Omni Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 33 minutes ago, JamesHackerMP said: Tres appropeau, n'est-ce pas? Oui. C'est vrai. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, JamesHackerMP said: I'm sorry Betsy, who died and appointed you Pope?[/quote] Omni freely admits that his argument on this topic, is off-topic! Quote Omni That's because we have had the good sense to separate church from state, and lets make sure we keep it that way. OK by you? Quote Omni When I speak about separating church from state I speak for the majority, not just myself. He wants to talk about separation of state and church. Quote Be Polite and Respect Others Mapleleafweb operates these forums in the hopes that they will promote intelligent, honest and responsible discussion. We encourage you to speak your mind on relevant issues in a thoughtful way. Please respect others using this board and treat them with respect and dignity. Omni should show some respect for the author of this thread. Quote It is also important that you stay on topic and keep the discussion focused. If the thread begins to wonder off into a new topic area, start a new thread and continue the discussion under the new thread. http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/guidelines/ Actually, it was you, James, who'd expressed exasperation over the thread derailment a while back. Quote JamesHackerMP Jesus, guys...weren't we talking about the bible or something? I seem to have suddenly contracted temporary amnesia, and it seems to be catching. Thus I posted a reminder to stay on topic. Quote I think you've done a pretty good job of derailing it yourself. I respect the fact that other people have a different view than me. However, you don't have to present your own views with such smugness. That won't spread the word of Jesus Christ, the good news, or save souls. It only turns people off. When making an argument, especially a religious one, it's best to keep in mind that you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. You're trying to shove pseudo-scientific arguments down our throats, and when we have the awful temerity to disagree with you, we're either idiots or somehow un-Christian. And on that note: Why do you notice the splinter in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove that splinter from your eye,' while the wooden beam is in your own eye? You hypocrite, remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother's eye. (Matthew 7:3-5) Translation: I cannot refute betsy's argument.....therefore, I'll try attacking her from a different angle. I'll use Omni! Nice try. Edited June 27, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 (edited) The Creator has intimate knowledge of His creation, another evidence is given to indicate the divine inspiration of the Bible, by revealing detailed knowledge of the physical world that was not understood by ‘science’ until many centuries, if not millennia, later. The preceding post about Matthew Maury had mentioned the shape of earth, let's add it to the evidence being given:The Earth is RoundIsaiah 40 22 It is He who sits above the circle of the earth, The pictures we often see - taken from space - show the earth appears as a circle since it is round.Job 26 10 He drew a circular horizon on the face of the waters, At the boundary of light and darkness. That looks like a perfect round to me. Quote Horizon 1. the line or circle that forms the apparent boundary between earth and sky. 2. Astronomy. 1. the small circle of the celestial sphere whose plane is tangent to the earth at the position of a given observer, or the plane of such a circle (sensible horizon) 2. Also called rational horizon. the great circle of the celestial sphere whose plane passes through the center of the earth and is parallel to the sensible horizon of a given position, or the plane of such a circle (celestial horizon) Horizon | Define Horizon at Dictionary.com Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTM Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, betsy said: The Creator has intimate knowledge of His creation, another evidence is given to indicate the divine inspiration of the Bible, by revealing detailed knowledge of the physical world that was not understood by ‘science’ until many centuries, if not millennia, later. The preceding post about Matthew Maury had mentioned the shape of earth, let's add it to the evidence being given:The Earth is RoundIsaiah 40 22 It is He who sits above the circle of the earth, The pictures we often see - taken from space - show the earth appears as a circle since it is round.Job 26 10 He drew a circular horizon on the face of the waters, At the boundary of light and darkness. Horizon | Define Horizon at Dictionary.com The ancient Hebrews believed in a flat circular earth. Ancient Hebrew cosmology With supporting bible passages Like with the rest of your "the creator has intimate knowledge of his creation" posts, you are cherry picking passages, and then misrepresenting or distorting their plain meaning to fit a modern scientific world view Edited June 27, 2017 by TTM better link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 9 minutes ago, TTM said: Like with the rest of your "the creator has intemate knowledge of his creation posts", you are cherry picking passages, and then misrepresenting or distorting their plain meaning to fit a modern scientific world view I think you hit the nail right on the head there. I assume those who are so infatuated by the bible can manipulate any words therein to conform to actual science that certainly didn't exist when those words were written. I guess "hijacking" would be an appropriate term to use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTM Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 10 minutes ago, Omni said: I think you hit the nail right on the head there. I assume those who are so infatuated by the bible can manipulate any words therein to conform to actual science that certainly didn't exist when those words were written. I guess "hijacking" would be an appropriate term to use? The bible can and has been used to support pretty much any argument, and usually both sides at the same time. Why should it be any different wrt science? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 3 minutes ago, TTM said: The bible can and has been used to support pretty much any argument, and usually both sides at the same time. Why should it be any different wrt science? I'm still waiting for the biblical explanation of gravity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTM Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 5 minutes ago, Omni said: I'm still waiting for the biblical explanation of gravity. And I'm waiting for the scientific explanation for talking snakes. I have a feeling we'll both be waiting for some time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 1 minute ago, TTM said: And I'm waiting for the scientific explanation for talking snakes. I have a feeling we'll both be waiting for some time... Maybe if snakes learned to talk they wouldn't scare the hell out of me like they have done. In the meantime I have to work with a rather scientifically based version of weight and center of gravity. Aircraft seem to abide by it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 6 minutes ago, Omni said: Maybe if snakes learned to talk they wouldn't scare the hell out of me like they have done. In the meantime I have to work with a rather scientifically based version of weight and center of gravity. Aircraft seem to abide by it. How much do you weigh, Ma'am? 135 I mean in pounds... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted June 27, 2017 Report Share Posted June 27, 2017 Metallicity is a clincher for me. Either the Christian God wastes a lot of his/hers/its time and ours or we simply were NOT created at the beginning of anything. More like right in the middle and other worlds had to be born, live and DIE to make our star/planets. Beautiful... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHackerMP Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) I don't think we're going to make any headway arguing with Betsy; we probably should have realized ten pages ago that she isn't interested in a discussion. There are some people who, when you disagree with them, take it personally. And since she thinks she has God on her side that makes it worse. If she wants to sit in a corner agreeing with herself the whole time, so be it. I won't be a part of that. She already started another thread where all but one of the posts were from herself, basically talking to herself the whole time. Never argue with a fool or a drunk. Maybe it's the communion wine, who knows. Edited June 28, 2017 by JamesHackerMP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) 15 hours ago, TTM said: The ancient Hebrews believed in a flat circular earth. Ancient Hebrew cosmology With supporting bible passages Like with the rest of your "the creator has intimate knowledge of his creation" posts, you are cherry picking passages, and then misrepresenting or distorting their plain meaning to fit a modern scientific world view Well, like the rest of those who try to criticize the Bible, your source hasn't really given thought to what he's saying. Let's take a look at 1 Chronicles 16. He argues that the earth is immovable, he gave: 1 Chronicles 16:30: “He has fixed the earth firm, immovable.” He not only chopped off the rest of the statement, but he also edited most of them! He did the same to all other verses he gave. Your source wasn't getting what the verses are actually saying. Yo, It doesn't say the earth is sitting still, in one place, and not moving at all. Why do these folks resort to dishonesty? Whom are they fooling - except themselves? Think about it. Trying to distort the truth - who gets really hurt in the end? Here are the full statement: 1 Chron 16 30 Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved. Psalm 93 1 The Lord reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the Lord is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved. Psalm 96 10 Say among the heathen that the Lord reigneth: the world also shall be established that it shall not be moved: he shall judge the people righteously. Isn't the earth stable in its course? Isn't it on its axis? Are we ricocheting all over the universe like a pinball? Your source is also making a big deal out of the term "vault"......claiming it's solid. Well, ladihdihdahdah.....that's why I said the Bible is full of figures of speech that you can't really say what's to be taken literally until it's proven otherwise! Why do you think I "cherry-pick" only those that have been reaffirmed by science? Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 Well.........talk about a boomerang! Refer to post #538. Thanks to TTM's post for this. The Creator has intimate knowledge of His creation, another evidence is given to indicate the divine inspiration of the Bible, by revealing detailed knowledge of the physical world that was not understood by ‘science’ until many centuries, if not millennia, later. AXIAL TILT 1 Chron 16 30 Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved. What is an axis? 1 the imaginary line around which a large round object, such as the Earth, turns The Earth rotates on an axis between the north and south poles. http://www.ldoceonline.com/Earth sciences-topic/axis Earth goes on a steady course. Whatever slight nutation, and wobble it goes through, is part of it. Quote Earth’s Axis: This is what is known axial tilt, where a planet’s vertical axis is tilted a certain degree towards the ecliptic of the object it orbits (in this case, the Sun). Such a tilt results in there being a difference in how much sunlight reaches a given point on the surface during the course of a year. In the case of Earth, the axis is tilted towards the ecliptic of the Sun at approximately 23.44° (or 23.439281° to be exact). Seasonal Variations: This tilt in Earth’s axis is what is responsible for seasonal changes during the course of the year. When the North Pole is pointed towards the Sun, the northern hemisphere experiences summer and the southern hemisphere experiences winter. When the South Pole is pointed towards the Sun, six months later, the situation is reversed. https://www.universetoday.com/47176/earths-axis/ Quote Orbit and Rotation As Earth orbits the sun, it completes one rotation every 23.9 hours. It takes 365.25 days to complete one trip around the sun. That extra quarter of a day presents a challenge to our calendar system, which counts one year as 365 days. To keep our yearly calendars consistent with our orbit around the sun, every four years we add one day. That day is called a leap day, and the year it's added to is called a leap year. Earth's axis of rotation is tilted 23.4 degrees with respect to the plane of Earth's orbit around the sun. This tilt causes our yearly cycle of seasons. During part of the year, the northern hemisphere is tilted toward the sun and the southern hemisphere is tilted away. With the sun higher in the sky, solar heating is greater in the north producing summer there. Less direct solar heating produces winter in the south. Six months later, the situation is reversed. When spring and fall begin, both hemispheres receive roughly equal amounts of heat from the sun. https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/planets/earth/indepth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) I just added a video to the Earth is Round post, #528. Check it out. It's cool. Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 17 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: How much do you weigh, Ma'am? 135 I mean in pounds... Ohhhh......that reminds me of something. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTM Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 4 hours ago, betsy said: Well, ladihdihdahdah.....that's why I said the Bible is full of figures of speech that you can't really say what's to be taken literally until it's proven otherwise! Why do you think I "cherry-pick" only those that have been reaffirmed by science? Thanks for proving my point. At least you are honest about your intellectual dishonesty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 1 hour ago, betsy said: Ohhhh......that reminds me of something. Thanks. Aviation humor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTM Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 10 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Aviation humor. That makes sense ... flew right over my head 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHackerMP Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 I still can't agree that the Bible is trying to teach us scientific truths of some sort, or supports them. I stand by my statement that science and religion are matter and anti-matter. That's about as scientific as it gets. Why don't we put that aside for the moment, since we clearly are talking at cross purposes. What about the social and moral rules set down in the OT? Do you really live like that in every way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, JamesHackerMP said: I still can't agree that the Bible is trying to teach us scientific truths of some sort, or supports them. What's there to disagree about it? I've been hammering it on your head for so long now...... the Bible is not trying to teach us science! Are you debating with someone else about this? You confuse me with some other posters? ....or, all these evidences made you dizzy, perhaps? Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, JamesHackerMP said: Why don't we put that aside for the moment, since we clearly are talking at cross purposes. Yep. Take a break. Have a cold one. You need to lie down - take deep breaths - it might help clear it up for you. A cold towel on your forehead may do some wonders, too. Quote What about the social and moral rules set down in the OT? Do you really live like that in every way? Like earth on its axis - I have my own course about this thread. Start that thread and we'll get down to it. Are you sure you're up to it? Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, TTM said: Thanks for proving my point. At least you are honest about your intellectual dishonesty. Hahahaha Intellectual dishonesty? Review post #538 and #539. Was it the "boomerang" that got to you? Honestly, I never thought about axial tilt, or axis. That wasn't on my list. That's priceless. Who would've thought you'd end up contributing one for me? Edited June 28, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted June 28, 2017 Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 17 hours ago, JamesHackerMP said: basically talking to herself the whole time. You must though, admit she is good at imoji's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted June 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2017 Quote 17 hours ago, JamesHackerMP said: basically talking to herself the whole time. Of course, how can I not basically end up talking to myself........ when you're practically rendered speechless! Whatever it is you manage to utter....is nonsense, or irrelevant.....that you might just as well have said nothing at all! You're all behaving like deer caught in the headlights! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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