AFN asks Ottawa to declare all aboriginal languages official

[kimmy]

I prefer an official status for English because our laws need to be written down and English is the obvious choice, due to the overwhelming volume of existing legal material that already exists in English and the ubiquitous use of English in this country.

I accept official status for French because we are stuck with it for historical reasons, and because Quebec's civil laws are recorded in French.

I oppose adding to the number of official languages because it will only be a matter of time before some native lawbreaker demands a trial in Snake or criminal charges are thrown out because the police officer failed to serve the arrest in Blackfoot.

-k

[eyeball]

It is a sub-sovereign jurisdiction but is still part of the UK, not a 'country' in the way that Canada is a country. Afaik, there are no Welsh army, Welsh currency, Welsh embassies, etc.

It's a jurisdiction that's still part of Earth, the way Quebec would be if it separated.

[cybercoma]

How about we stick with English and French, and the First Nations can find some other way of keeping their languages alive.

I recall that Welsh was on the brink of extinction at one point, and made an amazing recovery. Perhaps we could find out how that was done, and follow their example.

-k

Wales was turned into a country.

Government of Wales Act 1998

This is what I was going to say. The Inuit got their own territory of Iqaluit, which affords them the autonomy to protect their language. The other indigenous peoples dispersed throughout Canada won't have that luxury.

[Machjo]

I prefer an official status for English because our laws need to be written down and English is the obvious choice, due to the overwhelming volume of existing legal material that already exists in English and the ubiquitous use of English in this country.

I accept official status for French because we are stuck with it for historical reasons, and because Quebec's civil laws are recorded in French.

I oppose adding to the number of official languages because it will only be a matter of time before some native lawbreaker demands a trial in Snake or criminal charges are thrown out because the police officer failed to serve the arrest in Blackfoot.

-k

I agree a transition period would be needed, but why not an IAL at the national level which non-English and non-French Canadians could use as a bridge language that would be easier to learn?

[kimmy]

How about that bridge language just be English, the language in which the vast majority of business is conducted in Canada anyway?

-k

[kimmy]

This is what I was going to say. The Inuit got their own territory of Iqaluit, which affords them the autonomy to protect their language. The other indigenous peoples dispersed throughout Canada won't have that luxury.

Why is having their own country a necessity?

-k

[Machjo]

How about that bridge language just be English, the language in which the vast majority of business is conducted in Canada anyway?

-k

Because according to one OECD report, English orthography is over times more difficult to learn than those of Finnish and Greek while about half of Canada's adult population (and 60% on reserves) are functionally illiterate and 20% of Ontario high school students speak neither official language as a mother tongue.

Another study in 2005 shows Esperanto to be at least as grammatically precise as French and from five to ten times easier to learn than English.

[cybercoma]

Why is having their own country a necessity?

-k

They don't need their own country. There are ways to go about it without that, but there is absolutely no political will to ensure anything for the First Nations. They can't even get clean drinking water and school funding. We're a long ways away from talking about protecting their language when we're not even concerned with their lives.

[Derek 2.0]

This is what I was going to say. The Inuit got their own territory of Iqaluit Nunavut, which affords them the autonomy to protect their language.

True, and on all commercial flights into Nunavut the pre-flight safety instructions are given in English, French and Inuktitut.......but then the airlines are Inuit/Eskimo owned..........Should Air Canada or Westjet accommodate English, French and every other native language spoken in Canada? What about every other language spoken in Canada? In Metro Vancouver, there are over 50 languages spoken..........that would make for quite the exciting flight from Vancouver to Edmonton.......

[Derek 2.0]

How about that bridge language just be English, the language in which the vast majority of business is conducted in Canada anyway?

-k

And the World, likewise all official aviation and maritime traffic communications.......

[kimmy]

They don't need their own country. There are ways to go about it without that, but there is absolutely no political will to ensure anything for the First Nations. They can't even get clean drinking water and school funding. We're a long ways away from talking about protecting their language when we're not even concerned with their lives.

Indian bands have resources available to do great things, given good leadership. Read about the Osoyoos Indian Band here in Kim Country.

Sadly, a lot of bands seem to have leadership that is either corrupt or incompetent or both. Funneling more money into the hands of band councils that can't do their job properly is not the answer.

-k

[cybercoma]

True, and on all commercial flights into Nunavut the pre-flight safety instructions are given in English, French and Inuktitut.......but then the airlines are Inuit/Eskimo owned..........Should Air Canada or Westjet accommodate English, French and every other native language spoken in Canada? What about every other language spoken in Canada? In Metro Vancouver, there are over 50 languages spoken..........that would make for quite the exciting flight from Vancouver to Edmonton.......

Nobody should be accommodated. We should all speak French. I thought I made that clear earlier.

[Derek 2.0]

Nobody should be accommodated. We should all speak French. I thought I made that clear earlier.

You did, but like the various native languages, French is a dying language.........and of course, our Head of State isn't French or Cree....

[cybercoma]

Indian bands have resources available to do great things, given good leadership.

You would think, but then AFN leadership has said this isn't true. Consider the recent $1,000,000,000 funding shortfall. Consider also the gap in education funding. Consider in that context the shift of half a billion dollars away from infrastructure.

Sadly, a lot of bands seem to have leadership that is either corrupt or incompetent or both.

I'm sure some bands do, just like some city councils are corrupt or incompetent or both, some provincial MLAs (MPPs) are corrupt or incompetent or both, and some federal governments are corrupt or incompetent or both. Politics is politics. However, we certainly seem to do a lot to explain away our own politicians' failures, while holding a magnifying glass to the AFN peoples' leaders, despite clear evidence that there is a massive funding shortage. We're not talking about profligate extravagance here. We're talking about things like safe drinking water. Do you think any non-AFN community would be under a boil water advisory for weeks, let alone 16 years? It's pretty easy to shrug our shoulders and blame corrupt reserves for the problems, but that's a simplistic cop out that ignores the federal government's responsibilities in all of this. It's fine to point out bureaucratic incompetence and corruptions, but let's not pretend it's just the AFN bands and not in our federal government too.

[cybercoma]

You did, but like the various native languages, French is a dying language.........and of course, our Head of State isn't French or Cree....

Our last head of state was Haitian. She most certainly was French. I don't see any good reason we shouldn't keep everything to French alone. We could save the language!

Edited July 12, 2015 by cybercoma

[TimG]

I recall that Welsh was on the brink of extinction at one point, and made an amazing recovery. Perhaps we could find out how that was done, and follow their example.

Welsh still has >500,000 speakers and that was true before it was made official. Languages need a core of people who care about the language and with most native tongues that core of people is too small to keep it alive.

[Derek 2.0]

Our last head of state was Haitian. She most certainly was French.

And she represented who?

[TimG]

Consider the recent $1,000,000,000 funding shortfall

Of course you don't bother to consider that there are likely very good reasons for why the money was not dispersed because those reasons would undermine your preferred narrative.

Consider also the gap in education funding

Again, the government was more than willing to close this gap but the plan was torpedoed by the AFN who don't want to resolve these issues because being able to complain constantly is more important than solving problems. Edited July 12, 2015 by TimG

[cybercoma]

And she represented who?

So? When the Queen of Canada is in the country, she's the head of state. Her viceroy is the head of state in her absence. How often is the Queen here? 3 times in the last 15 years to be exact. Besides, there's no reason we need to have her as our Queen anyway. We could decide to have a new francophone royalty.

[Bryan]

Do you think any non-AFN community would be under a boil water advisory for weeks, let alone 16 years?

No. No non-FN community would have refused to do anything about just so that they could keep blaming someone else.

[cybercoma]

Of course you don't bother to consider that there are likely very good reasons for why the money was not dispersed because those reasons would undermine your preferred narrative.

Of course you don't actually make an argument and instead talk about what I do and don't consider. Probably because you have no argument to make and would rather resort to talking about me. I'm falttered, but try to up your game.

Again, the government was more than willing to close this gap but the plan was torpedoed by the AFN who don't want to resolve these issues because being able to complain constantly is more important than solving problems.

The Liberal government had negotiated a plan. It was Harper's Conservatives who torpedoed the plan because they're not interested in "negotiating with savages," since the party is full of knuckle-dragging racist neanderthals.

[Derek 2.0]

I'm sure some bands do, just like some city councils are corrupt or incompetent or both, some provincial MLAs (MPPs) are corrupt or incompetent or both, and some federal governments are corrupt or incompetent or both. Politics is politics. However, we certainly seem to do a lot to explain away our own politicians' failures, while holding a magnifying glass to the AFN peoples' leaders, despite clear evidence that there is a massive funding shortage. We're not talking about profligate extravagance here. We're talking about things like safe drinking water. Do you think any non-AFN community would be under a boil water advisory for weeks, let alone 16 years? It's pretty easy to shrug our shoulders and blame corrupt reserves for the problems, but that's a simplistic cop out that ignores the federal government's responsibilities in all of this. It's fine to point out bureaucratic incompetence and corruptions, but let's not pretend it's just the AFN bands and not in our federal government too.

You're right, all Canadians, including natives, have a right to free drinking water across Canada, as all free drinking water is owned by the Crown, and the Crown, being somewhat kind, said all Canadians can have free water..........but, what isn't free, is the distribution and treatment facilities that make said free water safe to drink.........Cities and towns, where the economies of scales make sense, provide this delivery of free water in a safe manner to their residents for a fee, be it through a water bill or tax.............Native bands without clean drinking water don't charge their members for the delivery of said water, hence have no money to provide the free water to their people.........call me crazy, maybe native bands should charge their residents a fee

[Derek 2.0]

So? When the Queen of Canada is in the country, she's the head of state. Her viceroy is the head of state in her absence. How often is the Queen here? 3 times in the last 15 years to be exact. Besides, there's no reason we need to have her as our Queen anyway. We could decide to have a new francophone royalty.

Sure, if only, Louie Montcalm didn't lose........ain't history a bitch?

[Bryan]

No no. Please don't give us clean drinking water. We'd rather complain about it. Do you know how f'ing stupid you sound?

You're right, it is stupid, that's why Shoal Lake 40 should stop doing it.

[cybercoma]

Sure, if only, Louie Montcalm didn't lose........ain't history a bitch?

Why does it have to be the royalty of another nation? The Monarch of Canada is already a distinct legal entity. Her personhood could be anyone we choose.