Pipeline Politics - Is Canada the only "sucker" Nation?

[Derek 2.0]

20 hours ago, TimG said:

To be honest I would be fine with shipping bitumen but I don't believe these protesters have any interest in supporting the increased rail traffic necessary to fill ships regularly. In fact I would rather see the stuff upgrade to syncrude before export but that is not going to happen given the current obsession with GHGs.

 

Regardless of economics, I feel the only way Kinder Morgan will receive "social license" from many groups, namely First Nation, is if this expansion is shipping out refined products.........some within the BC Greens and BC NDP have suggested that the pipeline with a refinery at the terminus would make more sense, both in terms of revenue, jobs and a reduced risk of a devastating oil spill (I would tend to agree with them). Inversely, Grand Chief Stewart Phillip has suggested the material should be refined in Alberta.......

 

Either way, as currently proposed, I highly doubt that it will be built.

 

20 hours ago, Smallc said:

CPC partisans against pipelines - the slogans write themselves.

 

More like "British Columbians against getting bent over the (oil) barrel".........by all means, find where I've stated I'm against "pipelines"

 

 

20 hours ago, ?Impact said:

Bitumen cannot flow through a pipeline. 

 

It does daily for nearly 30 years.......like any heavy grade crude with a low viscosity it is clearly diluted.

 

18 hours ago, bcsapper said:

The natural environment does not take precedence over the human economy.

 

That doesn't jive with Oka or Clayoquot sound.....

 

17 hours ago, TimG said:

The BC economy is basically selling real estate to foreigners now.

 

Financial services and the insurance sectors are far larger cornerstones then real estate.........but I'll grant you real estate is a bigger industry in BC then the O&G sector......so why put in jeopardy (for little to no benefit) our far larger sectors, in the center of the financial hub of the province, for the sake of Alberta's O&G industry?  

16 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Sure, we just got two out of three pipelines approved by a government

 

Harper approved Northern Gateway........how did that work out?

 

 

12 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

but the damage has already been done.

 

With out a doubt, and his remarks, combined with the countless Trudeau lies, have only hardened the resolve of local First Nations.

[mowich]

17 hours ago, WestCoastRunner said:

Not sure if you live in BC but sounds like you don't. I take seriously the responsibility for leaving this province to my grandchildren and future generations to a healthy, sustainable environment with clean water, clean air, our wildlife and our natural environment. 

These pipelines will never be built in BC. 

I so enjoy reading what Left Coast folks have to say about the pipeline approval - I really do.  It is as if no one exists outside the bubble of Vancouver and the Lower Mainland.  We here in the interior of the province have watched as you allowed clear cuts in order to build more homes; taken land out the ALR so you can build industries; dumped your sewage into the ocean with not a thought for the poor whales then or now; refused to take responsibility for your own garbage opting to ship it by truck which use fossil fuels - hundreds of kilometers to Cache Creek and you continue to flood your streets and highways with gas and diesel powered vehicles instead of making full use of all the public transit available. 

The pall of polluted air that once just stunk up Vancouver and its environs now spreads far and wide up the Fraser River valley - it hadn't reached Hope the last time I actually went down to the coast, but that was a long time ago. 

While you rail about the pipelines in defence of your children and grandchildren's future - you allow them to live in a cesspit, teach them that garbage is not their problem and that agricultural land is there for the taking as long as it goes to housing developments or industry.

The oil is going to reach the port one way or another.  I would hope that is does so in the safest way possible and that undeniably is by pipeline.

[Derek 2.0]

13 minutes ago, mowich said:

The oil is going to reach the port one way or another.

Funny, I remember when the Clayoquot was going to be logged "one way or another".........

[mowich]

17 hours ago, WestCoastRunner said:

I suspect JT gave the approval knowing full well that BC activists won't allow it. It's a win win for JT.   He knows the strength of activists in BC 

Justin Trudeau on the XL pipeline back in 2013

"Let me be clear: I support Keystone XL because, having examined the facts, and accepting the judgment of the National Energy Board, I believe it is in the national interest…On balance, it would create jobs and growth, strengthen our ties with the world’s most important market, and generate wealth…Most of all, it is in keeping with what I believe is a fundamental role of the Government of Canada: to open up markets abroad for Canadian resources, and to help create responsible and sustainable ways to get those resources to those markets."

http://commonsensecanadian.ca/justin-trudeau-oil-man-keystone-xl-harper/

“We do need to get our resources to market, we just need to do it the right way. The alternative way of doing things right now is on trains, on rail. We don’t want to be shipping more oil on rail, we saw Lac-Mégantic,” Trudeau answered.

Pipelines are still one of the safer ways of moving oil, he added. “We’ve got hundreds of pipelines that work, that don’t leak, but we still have to make sure that we’re being very, very careful with them,” he said to the woman."

http://montrealgazette.com/news/justin-trudeau-surprises-hudson-crowd-answers-pipeline-questions

"Steadfast in his commitment to getting Canadian oil to market, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said putting pipelines in the ground will help pay for the country's transition to a greener future.

Opening the Globe 2016 Leadership Summit in Vancouver on Wednesday — which deals with tackling climate change and sustainability in business — the Liberal leader dodged questions about whether building controversial energy projects like the Kinder Morgan Trans Mountain expansion and Energy East pipeline would directly contravene his commitment at COP21 in Paris to keep global warming below two degrees this century.

“We want the low-carbon economy that continues to provide good jobs and great opportunities for all Canadians," he told a crowd of hundreds of business, civil society, and science innovators.

"To get there, we need to make smart strategic investments in clean growth and new infrastructure, but we must also continue to generate wealth from our abundant natural resources to fund this transition to a low-carbon economy.”

http://www.nationalobserver.com/2016/03/02/news/trudeau-says-pipelines-will-pay-canadas-transition-green-economy

 

[mowich]

56 minutes ago, Derek 2.0 said:

Funny, I remember when the Clayoquot was going to be logged "one way or another".........

Funny how I remember the mountains of refuse and garbage environmentalists left in their wake - not for them the tedious, sickening job of cleaning up the mess......noooo, they were far too busy making sure some other piece of Earth was preserved while trashing the part they stood on.

[Derek 2.0]

11 hours ago, mowich said:

Funny how I remember the mountains of refuse and garbage environmentalists left in their wake - not for them the tedious, sickening job of cleaning up the mess......noooo, they were far too busy making sure some other piece of Earth was preserved while trashing the part they stood on.

 

Oh well, I have little doubt they'll do it again with Kinder Morgan..........now emboldened by the "victory" at Standing Rock.........Trudeau picked the wrong time to approve a pipeline.

[eyeball]

11 hours ago, mowich said:

Funny how I remember the mountains of refuse and garbage environmentalists left in their wake - not for them the tedious, sickening job of cleaning up the mess......noooo, they were far too busy making sure some other piece of Earth was preserved while trashing the part they stood on.

I recall local protesters being on hand to clean up after the out-of-towners. It was nothing compared to the mess the logging companies left behind, and I should know I was also a Clayoquot logger. 

[eyeball]

13 hours ago, Derek 2.0 said:

Funny, I remember when the Clayoquot was going to be logged "one way or another".........

Don't worry, it's still being logged not as much but... One way or another, usually hoe-chuckers, trees are falling.

[Derek 2.0]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

it's still being logged

 

By the local First Nations?

 

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

One way or another, usually hoe-chuckers, trees are falling.

 

I'd figure the difference between the proposed practices back then and as historic today..........there are still trees to fall.

[eyeball]

5 minutes ago, Derek 2.0 said:

By the local First Nations

Mostly contractors to First Nations on second growth on the Kennedy Flats Watershed.

Quote

I'd figure the difference between the proposed practices back then and as historic today......... . there are still trees to fall.

We'll see what happens if the Ahousaht First Nation decide to move on plans to cut old growth on Flores Island.  

[poochy]

Two, the answer is two, Harper two, Trudeau 0.  This one is for the locally protected types who ask infantile, trolling questions while ignoring the conditions at the time, counting the pipelines that were proposed and though delayed by liberals, finally approved, maybe it's four, but that sort of accounting surely only applies when liberals make the rules.

Anyway the answer is two http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/kevin-libin-beware-of-fake-news-reporting-that-liberals-are-better-than-tories-on-pipelines

Trudeau 0. Maybe 1, eventually.

[?Impact]

On 12/8/2016 at 9:05 PM, poochy said:

Two, the answer is two, Harper two, Trudeau 0.

Except of course Liblin in the article you point to completely, and 100%, ignores the statement he quoted from Max Fawcett: “Dear conservatives: It was Justin Trudeau and Rachel Notley that got a pipeline to tidewater. Enjoy your cognitive dissonance.” Neither of the pipelines he provides as examples go to tidewater, nor does the line 9 reversal he also cites. That is the problem with Conservatives, and their stooges in the press, they think that non-Conservative readers are as stupid as their base. If you don't understand why the tidewater qualification is important, then you obviously know nothing about the industry.

The score is Harper 0, Trudeau 0. With some obstacles out of the way, Trudeau is making more progress than Harper ever did but he is still far from the finish line.

[mowich]

On 2016-12-08 at 6:05 PM, poochy said:

Two, the answer is two, Harper two, Trudeau 0.  This one is for the locally protected types who ask infantile, trolling questions while ignoring the conditions at the time, counting the pipelines that were proposed and though delayed by liberals, finally approved, maybe it's four, but that sort of accounting surely only applies when liberals make the rules.

Anyway the answer is two http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/kevin-libin-beware-of-fake-news-reporting-that-liberals-are-better-than-tories-on-pipelines

Trudeau 0. Maybe 1, eventually.

1 pipeline approved - Kinder Morgan and approval for an extension to another line by our PM.  With the help of Donald Trump, the Keystone line will also see approval soon.  And this under the leadership of our Liberal PM - Justin Trudeau.  Not, of course, that he had any choice in the matter what with all the money he has promised while our country sinks deeper into debt.  It won't make the granola-eating Birkenstock crew happy - but then nothing short of turning off the taps and plunging our country into total darkness would appease them.