Ontario energy problem

[ironstone]

The entire Green Energy Act should be scrapped,it will not benefit Ontario.We could have met our energy needs by reaching a deal with Quebec for starters.Our neighbors must be laughing at Ontario.

Now Canada is being led by someone who thinks exactly like Wynne/McGuinty.

[Argus]

Despite the fact Ontario has more power than it can use, and is increasingly being forced to either sell it to the US at a steep discount or pay producers to idle their generators the Ontario government signed up for yet more expensive and unreliable 'green' energy production. Get ready for your power rates to rise yet again.

The costs may be high and the need questionable, but Ontarians signed up to buy a lot more renewable power last week when Ontario’s Independent Power System Operator (IESO) announced the results of the province’s latest procurement. The new deal brings “low prices” for new wind and solar generation, says Ontario Energy Minister Bob Chiarelli.

http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/ontarians-just-signed-up-for-more-expensive-unreliable-electricity-they-dont-need

Edited March 17, 2016 by Argus

[PIK]

I live in eastern ONT and I pay...

On -peak--17.5

Mid - peak-- 12.8

Off - peak--8.3

[69cat]

In Sask i am 12.6 cents/kwh for residential with a $29.19 basic monthly charge. No delivery charges or time of use or other such rates.

Industrial customers are slightly less but are charged around $14/kva each month their peak demand is over 50 kva so this is comparable to a delivery charge.

Edited March 18, 2016 by 69cat

[Smallc]

In Manitoba, it's $7.57 basic charge, and 7.672C per kWh. It's been going up lately though.

[Argus]

I live in eastern ONT and I pay...

On -peak--17.5

Mid - peak-- 12.8

Off - peak--8.3

Don't forget your delivery charge and your regulatory charge, and that HST is applied on top of those.

[Smoke]

We have an empty space in one of our rental properties. It has it's own meter, and we are going to convert it to a one bedroom apartment. It has been sitting like this for roughly 2 years and we get a bill for a bit over $40/month AND WE ARE NOT USING ANY ELECTRICITY. It's all delivery, debt retirement and taxes. That's almost a grand we've paid for absolutely nothing from Hydro.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Smoke

[waldo]

We have an empty space in one of our rental properties. It has it's own meter, and we are going to convert it to a one bedroom apartment. It has been sitting like this for roughly 2 years and we get a bill for a bit over $40/month AND WE ARE NOT USING ANY ELECTRICITY. It's all delivery, debt retirement and taxes. That's almost a grand we've paid for absolutely nothing from Hydro.

please sir... admin costs aren't cheap! Also, if your meter ain't so smart it must be read manually/monthly - surely you want meter-readers to be paid - yes? You are also paying for the privilege to have your property serviced... whether you claim to use it or not. Please rethink your "absolutely nothing" - yes?

.

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[waldo]

I live in eastern ONT and I pay...

On -peak--17.5

Mid - peak-- 12.8

Off - peak--8.3

as does every other Ontario resident choosing to be on 'Time of Use' pricing... as I posted earlier in this thread (with cited reference link provided), per the following graphic, that pricing equates to an average rate of 10.7¢ per kWh.

[waldo]

moderator note: in the interests of not further derailing another thread, the following posts moved to this related active thread:

Wonder how demoralized they'd be if they were someone on disability, or with a fixed income, that are watching their hydro rates jump by $40/month because of that heartless witch Katherine Wynne. Wonder how they'd feel if they had to decide between food or heat? Think they would be demoralized then?

oh my! I do believe your passion needs reigning in... amirite? In that your $40 figure is so specific, I will take it to align with the relatively recent Ontario Energy Board approved, Toronto Hydro announced, 2016 rate increase of $40... uhhh... per year! Ya, that's an estimated $40 per year increase for the average homeowner. I trust this will reduce your passion twelve-fold - yes?
.

Your link is for Toronto Hydro. Out here in eastern Ontario it's Hydro one, and their average increase is $137/year. Plus the 10% benefit to low income earners is being eliminated.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-hydro-bills-to-cost-another-137-for-most-in-2016-1.3010441

On a $300/month electrical bill (yes that is correct $300/month for a small 2 bedroom apt) losing the benefit adds $30/month, then add the the 11.42/month average increase and that equals 41.42/month. Oh wait bonus....we no longer have to pay the $5.50/month bs debt retirement payment that we've had for the last 10 years. That's $35.82/month. And this was a relatively warm winter here in eastern Ontario compared to last year. My tenants bills from last year have increased over $40/month in both of the first two months of the year. January 2015 = $292, January 2016 = $335, February 2015 = $238, February 2016 = 290.

Even at last years rates many are having trouble making ends meet. Sorry to burst your smug little bubble waldo.

no worries... given you were less than forthcoming, as I said, I made an alignment (assumption) to your most specific $40 reference. In any case, you were purposely vague and said nothing about a 'low income' attachment. I trust you're not in that category given your weighty portfolio of rental accommodations... but good on ya for thinkin' of those with lower incomes. Oh wait! Hey now, how does your particular brand of self-serving math align with your own supplied link reference? You know, where your supplied reference speaks to:

The government is also starting a rebate program of $20 to $50 a month for low-income residents. Energy Minister Bob Chiarelli offered the following scenario as he unveiled the program Thursday:

"For example, for a family of four with an annual income of less than $28,000, the combined savings from the Ontario Electricity Support Program and the removal of the debt retirement charge, will be about $525 annually."

His ministry`s website says savings from just the $38 monthly credit for the same family totals about $455 per year.

A family of three bringing in $35,000 a year will get a credit of $30 on their monthly hydro bill.

it would appear my, as you say, "smug little bubble" has not been burst... remains intact! Try again; try harder next time. Carry on!
.

[Smoke]

moderator note: in the interests of not further derailing another thread, the following posts moved to this related active thread:

no worries... given you were less than forthcoming, as I said, I made an alignment (assumption) to your most specific $40 reference. In any case, you were purposely vague and said nothing about a 'low income' attachment. I trust you're not in that category given your weighty portfolio of rental accommodations... but good on ya for thinkin' of those with lower incomes. Oh wait! Hey now, how does your particular brand of self-serving math align with your own supplied link reference? You know, where your supplied reference speaks to:

it would appear my, as you say, "smug little bubble" has not been burst... remains intact! Try again; try harder next time. Carry on!

.

It will be interesting to see what my tenant gets. He is already aware of the program. I'll let you know.

[Argus]

Under the Liberal government, electricity prices in Ontario soared from a flat 4.7 cents a kilowatt hour in 2004, to the Nov. 1, 2015 rate of 17.5 cents a kwh at peak times, increases that total almost 375 per cent. There are various changes taking effect in the new year that will have an impact on electricity bills. Energy sector analyst Tom Adams calls it “a multi-dimensional, inter-temporal shell game” of power rates.

A shell game. Make it all so complicated that no one can understand it, and Liberals can pretend they haven't screwed Ontario by jacking up rates past where anyone else in the country pays.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/12/31/ontario-hydro-bills-set-to-rise-jan-1.html

[Topaz]

Ontarians homeowners or anyone who pays their own hydro, should get a COLA every 6 months to cover the increases in hydro. Even when the Liberals are gone, I can't see where the other two parties can reduce the hydro bills, do any of u?

[waldo]

Under the Liberal government, electricity prices in Ontario soared from a flat 4.7 cents a kilowatt hour in 2004, to the Nov. 1, 2015 rate of 17.5 cents a kwh at peak times, increases that total almost 375 per cent.

could this be any more disingenuous? A quick sampling of a few provinces shows a similar 2004 rate as that Ontario 2004 reference... while both the current average TOU Ontario rate and the tiered Ontario rate are both approximate to or lower than the per kWh rate of several provinces. Choosing a comparison to the peak TOU price is a purposeful intent to obfuscate.

.

[Argus]

could this be any more disingenuous? A quick sampling of a few provinces shows a similar 2004 rate as that Ontario 2004 reference... while both the current average TOU Ontario rate and the tiered Ontario rate are both approximate to or lower than the per kWh rate of several provinces. Choosing a comparison to the peak TOU price is a purposeful intent to obfuscate.

Yes, because the Toronto Star is notorious for being as anti-Liberals as... you.

Today, Ontario electricity costs average over 9 cents per kWh, delivery costs 3 cents per kWh or more, the 0.7-cent debt retirement charge is still being charged, plus a new 8% provincial sales tax. Additional regulatory charges take all-in costs to well over 15 cents per kWh.. The increase in the past 10 years averaged over 11% annually. Recently, the Energy Minister forecast the final consumer electricity bill will jump another 33% over the next three years and 42% in the next 5 years.

The cost of electricity for the average Ontario consumer went from $780 on the day Dalton McGuinty’s Liberals took power to more than $1,800, with more increases to come.

http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/ontarios-power-trip-irrational-energy-planning-tripling-power-rates-under-the-liberals-direction

[Cl Le]

Ontario still has not learned that a Liberal love affair is very expensive and has long term affects on an economy . Maybe one day they will get smart but after the last federal election I fear that day is still along way off . Enjoy austerity and really expensive energy while the West has the conversation how we can dump the East once and for all !

[Topaz]

CI Le, it wasn't Ontario that voted the Liberals in the last election is was mostly the GTA and they must not have high hydro bills or have high pay cheques.

[69cat]

Whats a typical total kwh cost for people on here? Lots of talk on TOU and not factoring in delivery charges and such. Got my quarterly power bill and i am at 14.2 cents per kwh all in. Took the total paid (including taxes) to settle the bill and divide by kwh used during the billing period.

[Bonam]

$4.45 per month + 5.96¢ per kWh

[Cl Le]

How anyone in Ontario can vote Liberal after all that party has done to that province is beyond me . Just shows you can't teach stupid and I hope they enjoy austerity , they have earned it at the ballot box .

[waldo]

Yes, because the Toronto Star is notorious for being as anti-Liberals as... you.

I'm not as partisan as some to suggest everything printed in any particular rag completely aligns with your apparent 'black and white' distinction... besides... that TorStar article is simply a syndication run off Canadian Press. I note your follow-up FP "Comment" link offers up numbers without providing any supporting foundation as to how they were arrived at - I'm shocked!

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[69cat]

Thanks Bonam, had no idea what rates were like south of the border.

Though it looks like i would be buying quite a bit at your 12.9 c/kwh rate as in winter i have quite a bit of my bill over 16 kwh/day, probably another 200 kwh/day at the higher rate. Electric boiler and winter heating drives that.

Edited March 22, 2016 by 69cat

[Cruze]

Trump will rip apart our business sector and draw them to the USA,period.

He will offer our companies massive cuts in Hydro rates,no green enery costs, and thousands of dollars in signing bonuses.

While our Emperor Trudeau wait's a thousands years for global warming to take effect.

[ZenOps]

Calgary 3.0567 cents per kwh, all the time anytime.

https://www.enmax.com/home/electricity-and-natural-gas/tariffs/rro

And we *just started* moving my neighborhood over to LED streetlights, so I can imagine demand will get even lower.  I even shut off my natural gas furnace and tried heating the house with just electricity.  Its so much nicer, complete silence instead of that whoosh of hot air and banging ducts every hour.

You Ontarioans are getting screwed on bills bigtime.

[blackbird]

On 2016-02-07 at 7:35 AM, Topaz said:

Ontario also has an energy problem but its a bit different is the HIGH cost of hydro and I research newspapers online of Windsor, Chatham-Kent, London and Sarnia and the most complains are in Chatham-Kent, who does have the most wind turbines in the province. I"m also wondering if the high bills are just Hydro One customers or does the GTA also have high bills? One senior in Chatham-Kent complain when he opened his bills to find an increase of $100.00 when he wasn't living a home for a month because he was in the hospital. Many seniors may be forced to sell their homes, and some may not be able to find other lodging if there is a rush for apartments. The province better come up with something to make hydro bills reasonable. http://www.windsorstar.com/business/ontario+hydro+bills+will+rise+year+even+after+debt+charge+eliminated/11623922/story.html

Ontario has been mis-managed so badly by the Liberal government of Ontario.  It is a total disaster.  The Liberals went whole-hog into the green thing.  I think they have the green energy act.  Then they started building wind generators like crazy.  They used taxpayer money to subsidize the green energy industry and that cost Ontario far more money.   They wasted billions of dollars with the gas plant fiasco when they shut down gas plants.   They wasted hundred of millions of dollars in the computerized medical records system disaster.  To make matters worse, the people re-elected the Liberals in Ontario in the last election.   Now they will have carbon pricing which will push up the cost of living even more.  On top of it, you have the insane real estate prices in the major cities like Toronto that make it impossible for a middle income person to buy a home.

Edited April 12, 2017 by blackbird