There is nothing to discuss

[Altai]

What is discuss and why people discuss ? 

Discuss is to have communication with other people about the things which you dont have enough information. People discuss on request of making their believes facts despite its not.  If we would have enough information of it, we would not discuss anything because informations have to be truth/fact, this is why they are called information. Is not it stupid to discuss about the things which we dont have enough information of it ? 

So "discuss" is soo stupid. Only ignorant people discuss. They discuss because they dont have enough information. Telling personal ideas about something which you dont have enough information is ignorance, its idiotic and stupid, whatever you call it.

We can only share informations with each other, we cant discuss, if we are reasonable persons. 

[blackbird]

People "discuss" things as a form of social interaction.  Do you understand what I mean by social interaction?   A person does not have to have a lot of information.  If we don't discuss anything, then we don't really get to know other people.  Sometimes we learn something from someone else that we never thought of.  Sharing information and opinion is part of life.   I am surprised you don't think discussion is a good idea.  If you can't discuss things with people, you may have a hard time in life.  It is important to learn to discuss things with people.  These forums are a good way to learn.

[scribblet]

There is certainly nothing to discuss if everyone is on ignore.

[Ash74]

17 hours ago, Altai said:

What is discuss and why people discuss ? 

Discuss is to have communication with other people about the things which you dont have enough information. People discuss on request of making their believes facts despite its not.  If we would have enough information of it, we would not discuss anything because informations have to be truth/fact, this is why they are called information. Is not it stupid to discuss about the things which we dont have enough information of it ? 

So "discuss" is soo stupid. Only ignorant people discuss. They discuss because they dont have enough information. Telling personal ideas about something which you dont have enough information is ignorance, its idiotic and stupid, whatever you call it.

We can only share informations with each other, we cant discuss, if we are reasonable persons. 

But how many of your posts have been given with only information that has been told to you by personal Sources? 

Reasonable people do not come on a forum and ignore people for posting a different point of view. That is childish and with your posts you have proven to be an intelligent young lady. I may disagree with you but I have always thought you start great debates.

[Altai]

9 hours ago, scribblet said:

There is certainly nothing to discuss if everyone is on ignore.

Hi and bye, you have been ignored and you will stay there forever  

[scribblet]

Good stuff, thank you.

[Wilber]

Now we can discuss Altai and she won't know.

[Ash74]

1 hour ago, Wilber said:

Now we can discuss Altai and she won't know.

Blahahahhhhahhahaa

No, I have a feeling she likes to look and see what the many many many people on her ignore list are saying about her.

[Altai]

On 11.04.2017 at 7:56 AM, Ash74 said:

But how many of your posts have been given with only information that has been told to you by personal Sources? 

Reasonable people do not come on a forum and ignore people for posting a different point of view. That is childish and with your posts you have proven to be an intelligent young lady. I may disagree with you but I have always thought you start great debates.

I apologize if I have ever present any personal claims of me as being "facts". I dont think I did such a thing. So I have never offered my personal claims as being facts while I always offer people to prove their claims. I also have topics for it. Can you show me a post of mine which is my personal claim but offered as "fact" ? 

Reasonable people does not reject logic. If you reject that 2x2=4 and if you cant back up your claim, I will ignore you. For example do you remember why I was ignored you ? Lets find it out and see why you were ignored and we will also see who is childish. 

Edited April 15, 2017 by Altai

[Altai]

On 10.04.2017 at 8:31 PM, blackbird said:

People "discuss" things as a form of social interaction.  Do you understand what I mean by social interaction?   A person does not have to have a lot of information.  If we don't discuss anything, then we don't really get to know other people.  Sometimes we learn something from someone else that we never thought of.  Sharing information and opinion is part of life.   I am surprised you don't think discussion is a good idea.  If you can't discuss things with people, you may have a hard time in life.  It is important to learn to discuss things with people.  These forums are a good way to learn.

If you want to know other people, you have to ask questions expecting a reply which includes an information. This is not discuss but this is information exchange. You need to read the first post again, appearently  you didnt read it or you dont try to understand despite its quite clear.

[blackbird]

Yes, OK.  I just read it again.  I like the idea of information exchange.  I agree.

[Altai]

12 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Yes, OK.  I just read it again.  I like the idea of information exchange.  I agree.

So I mean endless dogfights while I say "discuss" or offering personal and sided considerations as being facts. This is stupid and no reasonable persons would act in this way. We can only share informations and we can search for informations. 

[Ash74]

13 hours ago, Altai said:

Reasonable people does not reject logic. If you reject that 2x2=4 and if you cant back up your claim, I will ignore you. For example do you remember why I was ignored you ? Lets find it out and see why you were ignored and we will also see who is childish. 

If memory serves it was because I disagreed with your plan to take over the world by giving away shoes. 

Care to discuss the logic in That? 

[Altai]

5 hours ago, Ash74 said:

If memory serves it was because I disagreed with your plan to take over the world by giving away shoes. 

Care to discuss the logic in That? 

You were ignored for distorting the meanings of my words. You are still doing the same thing.  

Below why you were ignored;

First I started a topic about an idea of mine and I said; 

Quote

....I want a World where all the people live fairly. All people should be able to benefit equally from the opportunities of the World. I was born in the World and people who was arrived the World before me dont have such a right to limit my rights....
....All the needs of people should be met by the state for free. .... You will have a nice house with a nice kitchen, you will have a nice car, you will have your daily need of food. We will just be expected to make our job as happy persons without any concerns about daily life.....

Then the poster named @Goddess was replied and said; 

Quote

 

Few children know what they want to do for the rest of their lives.  

And many adults who genuinely enjoyed their jobs, get to a point in life where they want to try a new career.  I did.  

Your system seems to be VERY freedom-limiting.

 

And I replied this poster and I said;

Quote

 

As I said, we can shape the system together. Instead of trying to kick my sand castle, you should help me to strengthen its walls. 

This is a good point, people cannot always make the right decisions in their life and they may need some changes. Our aim is happy persons. We cant force people to do a job which they dont want to do. This will cause an unhappy society and unsuccessful business life. 

My system will help you to change your job.

 

and again this poster named @Goddess said that; 

Quote

I am strengthening its walls. I'm showing you where they are weak.

Then I replied another poster and I said that;

Quote

Yes, even middle and low class has their own properties and this is injustice. I want my share from their properties, I want my share from Jamaica, I want my share from Iceland, I want my share from Northern Korea. I was born in the World and I have rights in each peace of lands of the World. 

I was trying to explain we have no right to own World because its our common property, ofcourse I cant live everywhere at the same time but we should be able to go whereever we want in the World, man made borders should not restrict us.


and the poster named @Goddess replied me again and said;

Quote

 

There are a lot of "I"s in your statement.  A lot of assertions about your "rights".  

I hope your system would take into account other people's rights as well.  

The other thing that bothers me is that you would not be able to live in ALL areas of the world at the same time.  There might be a place that you prefer to live.  Why on earth would you think you have the "right" to come into some other person's area of the world as a VISITOR and demand your "rights" from the people who actually live there?  The people who actually live in certain areas know the climate, know the area.  You would not.

Your system seems to be made for YOU only.

Also, I like having a place of my own.  I imagine a lot of people feel that way - it's human nature.  I wouldn't want to live under your system where Altai's "rights"  and "wants" override everyone else's.  I wouldn't want to live under your system with Altai being the one who makes all my decisions (besides the color of shoes I want to wear, apparently I can choose that for myself.)

 

So this poster was trying its best to distort my words. In that topic, when I used the personal pronoun "I", I was using it in behalf of whole the World people. I also used many "you" too but this poster didnt said "Ohh you were using soo much -you-, do you want to devote your life to other people ?".  I also used pronoun "we", I said "World people". As I said, this poster was just trying to create problems and it was just trying to kick my sand castle. 

And I replied it and I said; 

Quote

I started to think that you are trying to troll my topics.

and this poster named @Goddess replied me and said; 

Quote

 

...........or maybe we just have similar interests ??

You originally said that you welcomed feedback, but I see now that you actually do not.  If you only want people to say how wonderful your plan is, then perhaps you should stipulate that.

In the meantime, I will continue to post on and read whatever topics interest me.

See how "rights" work?

 

So it thinks that distorting the meaning the words is a "feedback" and nothing else. 


It again replied me and said that; 

Quote

If you are old enough to post on a political forum, then you should be old enough to receive some criticisms of your ideas.  You should be able to recognize the value of critisms. 

So it still thinks that distorting the meaning of what people say is just a critism. 


and I replied it and I said; 

Quote

 

I have really no tolerance against people who deliiberately try to distort my words or try his/her best not to understand something. I like to discuss with open minded and good intentioned person, also no open minded person would be bad intentioned.

I really dont think that you are a good intentioned person. Despite its quite clear that I defend the rights all of the World people in this topic and while I am trying to explain it by citing examples from myself behalf of all the World people, you are deliberately trying to distort it and trying to tout me as a dictator who is working for her own interests.

 

So this poster complately took all my posts out of the context because of I used pronoun "I" and "my" and it blamed me of trying to be a dictator. 


and I put it in my ignore list. So I didnt ignore it for being disagree with me, I ignored it for inflammatory remarks just to annoy people, I put it in ignore for persistently trying to create conflict without contributing anything useful. I put it in ignore for creating posts that serves no constructive purpose and is likely to cause offence or arguments.


Finally you have involved in our interaction and you said that; 

Quote

 

Wow. 

So any that don't agree with you are just out to get ya. 

You have had several people with very different political views all agree that YOUR plan will not work. 

But you feel we are all just mean.

 

So you did the same thing with the poster named @Goddess and supported its distortion of my words. 


And I replied you; 

Quote

Ops, now I will put you in ignore list too. I didnt ignore Goddess for not being agree with me. I ignored him/her for his/her deliberate distortions of my words. You did the same thing. Despite I have explained why I ignored him/her, you deliberately accused me of ignoring someone for not being agree with me. I dont limit your freedom, you can still post, I just dont want to see your posts. This is my right. Goodbye.

Today, still you are doing the same mistakes.

Edited April 16, 2017 by Altai

[Ash74]

Alright alright alright. Lets not get bogged down on small differences of opinions.

I have defended your topics and have enjoyed many of your posts. I may not agree with them but I enjoy the debates.

But you obviously do not enjoy different points of view so instead of demanding a system of rules might I suggest you start your own forum.

Changing this one is not gonna happen and I bet you even get a few people from here. I am not telling you to go I am just suggesting it. Free speech and all.

But you actually put me on your ignore list because you ask me for the name of "1" journalist that was jailed in Turkey. I think I gave you three. This sent you into a rage.

[Altai]

22 minutes ago, Ash74 said:

Alright alright alright. Lets not get bogged down on small differences of opinions.

I have defended your topics and have enjoyed many of your posts. I may not agree with them but I enjoy the debates.

But you obviously do not enjoy different points of view so instead of demanding a system of rules might I suggest you start your own forum.

Changing this one is not gonna happen and I bet you even get a few people from here. I am not telling you to go I am just suggesting it. Free speech and all.

But you actually put me on your ignore list because you ask me for the name of "1" journalist that was jailed in Turkey. I think I gave you three. This sent you into a rage.

I am open for any ideas as long as they are backed with logic. As I said, if you claim that 2x2 is not 4 and if you cant back up your claim with a logical explanation, I wont listen your stories all day long, I will simply ignore you.

Yes this may be a good idea, I can create my own forum one day in the future. 

Ash, the problem is you are making claims and you dont back up them with logic. You dont share any informations, you share your personal believes which has no logical back up and you want people to listen your stories.

I dont remember the journalist issue, please post the topic link or directly quote it. Probably I gave you an answer but you still cant get rid of your obsessions. You cant show me even a single journalist. The persons which you call "journalists" are criminals with journalist ID cards given by Western countries. 

[Ash74]

2 minutes ago, Altai said:

I am open for any ideas as long as they are backed with logic. As I said, if you claim that 2x2 is not 4 and if you cant back up your claim with a logical explanation,

 

It was illogical to think you could think you could corner the market in all things and than give them away for free after you had wiped out others. IF that is 2 x 2 = 4 than you amd I have been taught different maths. You never showed a business plan that could show any kind of success.

4 minutes ago, Altai said:

I dont remember the journalist issue, please post the topic link or directly quote it. Probably I gave you an answer but you still cant get rid of your obsessions. You cant show me even a single journalist. The persons which you call "journalists" are criminals with journalist ID cards given by Western countries. 

One Journalist

Can Dundar

 

A longstanding columnnist for Milliyet, Dündar was laid off in August 2013 for "writing too sharply" about the Gezi protests and the developments in Egypt, as the paper's owner Erdoğan Demirören put it. Dündar recalled: "It was said to me, ‘We do not wish to see stories that will displease the prime minister in this paper. Everything displeases them, and after they are displeased, they go after us’."^[12]

Subsequently, he turned to the center-left Cumhuriyet, and on 8 February 2015 became the newspaper's new editor-in-chief. In November, Cumhuriyet was awarded the 2015 Reporters Without Borders Prize for its "independent and courageous journalism."^[13]

Shortly thereafter, Dündar and Cumhuriyet's Ankara bureau chief Erdem Gül were arrested on charges of being members of a terror organization, espionage and revealing confidential documents, facing sentences of up to life imprisonment. The investigations had been launched in May, after the newspaper published photos depicting weapons transferred to Syria in trucks of the National Intelligence Organization, subject of the MİT trucks scandal. In June 2015, Turkish President Erdoğan had publicly targeted Dündar, stating: "The individual who reported this as an exclusive story will pay a heavy price for this."^[14] In prison Dündar was denied colored pencils to draw with but made his own paint by pressing fruit in his cell, refusing the ban on color and smuggling his paintings out of prison because he "wanted to prove that color can exist even in the darkest of places."^[15]

After 92 days in prison, Dündar and Gül were released on 26 February 2016 after the Supreme Court decided that their detention was an "undue deprivation of liberty".^[16]

[Altai]

1 hour ago, Ash74 said:

It was illogical to think you could think you could corner the market in all things and than give them away for free after you had wiped out others. IF that is 2 x 2 = 4 than you amd I have been taught different maths. You never showed a business plan that could show any kind of success.

One Journalist

Can Dundar

 

A longstanding columnnist for Milliyet, Dündar was laid off in August 2013 for "writing too sharply" about the Gezi protests and the developments in Egypt, as the paper's owner Erdoğan Demirören put it. Dündar recalled: "It was said to me, ‘We do not wish to see stories that will displease the prime minister in this paper. Everything displeases them, and after they are displeased, they go after us’."^[12]

Subsequently, he turned to the center-left Cumhuriyet, and on 8 February 2015 became the newspaper's new editor-in-chief. In November, Cumhuriyet was awarded the 2015 Reporters Without Borders Prize for its "independent and courageous journalism."^[13]

Shortly thereafter, Dündar and Cumhuriyet's Ankara bureau chief Erdem Gül were arrested on charges of being members of a terror organization, espionage and revealing confidential documents, facing sentences of up to life imprisonment. The investigations had been launched in May, after the newspaper published photos depicting weapons transferred to Syria in trucks of the National Intelligence Organization, subject of the MİT trucks scandal. In June 2015, Turkish President Erdoğan had publicly targeted Dündar, stating: "The individual who reported this as an exclusive story will pay a heavy price for this."^[14] In prison Dündar was denied colored pencils to draw with but made his own paint by pressing fruit in his cell, refusing the ban on color and smuggling his paintings out of prison because he "wanted to prove that color can exist even in the darkest of places."^[15]

After 92 days in prison, Dündar and Gül were released on 26 February 2016 after the Supreme Court decided that their detention was an "undue deprivation of liberty".^[16]

So first he is kicked from a pro-government newspaper which is named Milliyet. 

Then he started to work for a Western backed newspaper Cumhuriyet and he is given an "award" by Western countries for being against Turkish government. 

Then Western backed Gulen terror organization which is settled in all the areas of the government stopped vehicles of Turkish intelligence MIT which were carrying weapons to Syria. This is legally a crime, you cant intervene to the intelligence jobs. This journalist named Dundar and another one named Gul spreaded photos and documents related with the event, this is legally another crime.  They have been sent to prison and they have been released back by Gulen terror organization. They escaped to abroad. 
 

Edited April 16, 2017 by Altai

[Rue]

On ‎2017‎-‎04‎-‎10 at 7:19 AM, Altai said:

What is discuss and why people discuss ? 

Discussion is the exercise of two or more persons communicating for the purpose of trying to find out about, measure,  share, understand, verify,  a feeling, thought or a bit of both or the exercise of social interaction, i.e., a primal behaviour of all apes including homo sapiens (humans) to acknowledge each other's presence for many reasons, i.e., territorial imperative, safety concerns, mating. 

Discuss is to have communication with other people about the things which you dont have enough information

No that makes no sense. People need to share minimum functional level of common information otherwise they could not be able to communication with one another-they would not be able to communicate because they could not understand one another. Altai does not understand the difference between th term "information" and another concept she then advances with rhetorical questions and statements concerning when does one have sufficient objective  facts to be able to prove something. Often people communicate because they don't have enough information and they would like to obtain it from others.

People discuss on request of making their believes facts despite its not. 

No. People discuss things even when they are not requested to do so. People may feel compelled without being requested to express or share or discuss something. Further not all discussions share or express their beliefs or values or facts. The term "believes facts despite its not" makes no sense. "Believes fact" appears to be a butchered attempt at stating a generalization that people only discuss (communicate) when they don't have enough facts. That makes no sense. People discuss issues they feel they have sufficient facts with, or sometimes they discuss to obtain more information to then determine whether they wish to make a  conclusion of cause and effect basedon that additional information, or to verify, share, get a second opinion, etc., as mentioned above. For Example, a discussion between two screen-writers about the direction their story is going in does not automatically mean as Altai suggests they don't have enough information to render some conclusions or agreements as to where they would like to proceed when developing their story.

If we would have enough information of it, we would not discuss anything

No. There are numerous examples of people who think they have sufficient information who discuss it because they want to share it. In fact the very reason Altai started her thread is because she feels she has enough information to be able to discuss what she does. She discusses what she has decided is both true and factual. She in fact presents her subjective sweeping generalizations of all discussions as lacking sufficient information.

Isn't that ironic because following the very things she has stated, necessarily what she says is  as she calls it "soo (sic) stupid".

because informations have to be truth/fact, this is why they are called information. Is not it stupid to discuss about the things which we dont have enough information of it ? 

No a lot of information while incomplete, speculative or conditional and requiring  further verification and clarification is none-the-less crucial and needs to be shared to form part of further  larger collective of  information to then base a fact on. Information is not static. Its built by a process of graduation, i.e., one set of information leading to another and another to build a larger concept from a smaller one.

So "discuss" is soo stupid.

No. For the above reasons I just mentioned, brain-storming, for example, an exercise in a lively exchange of ideas can often lead to amazing works of art, construction, legal agreement, unified vision, collaboration that goes on to invent, discover.

Only ignorant people discuss.

No.  Often ignorant people  fear discussion and often shun it. A person who is socially retarded or stunted and can't discuss may have a neurological or psychiatric disease. Their inability to interact socially through communication as studies have shown caue them to suffer from alienation which has been shown to increase mortality rates and chronic illnesses and increased levels of geart disease and cancer.  People with certain and specific mental illnesses can't discuss and they get sick because of it. Intelligent people continually discuss to gain ninsights and challenge their asumptions or ways of doing things to get a fresh perspective. Many ignorant people as Alta calls it " discuss"  becaue like Aktai they want to lecture others that they and only they know what truth is.

They discuss because they dont have enough information.

No. That is an absurd generalization. "They" is a stereotype-a fabricated stereotype pretext. There is no "they". Each individual who engages in a discussion is not "they" - each one has a unique, or specific, or individual reason or motive for why they want to communicate and as been shown much communication is done to share information they already have sufficient amounts of..

Telling personal ideas about something which you dont have enough information is ignorance, its idiotic and stupid, whatever you call it.

No. Stating a subjective opinion is often not based on fact. People share religious and spiritual thoughts about death, life, love,in fact the very fuel of creative arts and religion is sharing speculative thoughts about the meaning of life through the expression of ritualized exercises, prayers, chants, meditation, music, dance, poetry, writing, acting sculpting. The very act of intelligence is accepting one's ignorance and realizing ignorance is a constant while intelligence is the abstract concept we  set out from ignorance to counter-balance and fill the void that ignorance otherwise leaves us suffocating in.

We can only share informations with each other, we cant discuss, if we are reasonable persons. 

No. There are many reasons to share things by communication and other social exchanges and not all of them will be felt to be reasonable by one of the parties in the discussion but will be considered reasonable by the others. People getting speeding tickets from police may feel they are nto based on sufficient facts and/or are not reasonable-doesn't mean the police should not ticket them. The fact that I find the entire premises of your thread thoroughly and utterly idiotic in its inherent contradiction and fractured illogical subjective generalizations posed as universal truisms or Altaisms, does not mean I should not discuss them. My motive is to share disdain for such conclusions. I find the entire thread's premises the clump of cells dictators arouse to burn things down. In fact it it has the same fractured generalizations that fascists throw at crowds to arouse them.

"Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Kim Jung Un, Mao, Ho Chi Minh, Erdogan, Hussein, Trump, De Gaulles, Franco, show me a fascist I will show you a bad hair cut and even stranger some twit in a crowd chanting and hero  worshipping that  bad hair cut.."

Rue 1777

" Men with beards and long hair usually come to save the world or try wash your  windshield with dirty water."

Rue 2017

 

 

 

 

Edited May 5, 2017 by Rue

[Altai]

Elders, do you still discuss things ? Its so sad that you wasted your lifetime with discussing with people to make your personal ego to be the true one. This is just poor, pitiful. The youth you raise cannot be a bright future for the World. You are just poisoning them with your sick thoughts. 


Teach your youth to be fair. Teach them how to use their thinking power. Teach them Islam. 

[Altai]

If we have the same information, we cant disagree. If we cant disagree, then we cant discuss. 

If the weather is going to be rainy tomarrow (information), then its a good idea to take my umbrella with me not to get wet (fact based on logic). No normal person would discuss about this issue. You can just offer some other alternatives for umbrella and we will still be agreed. Does not matter how many information is added in the circle.

Edited August 5, 2017 by Altai

[capricorn]

  Poser.

[hot enough]

On 5/4/2017 at 7:53 PM, Rue said:

"Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Kim Jung Un, Mao, Ho Chi Minh, Erdogan, Hussein, Trump, De Gaulles, Franco, show me a fascist I will show you a bad hair cut and even stranger some twit in a crowd chanting and hero  worshipping that  bad hair cut.."

Rue 1777

" Men with beards and long hair usually come to save the world or try wash your  windshield with dirty water."

Rue 2017

As bad as your comedy is, Rue, it doesn't come close to being as bad as your commentary.

[Rue]

On ‎2017‎-‎08‎-‎05 at 3:52 AM, Altai said:

Elders, do you still discuss things ? Its so sad that you wasted your lifetime with discussing with people to make your personal ego to be the true one. This is just poor, pitiful. The youth you raise cannot be a bright future for the World. You are just poisoning them with your sick thoughts. 


Teach your youth to be fair. Teach them how to use their thinking power. Teach them Islam. 

Its clear what bait you use. . Guess you  won't be  catching an Atlantic goliath grouper (Epinephelus itajara) or tetraogidae with it, that is for sure but maybe some castomidae.

http://thismuslimgirlbakes.blogspot.ca/2015/04/fish.html

or

http://www.mei.edu/content/map/isis-and-institution-online-terrorist-recruitment

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/islamic-state-interview-with-an-extremist-recruiter-a-999557.html

http://www.nbcchicago.com/investigations/Terrorists-Recruit-Teenagers-Online-Through-Websites-Social-Media-291010561.html

Maybe I should switch my dog photo to Gal Gadot.

 

Edited August 6, 2017 by Rue

[Rue]

On ‎2017‎-‎08‎-‎05 at 3:57 AM, Altai said:

If we have the same information, we cant disagree. If we cant disagree, then we cant discuss. 

 

So clarify is it a photo of:

Ozgu Namal

Saadet Oksoy

Cansu Dere

Sedef Avci

Lol does it matter? You've made it a point to start proseltyzing, it should be no wonder your picture is suddenly clear again and does not hide the facial features.

Recruiters. People who fish. One thing I learned is, they always think the bait they use will work.

You assume your audience is desperate and hungry and in need of your line.

Keep pulling. All you are going to get is a boot.

These waters were polluted long ago.