Police entrapment: Nuttall and Korody freed

[jacee]

Now you're just making stuff up.

I'm asking Wilber how he can say so confidently

"They weren't coerced."

Where did he get that info?

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[The_Squid]

I'm asking Wilber how he can say so confidently

"They weren't coerced."

Where did he get that info?

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If you are going to make the claim that they were threatened, then you'll have to provide a cite.

I didn't mean coerced by force... you can coerce someone with material gain, etc.

[jacee]

If you are going to make the claim that they were threatened, then you'll have to provide a cite.

I didn't mean coerced by force... you can coerce someone with material gain, etc.

That's inducement, bribery.

Not sure it's coercion.

I was using 'threat' as an example of coercion.

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Edited July 29, 2016 by jacee

[The_Squid]

That's inducement, bribery.

Not sure it's coercion.

I was using 'threat' as an example of coercion.

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I used coerce improperly... my bad.

[jacee]

Update:

Nuttall and Karody released, then re-arrested ...

[jacee]

I used coerce improperly... my bad.

Just to clarify ... I did not 'make the claim' that they were coerced.

Wilber made the claim that they were not coerced.

I asked how he could be so certain.

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[The_Squid]

Just to clarify ... I did not 'make the claim' that they were coerced.

Wilber made the claim that they were not coerced.

I asked how he could be so certain.

.

I said they were coerced... Wilber was responding to my post. I was mistaken. There is no evidence they were coerced.

[Wilber]

Yes they were victimized.

How can you be so certain that they weren't coerced - ie, threatened in some way?

.

So I suppose you can.

[jacee]

I said they were coerced... Wilber was responding to my post. I was mistaken. There is no evidence they were coerced.

He still hasn't answered my question about how he can say that with such certainty.

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[jacee]

Update:

Nuttall and Karody released, then re-arrested ...

More ...

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/british-columbia/crown-seeks-peace-bond-for-john-nuttall-and-amanda-korody-under-fear-of-terrorism-criminal-code-section-1.3701536

Crown lawyers are seeking a peace bond to place restrictions on John Nuttall and Amanda Korody under the "Fear of Terrorism' section of the Criminal Code.

The pair had been convicted of terrorism charges.

But they were released Friday morning, after a B.C. Supreme Court judge entered a stay of proceedings in their terror plot case.

Friday afternoon, Nuttall and Korody were rearrested and taken into custody.

Crown lawyer Peter Eccles said prosecutors were seeking a peace bond under the Fear of Terrorism section of the Criminal Code.

The bond would allow them to place restrictions on Nuttall and Korody for up to a year.

[Wilber]

He still hasn't answered my question about how he can say that with such certainty.

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Your problem jacee is that your dislike of the police has you ready to assume any thing bad about them whether you have evidence to back it up or not.

[jacee]

Your problem jacee is that your dislike of the police has you ready to assume any thing bad about them whether you have evidence to back it up or not.

I don't dislike police.

I dislike bad police work.

I demand high standards of police.

Don't you?

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Edited July 29, 2016 by jacee

[Wilber]

I don't dislike police.

I dislike bad police work.

I demand high standards of police.

Don't you?

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Then why do you assume there was coercion when there is no evidence of it. Why do you always assume the worst about them? You post a lot about the police, it is ýour favourite subject but I have never seen anything positive about them. While their actions may have brought the conviction in doubt, so far there has been no suggestion they did anything illegal.

[Smallc]

I don't dislike the police. I think this judge made a good decision.

[Wilber]

I don't dislike the police. I think this judge made a good decision.

As I said before, I don't disagree with the decision, just the idea that these two are some kind of victims.

[dialamah]

I think the peace bond is a good idea for these two. They may not be the brightest bulbs in the universe, but doesn't mean they can't learn that some ideas are just wrong.

[Argus]

Jacee's poor, helpless victims...

"'We're all going to taste death,' says Allah," added Nuttall. "Is there any better way to die than in a way that propagates Islam? ... What better way is there to die?"

Video shown in court on Monday also showed Nuttall pleading with the same undercover officer to find him a handgun as a "gesture of trust," right after he described feeling murderous rage toward an American soldier he'd met who insulted Islam.

"I wanted to put a gun to his head and right before I pulled the trigger I wanted to say, 'Taste what you used to deny,' and send him straight to the hell-fire," Nuttall said, stroking his wiry, grey-tinged goatee. "I had my marble gun. I could have just pulled it out and put it to his head but (two other people) were in the back seat and I didn't have enough bullets to take them all out."

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/b-c-court-hears-terror-suspect-boasted-of-recruiting-others-1.2863213

Edited July 30, 2016 by Argus

[dialamah]

Nuttal and Korordy did have some big plans:

1. Kidnap the president of the US

2. Taking control of a nuclear sub

3. Shoot rockets at the legislature

4. Blowing up a passenger train on Vancouver Island (there are no passenger trains on Vancouver Island)

Fortunately, however, the RCMP stepped in to provide them with an actual workable plan, as well as the money, knowledge, and other resources to carry it out. Never mind that the two weren't even able to organize themselves well enough to hold down a job - the police decided to make them into "terrorists" and provided them all the help they needed.

As the judge said:

“There was no imminent risk of harm to the public or the need to disrupt ongoing criminal activity,” Bruce said. “The police were acutely aware that without the constant supervision and direction provided by (the undercover officer), the defendants would be incapable of completing their part in the plan.

“Moreover, the fact that the police went to such great lengths to eliminate the many obstacles the defendants placed in their own path to accomplishing a terrorist mission, as well as obstacles the police concluded the defendants could never overcome because of their vulnerabilities and their lack of resources, renders any risk perceived by the RCMP quite farcical.”

She called Nuttall and Korody “not very intelligent; gullible and quite naive and childlike. To say they were unsophisticated is generous.”

[jacee]

Then why do you assume there was coercion when there is no evidence of it. Why do you always assume the worst about them? You post a lot about the police, it is ýour favourite subject but I have never seen anything positive about them. While their actions may have brought the conviction in doubt, so far there has been no suggestion they did anything illegal.

Overreact much?

I asked how you knew there wasn't coercion.

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[Wilber]

Overreact much?

I asked how you knew there wasn't coercion.

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You have no evidence it did so you just assert it did and want me to prove it didn't. Thanks for making my point.

[eyeball]

I think the peace bond is a good idea for these two. They may not be the brightest bulbs in the universe, but doesn't mean they can't learn that some ideas are just wrong.

Maybe someone should also keep an eye on the boneheads who thought trying to set these two up was a good idea. Was this just a one off experiment to see if they could pull it off or have they got a bunch of similar files open at the moment?

That said I'm betting its safe to say no has been or will be fired or even demoted following this fiasco. Good work if you can get it I guess.

[jacee]

You have no evidence it did so you just assert it did and want me to prove it didn't. Thanks for making my point.

I didn't bring coercion up at all.

You did.

I'm glad you are so certain that there was no coercion.

How do you know that again?

Got a link?

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[Wilber]

I didn't bring coercion up at all.

You did.

I'm glad you are so certain that there was no coercion.

How do you know that again?

Got a link?

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I was't even responding to you. You just decided to stick your face into another conversation.

[jacee]

I was't even responding to you. You just decided to stick your face into another conversation.

Lack of response noted. ?

Have a great day.

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[Wilber]

Lack of response noted.

Have a great day.

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You to, Keep making stuff up.