, the task immediately becomes quite daunting. And if the aim is to navigate to a specific geographic location hundreds of miles away while flying at over 500 MPH, 30,000 feet above the ground the challenges become virtually impossible for an untrained pilot.

And this, precisely, is what the four hijacker pilots who could not fly a Cessna around an airport by themselves are alleged to have accomplished in multi-ton, high-speed commercial jets on 9/11.

https://uncensored.co.nz/2010/08/15/nila-sagadevan-911-the-impossibility-of-flying-heavy-aircraft-without-training/

 

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I wonder when Michael Hardner will come back to answer the easy questions asked of him.

I'm also wondering where Omni fled to. There are a lot of easy questions that he has diligently been avoiding. 

The 911 Commission, the one Michael Hardner has before suggested is the real story, was a farce, a farce run by an Bush white house insider who wrote what they could study, how it would be studied and the results of the study, all before it even began, and there are actually people, like Michael, who still swear by such a total farce. 

Colonel Nelson [the airline accident investigator] was suspicious the first day. I went to the Pentagon and there were all these people lined up, picking up debris [everyone of you reading this knows this NEVER happens at an accident site] By day three they had identified all the terrorists, there's no way, that would have taken weeks to months to find that kind of evidence

[the above, in bold, paraphrased by me. For this and much much more, see, 

“9/11 Myths Exposed By Firefighters, Architects & Engineers"-PublicTV-58min

 

 

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2 hours ago, hot enough said:

Again, I will quote a real expert, an actual pilot/aeronautical engineer who will clearly illustrate that you are not a pilot or you are lying in order to defend the most nonsensical conspiracy theory ever put forward. 

 

 

Plenty of evidence around that a number of the 9-11 hijackers were trained in Florida, but you conspiracy theory types have your eyes wide shut so I'll leave you with that. And your little "pilot" giy you quote who may lack the credibility as do the rest of your sources should know you don't have to be a highly experienced pilot to simply take a plane already in cruise and aim it at a huge office tower. And I don't have a lot of time to mess with trolls.

http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/flight-schools-owned-buffett-eyed-wtc-probe-article-1.932719

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4 hours ago, Omni said:

Plenty of evidence around that a number of the 9-11 hijackers were trained in Florida, but you conspiracy theory types have your eyes wide shut so I'll leave you with that. And your little "pilot" giy you quote who may lack the credibility as do the rest of your sources should know you don't have to be a highly experienced pilot to simply take a plane already in cruise and aim it at a huge office tower. And I don't have a lot of time to mess with trolls.

http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/flight-schools-owned-buffett-eyed-wtc-probe-article-1.932719

Plenty of evidence around but yet again, ZERO EVIDENCE from the USOCT conspiracy theorist, a guy who makes up the lamest excuses as to why he can't provide any evidence. A guy who pretends to be a pilot, but who won't put himself out there like the honest, knowledgeable pilot/aeronautical engineer, Nila Sagadevan.

A guy who ignores tons of solid evidence and clings to the totally wacky myths perpetuated by the lyingest governments, USA, ever to plague the planet.

 

The thread is entitled "Providing proof/evidence that supports the US 911 Conspiracy Theory", and in 43 pages of this thread no one has ever provided any evidence for the wackiest ever conspiracy theory, the US government official conspiracy theory. 

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18 hours ago, hot enough said:

With all due respect, it doesn't matter what you THINK, Tostb, what matters is that not a one of the roughly 4 million parts has ever been connected to any of the 4 alleged planes of 911. That is something that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT, but there is much much more evidence that sinks the USOCT and, the truly incredible thing, absolutely no evidence FOR  the USGOCT.

But the gullible keep on pretending they believe.

The 767 that was alleged to have hit WTC2 had one engine fly thru the structure and land on Murray Street. That engine was identified but the trouble is it was an engine that WAS NOT USED in the United Airlines Boeing 767-200s. Another thing that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT.

All the evidence points clearly to whatever hits the towers, whatever hit the Pentagon, whatever was shot down in SV wasn't what was alleged or they would have matched parts, they would have done what they always do, gather all the parts and reassemble each plane in a hangar and do all the testing they can do to discover what can be discovered. 

But the gullible keep on pretending they believe.

The scientific evidence, the total impossibilities found within the USOCT which the USGOCT conspiracy theorists like Omni, Michael Hardner, ... totally ignore shows that it clearly WAS NOT 19 Arab hijackers. 

But for whatever totally crazy, illogical reasons, these gullible folks keep on pretending they believe.

Ah so 911 didn't actually happen, it was everybody's collective imagination :D

Are we in the Matrix here?

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22 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

What you're missing is the risk involved.  Somebody who already has billions wouldn't be willing to invest billions if the risk is prosecution and losing everything.  How much would it cost to ensure the silence of thousands of people involved ?  100K per person ?  How would you enforce silence ?  I think you would have to have zero paper trail and zero electronic footprint on communication which would make the project exceedingly complex.  

My experience is that people who buy into these theories lack a basic understanding of organization.  Without motive, resources, risk/reward, no conspiracy like this could be greenlit.  When you look at those elements, the 'inside job' theory falls apart immediately.

No, people are more than willing to take these risks. Look around you, everything you see that was touched by humans someone took a risk and many that make these decisions are well off enough they don't have to work another day in their lives yet they keep on taking risks to advance their wealth. Without the willingness to take risks we would still be Africa living in caves and grass huts. 

Examples would be the likes of Hitler, he had it all but decided it wasn't enough, The Arab spring is another, the 2008 crash was another that several billionaires took huge risks and none of them went to prison in that case. Look at the mess in Asia with manufacturing, many billionaires are more than happy to take huge risks to make money and they know they can with a few cronies in the right places and the consuming public on their side they will be free and clear.

You don't have to pay off anybody, all you need is to make sure you have a few people at the top working with you to produce an official story that doesn't incriminate you. All you need is the majority of the population to believe you and call those that question the actual series of events crazy.  People like HE further advance the "conspiracy nuts" attitude, it's also human nature as observers to go to extremes (left and right in politics is a perfect example...). The people that witnessed the actual event can say what they want, unless they can sway public opinion and someone at the top sees their future on the line nothing is going to change the official story.  

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On ‎2017‎-‎10‎-‎04 at 8:01 PM, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Actually seven buildings in New York city alone. And only the world trade center buildings http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/collapse.html  wierd...

The whole official story is "weird". This incident only shows us that the globalist elite can do whatever they want to without any consequences happening to them. The shadow government does exist. Maybe Omni and MH are on their payroll. Just saying.  :D

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5 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Ah so 911 didn't actually happen, it was everybody's collective imagination :D

Are we in the Matrix here?

Why to you go to such nonsensical extremes? I have never suggested that 911 didn't happen. The science and the facts say that it never happened in the manner of the USGOCT. The science and the evidence says, unequivocally, the USGOCT is impossible. 

AGAIN! 

1. what matters is that not a one of the roughly 4 million parts has ever been connected to any of the 4 alleged planes of 911. That is something that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT, but there is much much more evidence that sinks the USOCT and, the truly incredible thing, absolutely no evidence FOR  the USGOCT.

Have you ever heard of such a crazy thing happening, four planes crash and none of the parts are connected to the purported crashed planes?

2. The 767 that was alleged to have hit WTC2 had one engine fly thru the structure and land on Murray Street. That engine was identified but the trouble is it was an engine that WAS NOT USED in the United Airlines Boeing 767-200s. Another thing that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT.

It was not the engine that was installed in UA175 which means it was not UA175 that hit WTC2. 

3. All the evidence points clearly to whatever hits the towers, whatever hit the Pentagon, whatever was shot down in SV wasn't what was alleged or they would have matched parts, they would have done what they always do, gather all the parts and reassemble each plane in a hangar and do all the testing they can do to discover what can be discovered. 

Isn't this how it actually works in reality, in your world, in everyone's world? Serial numbered parts are actually matched to the crash debris. Standard crash protocol. 

Just with this much scientific evidence, the total impossibilities found within the USOCT which the USGOCT conspiracy theorists like Omni, Michael Hardner, ... totally ignore shows that it clearly WAS NOT 19 Arab hijackers. 

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5 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

No, people are more than willing to take these risks. Look around you, everything you see that was touched by humans someone took a risk and many that make these decisions are well off enough they don't have to work another day in their lives yet they keep on taking risks to advance their wealth. Without the willingness to take risks we would still be Africa living in caves and grass huts. 

You totally destroyed Michael H's desperate meme, Tostb. Michael knows it's just planned deception/distraction he is engaging in because nobody can suggest they live in reality and ignore all the impossibilities of the totally crazy USGOCT. 

 

Quote

People like HE further advance the "conspiracy nuts" attitude, it's also human nature as observers to go to extremes (left and right in politics is a perfect example...). The people that witnessed the actual event can say what they want, unless they can sway public opinion and someone at the top sees their future on the line nothing is going to change the official story.  

Then you, yourself, go into the same state of delusion. How can you deny all the science, the evidence put forward that shows you believe in total impossibilities? 

Impossibilities that you won't address, you don't try to counter.

Edited by hot enough
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1 hour ago, GostHacked said:

This may help some of the narrative.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=vvk0A0KTc1M

I fail to see how a narrative is helped with a conglomeration of speculation and innuendo with very little of any type of fact. I guess conspiracy theorists must lay awake at night thinking up another one. Holograms of airplanes flying into buildings. What nonsense.

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41 minutes ago, hot enough said:

Why to you go to such nonsensical extremes? I have never suggested that 911 didn't happen. The science and the facts say that it never happened in the manner of the USGOCT. The science and the evidence says, unequivocally, the USGOCT is impossible. 

AGAIN! 

1. what matters is that not a one of the roughly 4 million parts has ever been connected to any of the 4 alleged planes of 911. That is something that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT, but there is much much more evidence that sinks the USOCT and, the truly incredible thing, absolutely no evidence FOR  the USGOCT.

Have you ever heard of such a crazy thing happening, four planes crash and none of the parts are connected to the purported crashed planes?

2. The 767 that was alleged to have hit WTC2 had one engine fly thru the structure and land on Murray Street. That engine was identified but the trouble is it was an engine that WAS NOT USED in the United Airlines Boeing 767-200s. Another thing that in and of itself totally sinks the USOCT.

It was not the engine that was installed in UA175 which means it was not UA175 that hit WTC2. 

3. All the evidence points clearly to whatever hits the towers, whatever hit the Pentagon, whatever was shot down in SV wasn't what was alleged or they would have matched parts, they would have done what they always do, gather all the parts and reassemble each plane in a hangar and do all the testing they can do to discover what can be discovered. 

Isn't this how it actually works in reality, in your world, in everyone's world? Serial numbered parts are actually matched to the crash debris. Standard crash protocol. 

Just with this much scientific evidence, the total impossibilities found within the USOCT which the USGOCT conspiracy theorists like Omni, Michael Hardner, ... totally ignore shows that it clearly WAS NOT 19 Arab hijackers. 

Not sure if you understand the purpose of gathering components and reassembling the aircraft in a warehouse. They do this exercise to establish the cause of the incident. I'd think even you can see the causes of these wrecks is no real mystery. Just incase you missed it these aircraft were driven into their demise, mechanical failure had nothing to do with it...

Are the people that were aboard these aircraft missing? If so, where are they? 

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11 minutes ago, Omni said:

I fail to see how a narrative is helped with a conglomeration of speculation and innuendo with very little of any type of fact. I guess conspiracy theorists must lay awake at night thinking up another one.

You are self describing, Omni. Remember, you have never provided any evidence in a thread specifically devoted to that. You lie about being a pilot or you lied about piloting. You ignore stark realities and throw out dumps of conspiracy theorist crap that you can't even address/discuss yourself.

And here now, you continue to illustrate your stunning hypocrisy. You never addressed anything that was in the video to either confirm it or refute it. Instead you attack the poster when you haven't come remotely close to doing what the forum rules suggest:

"Mapleleafweb operates these forums in the hopes that they will promote intelligent, honest and responsible discussion. We encourage you to speak your mind on relevant issues in a thoughtful way."

If the contents of the video are so devoid of fact, why wouldn't you, supposedly a pilot, be able to point these things out?

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2 minutes ago, hot enough said:

If the contents of the video are so devoid of fact, why wouldn't you, supposedly a pilot, be able to point these things out?

Lost count of how often that has been done, and not only by me. I'm still waiting for you response as to how many tonnes of explosive would have had to be secretly installed in the towers, and how that was done. Until you can answer that one, I'll leave you to wallow in the "troother" nonsense. 

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16 minutes ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Not sure if you understand the purpose of gathering components and reassembling the aircraft in a warehouse. They do this exercise to establish the cause of the incident.

Are the people that were aboard these aircraft missing? If so, where are they? 

You obviously do not know that justice and the rule of law demand that all investigations are done in the same lawful fashion. Most of the steel was shipped overseas. Numerous top fire investigators demanded it stop because laws were being broken. 

But what is so totally incomprehensible in your replies is your inability to look at the facts/evidence/science. Instead you throw up another non sequitur.

Quote

I'd think even you can see the causes of these wrecks is no real mystery. Just in case you missed it these aircraft were driven into their demise, mechanical failure had nothing to do with it...

 What wrecks? Again, you won't face up to reality.

How did UA175, a 767-200, magically get an engine that went in different airplanes. How did not one of roughly 4 million parts get matched to the alleged planes?

How did US government/military non-commercially available naonthermite get into WTC dust? How did 6% of WTC dust come to be iron microspheres, which are one of the by products of nanothermite/thermate reactions? 

How did Arab hijackers, who only brought jet fuel to the party, managed to melt/vaporize steel [2,750F/4,900F, vaporize lead [3,180F], melt molybdenum [4,700F], when jet fuel and office furnishings only burned at around 1,500F?

Why is there no evidence for the hijackers?

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16 minutes ago, Omni said:

Lost count of how often that has been done, and not only by me. I'm still waiting for you response as to how many tonnes of explosive would have had to be secretly installed in the towers, and how that was done. Until you can answer that one, I'll leave you to wallow in the "troother" nonsense. 

Neither this post or your reply to GostHacked in any way comes close to,

"Mapleleafweb operates these forums in the hopes that they will promote intelligent, honest and responsible discussion. We encourage you to speak your mind on relevant issues in a thoughtful way."

An equally crazy thing in all this is that an ex-moderator does this same thing as you. 

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1 minute ago, hot enough said:

You have never provided any evidence nor have you ever discussed any evidence because you know that when you do so you immediately stick your foot in your mouth. 

So you once again ignore a valid question. You lose again.

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54 minutes ago, hot enough said:

Then you, yourself, go into the same state of delusion. How can you deny all the science, the evidence put forward that shows you believe in total impossibilities? 

Impossibilities that you won't address, you don't try to counter.

Is this the same "science" used in Star Wars etc. ? Remember, just like the "official" story, counter arguments can be as real or fictional as the resources we have at our fingertips, today the limit is our imagination. It's possible for anybody  to even make smurfs the cause of 911 look real on YouTube. Quoting experts that no one has heard of or behind their backs is not outside the realm of possibilities either. 

Stating aircraft didn't strike the twin towers is a bit out there, the pentagon and Pennsylvania I don't know. Were these the aircraft they say they were I don't know, the families of the people aboard those aircraft might argue they were. 

I'm pretty sure aircraft struck the towers, I don't believe they caused the towers to collapse into their own footprints as well as cause so much damage to only the other buildings of the world trade center and no irreparable damage to others right next to them. 

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11 minutes ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

I don't believe they caused the towers to collapse into their own footprints

One of the things the conspiracists keep trying to say is that the towers fell at "freefall", yet in at least one of the videos a huge chunk breaks off of one of the towers as it goes down, and you can quite clearly see how much faster it falls, which is actually at freefall. And yes of course, what happened to all of those people in those airplanes if there were no airplanes. It's hard to wrap ones head around how people could be so easily led astray without addressing basic reality. There seems to be a segment of our society that is quite willing to be so led. 

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38 minutes ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Is this the same "science" used in Star Wars etc. ? Remember, just like the "official" story, counter arguments can be as real or fictional as the resources we have at our fingertips, today the limit is our imagination. It's possible for anybody  to even make smurfs the cause of 911 look real on YouTube. Quoting experts that no one has heard of or behind their backs is not outside the realm of possibilities either. 

Why waste so much time writing nonsense? Is the adult/rational thing to do is discuss these impossibilities in the USOCT?

Stating aircraft didn't strike the twin towers is a bit out there,

Where did I do that? I didn't. I never have. Pointing out that the engine that flew out of WTC2 immediately following the impact WAS NOT the type of engine used in the 767-200s, which UA175, the plane alleged to have hit WTC2, was. 

the pentagon and Pennsylvania I don't know. Were these the aircraft they say they were I don't know, the families of the people aboard those aircraft might argue they were. 

It can't be that the twin towers were Arab hijackers and the Pentagon and SV were somebody else. Is this what you are suggesting?

The families aren't some special scientists. They have no clue either, especially if they accept the USOCT. I don't say they do/did. Are you aware of the number of families that do not accept the USOCT?

I'm pretty sure aircraft struck the towers, I don't believe they caused the towers to collapse into their own footprints as well as cause so much damage to only the other buildings of the world trade center and no irreparable damage to others right next to them. 

 

No offense, but you seem to be very confused, which is totally understandable given the vast number of US government lies about 911. 

If you don't believe the twin towers collapses were caused by the jet impacts/fires, you don't believe the USGOCT. And they weren't, because they fell at close to free fall speed, but the real USOCT killer is that they fell at accelerating speed, which is totally impossible according to Newton's laws of motion, which I trust you believe in.

There was no jolt, no slowing down of the upper sections of the twin towers when they impacted the much much much stronger in terms of both steel size and steel volume; the steel was also stone cold below the impact zones.

[And the steel in the impact zones was also not heated to any temperatures close to that needed to cause failure.]

Only by removing the resistance/structural steel below the collapse zones could the upper sections have moved at accelerating speeds. The only thing that can make that happen is controlled demolition/explosives.

You do know that OBL had nothing at all to do with 911, don't you? Why do you think the US government would lie about that?

Edited by hot enough
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