Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Name one frontline USN squadron that is transitioning to Super Hornets versus F-35C........ At the moment, the F-35C is relatively useless as part of a carrier air wing, as it isn't able to perform all of its intended functions. The Super Hornet is needed in larger numbers and for longer to fill in the gap that the late arrival of the F-35C is causing. That gap is set to continue to the middle of the century. Quote
ReeferMadness Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/canada-to-stay-in-program-of-f-35-jet-buyers-despite-pledge-to-withdraw/article28897002/ That doesn't mean Canada is going to buy the butterball. It's more likely that the reason Canada paid to stay in the program is this: Canadian companies have won more than $750-million in contracts related to the F-35 because Canada has been a partner in the program for decades. Should the Liberals exit the program, Canadian firms’ contracts will wind down and they will not be eligible to bid on further work. Quote Unlimited economic growth has the marvelous quality of stilling discontent while preserving privilege, a fact that has not gone unnoticed among liberal economists. - Noam Chomsky It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it. - Upton Sinclair
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Ahh yeah, it does, since you cite a price the DoD paid for Super Hornets, four years ago, I'm talking about in their newest buy for 2016. The different, using the exchange rate at the time, between the Super Hornet and the F-35A in the requests from DoD were in the range of $40 - 50M each. absent engines, avionics and ECM/targeting pods Yes, both planes were less some of their equipment. Quote
ReeferMadness Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 So much so, Canada buys much of its military hardware from the United States. Let's see....Super Hornet or F-35...no...ummmm...F-35 or Super Hornet ! .... or Eurofighter or Gripen or Rafale Quote Unlimited economic growth has the marvelous quality of stilling discontent while preserving privilege, a fact that has not gone unnoticed among liberal economists. - Noam Chomsky It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it. - Upton Sinclair
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Ahh yeah, it does, since you cite a price the DoD paid for Super Hornets, four years ago, absent engines, avionics and ECM/targeting pods......and suggest this is what Canada would pay today, even though the DoD pays far more. Right...apples and oranges on costs. The fairy tales continue.... Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Â
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 That was a completely separate point in the article, and had nothing to do with acquisitions or operating timelines. No, it was the crux of the article....i.e upgrades to the Super Hornet to add a measure of survivability to an aircraft that is already outclassed by the latest Russian aircraft and air defense systems today. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 I'm not so sure I'd like to be flying a plane powered by one engine, one that tends to rub turbine blades together when it gets hot until it blows up, with an ejection seat that may kill me if I have to use it. And the hits just seem to keep on coming. http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2016/02/f-35s-terrifying-bug-list/125638/ Quote
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 No, it was the crux of the article We didn't read the same article, apparently. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 At the moment, the F-35C is relatively useless as part of a carrier air wing, as it isn't able to perform all of its intended functions. The Super Hornet is needed in larger numbers and for longer to fill in the gap that the late arrival of the F-35C is causing. That gap is set to continue to the middle of the century. Name one frontline squadron the is now transitioning from legacy Hornets to Super Hornets versus the F-35C........can't do it? Thats because there isn't, and is why the articles you cite are out of context and don't paint the actual reality. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 We didn't read the same article, apparently. I read the one you cited......and the point stands, the USN isn't funding upgrades to their Super Hornet fleet. Quote
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Name one frontline squadron the is now transitioning from legacy Hornets to Super Hornets versus the F-35C........can't do it? Thats because there isn't, and is why the articles you cite are out of context and don't paint the actual reality. Why are they buying more super hornets? To fill in the gap that will exist well into the future. Why are they considering buying more Growlers? Because the F-35C does not have (despite your claims) the same electronic warfare capabilities. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Other nations are buying aircraft now...Canada isn't...Canada is just window shopping. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Â
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 I read the one you cited......and the point stands, the USN isn't funding upgrades to their Super Hornet fleet. There were several points in that article: We need more planes. Super Hornets are available and capable, so we need more of them. We need to operate the Super Hornet longer, so we need more of them. We might upgrade the Super Hornet We might need more Growlers and EW support for the F-35 well into the future. The article I read was several paragraphs and sentences, and didn't say what you apparently think it did. Quote
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Other nations are buying aircraft now...Canada isn't...Canada is just window shopping. You're looking back through the window. Quote
ReeferMadness Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Other nations are buying aircraft now...Canada isn't...Canada is just window shopping. I guess it's because what's on sale isn't worth buying - at any price. Quote Unlimited economic growth has the marvelous quality of stilling discontent while preserving privilege, a fact that has not gone unnoticed among liberal economists. - Noam Chomsky It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it. - Upton Sinclair
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 You're looking back through the window. Yes...the U.S. now has many F-35 and Super Hornet cockpit windows to look through. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Â
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 I guess it's because what's on sale isn't worth buying - at any price. True...perhaps Canada should visit a Rent-A-Center instead....consider leasing....money is tight ! Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Â
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 There were several points in that article: We need more planes. As already cited, the USN is now seeking Congressional approval to defund and retire an entire Carrier Air Wing.....hence your article is now dated. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Why are they buying more super hornets? Attrition reserves for their current fleet, a fleet that aged greatly with the operational tempo for the last 15 years. To fill in the gap that will exist well into the future. A gap never intended to be filled by the F-35, but the eventual Super Hornet replacement. Why are they considering buying more Growlers? So their present fleet can operate in a modern battlefield with an enhanced measure of safety. Because the F-35C does not have (despite your claims) the same electronic warfare capabilities. These are not my claims, but the former head of the USMC, which will operate an entire F-35 fleet........versus the USN, that will operate a mixed fleet of strike aircraft, in addition, requires dedicated electronic warfare aircraft to protect their surface fleet, in addition force wide ECM support to other branches of the US military, namely the USAF...........as noted countless times, the F-35 isn't (yet) the planned replacement for the Super Hornet and Growler aircraft fleets. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 That doesn't mean Canada is going to buy the butterball. It's more likely that the reason Canada paid to stay in the program is this: In other words "Canadian pork barreling"? Quote
ReeferMadness Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 In other words "Canadian pork barreling"? You don't know what pork barreling is, do you? This isn't a case of the Canadian government directing work, it's a case of the Canadian government paying an entrance fee so that Canadian companies can bid on much larger pieces of work. Quote Unlimited economic growth has the marvelous quality of stilling discontent while preserving privilege, a fact that has not gone unnoticed among liberal economists. - Noam Chomsky It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it. - Upton Sinclair
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 You don't know what pork barreling is, do you? This isn't a case of the Canadian government directing work, it's a case of the Canadian government paying an entrance fee so that Canadian companies can bid on much larger pieces of work. I know exactly what it is, and what this is.........the Previous Liberal Government signed the initial agreement years ago....PET did likewise with Canadair in the later 60s with Northrop, over producing the CF-5 Freedom Fighter in greater Montreal ridings......today, Pratt & Whitney Canada (and countless other companies), produce parts for the F-35 program, including companies in Montreal ridings. How much involvement does Canadian industry currently have in the Super Hornet, Gripen NG, Eurofighter and Rafale programs? Quote
Smallc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 Attrition reserves for their current fleet, a fleet that aged greatly with the operational tempo for the last 15 years. And? A gap never intended to be filled by the F-35, but the eventual Super Hornet replacement. The Super Hornet, of course, was supposed to be taking a back seat to the Lightning at this point. Quote
Big Guy Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 ... We need more planes. ... Why? If we know why then we will know what kind and how many. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Derek 2.0 Posted February 25, 2016 Report Posted February 25, 2016 And? What? The Super Hornet, of course, was supposed to be taking a back seat to the Lightning at this point. Name one USN frontline Super Hornet squadron to be replaced by the F-35C..........can't do it? That's because the F-35C isn't replacing the Super Hornet. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.