Microaggressions

[BC_chick]

Many people think it's up to them to decide what should and what shouldn't hurt other people and therefore they become dismissive of other people's feelings because they don't agree with them.

Others who are not dismissive of people's feelings may read about micro-aggressions and choose their words more wisely.

[TimG]

What other purpose does this Microaggression thing serve? Making white people feel guilty about their "Inherent Privilege".

You make a good point. There are many white people who find the notion of "white privilege" to be offensive. If these microaggressions were really about 'teaching people how not to be offensive' then the people pushing these microaggressions would agree that using the term "white privilege" is a microaggression (it is at least as offensive as saying the best person should get a job).

But I am pretty sure that the microaggression fans will make up all sorts of excuses to rationalize why insulting white people with rude words is fine and say that white people should just shut up and take it. But when they do so they will repudiate their claim that microaggressions are just 'helpful suggestions'.

[-1=e^ipi]

As CC's post indicated, the underlying notion is that I can never shed my newcomer status because of the colour of my skin. I gave two other examples where people talk to me as though I'm a newly arrived immigrant with no knowledge of Canadian life even though this is the only country I have ever known.

I completely agree that these things are innocent and subtle (micro-aggressions), but they are examples of things that make us visible minorities feel, even just for that one fleeting moment, that we will never truly be considered real Canadians.

Asking about someone's heritage is not offensive and I don't mind at all, but asking 'where are you from?' is one of those innocent questions which stings because it carries baggage. It implies that I'm from somewhere else even though this is the only country I've ever known.

These are the subtle things people say that they don't realize make others feel excluded.

That sucks and I wish people would not treat you like that. If informing people to not treat you or others like that was all microaggression policy was about then I wouldn't have any issue with it.

Unfortunately, it seems like it is being used to silence dissenting opinion on universities and push identity politics. Would you rather that society strive to be egalitarian and treat people based on their merits, their personality, etc. or would you rather society strive for identity politics everywhere, judge people based on their sex and ethnicity and generalize everyone's experience based upon the category they fit into?

[-1=e^ipi]

But I am pretty sure that the microaggression fans will make up all sorts of excuses to rationalize why insulting white people with rude words is fine and say that white people should just shut up and take it. But when they do so they will repudiate their claim that microaggressions are just 'helpful suggestions'.

What are you talking about? Racism has been redefined to be Power + Privilege or whatever, didn't you get the memo? Therefore, it is impossible to be racist to whites or sexist against men. So things like #killallwhitemen don't count as racism or sexism, nor does having white men speak last in class (http://www.westernjournalism.com/canadian-university-professors-make-sure-white-males-last-speak-class/).

Edited November 3, 2015 by -1=e^ipi

[cybercoma]

Really? That's what you got of this?

It's pretty funny since he's demonstrating microaggression with every response. The very fact that he can't understand the world outside his own viewpoint and is completely dismissive of others' experiences (you're the problem after all for being hurt that people see you as not belonging here, not them for holding the belief that you're an outsider) just reinforces the social stratification that he claims doesn't exist. Some people have the luxury of ignoring it and it goes away. When you're confronted with your race every single day whether you want to be or not, you don't have that luxury. When someone dismisses your experiences because they can ignore it and it goes away, that's just straight up white privilege and microaggressive racism.

[cybercoma]

What are you talking about? Racism has been redefined to be Power + Privilege or whatever, didn't you get the memo? Therefore, it is impossible to be racist to whites or sexist against men. So things like #killallwhitemen don't count as racism or sexism, nor does having white men speak last in class (http://www.westernjournalism.com/canadian-university-professors-make-sure-white-males-last-speak-class/).

Poor poor white men. They have it so rough in our society. It's a good thing they have SJWs like you fighting for their cause.

[-1=e^ipi]

Poor poor white men. They have it so rough in our society. It's a good thing they have SJWs like you fighting for their cause.

Way to continually be dismissive of a group of people on the basis of their race and sex. Oh the irony:

It's pretty funny since he's demonstrating microaggression with every response. The very fact that he can't understand the world outside his own viewpoint and is completely dismissive of others' experiences. Some people have the luxury of ignoring it.

[Smallc]

Poor poor white men. They have it so rough in our society. It's a good thing they have SJWs like you fighting for their cause.

Posts like this show that you are also bound by your own world view. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's generally true of most people.

[cybercoma]

Way to continually be dismissive of a group of people on the basis of their race and sex. Oh the irony:

I'm being sarcastic with you because it's patently absurd to believe that white men are oppressed in our society.

[-1=e^ipi]

I'm being sarcastic with you because it's patently absurd to believe that white men are oppressed in our society.

The empirical evidence paints a different picture than the mainstream narrative you buy into

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/34667100/poor-white-boys-get-a-worse-start-in-life-says-equality-report

After controlling for poverty white boys perform the worst in schools. Boys are consistently underperforming girls and whites are consistently underperforming non-whites. Maybe the anti-white male ideology being spread in school systems, or the fact that there are lots of scholarships and groups pushing for higher educational attainment for girls and non-whites, but none for white males, has something to do with this outcome.

[BC_chick]

I remember a thread recently asking what gender and race people would choose if it were up to them.

I don't recall seeing anything but white male. I'm not sure why that is....(rolling eyes)

[cybercoma]

The empirical evidence paints a different picture than the mainstream narrative you buy into

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/34667100/poor-white-boys-get-a-worse-start-in-life-says-equality-report

After controlling for poverty white boys perform the worst in schools. Boys are consistently underperforming girls and whites are consistently underperforming non-whites. Maybe the anti-white male ideology being spread in school systems, or the fact that there are lots of scholarships and groups pushing for higher educational attainment for girls and non-whites, but none for white males, has something to do with this outcome.

Your definition of "consistently" needs revisiting.

I really shouldn't have to post study after study showing how race, gender, etc. affects people's outcomes, when you provide a report on just education, just the poor white boys, and just England, as though that undermines the idea of white male privilege.

Edit: In fact, it's pretty tiresome that I have to go and read the research in order to give you the context of that data, which you conveniently hide or just don't know. It's saying that there's a bigger gap between poor white boys and their middle class white peers. That's because people of other races are more generally disadvantaged across all groups, such that they don't have as far to move when it comes to changing classes. But you would know that, if you actually read the studies and weren't just regurgitating the Breitbart headline from a couple days ago without context and without understanding the research.

Edited November 3, 2015 by cybercoma

[cybercoma]

I remember a thread recently asking what gender and race people would choose if it were up to them.

I don't recall seeing anything but white male. I'm not sure why that is....(rolling eyes)

Because they like the challenge of falling behind. /s

[-1=e^ipi]

I don't recall seeing anything but white male. I'm not sure why that is....(rolling eyes)

Maybe because most of the posters were older and buying into the mainstream narrative. I certainly was too intimidated to post in such a thread until the end. For myself, I would certainly choose to be female given all of the privileges of being female that exist in our society.

[Boges]

Maybe because most of the posters were older and buying into the mainstream narrative. I certainly was too intimidated to post in such a thread until the end. For myself, I would certainly choose to be female given all of the privileges of being female that exist in our society.

But having to menstruate though.

Wait MICROAGRESSION!!!!!

[-1=e^ipi]

That's because people of other races are more generally disadvantaged

You say that yet the data disagrees with you.

Women have a 2:1 hiring advantage in STEM fields: http://www.pnas.org/content/112/17/5360.abstract

Millennial women out earn millennial men in urban areas: http://www.aei.org/publication/the-case-against-the-paycheck-fairness-act/#mbl

[-1=e^ipi]

But having to menstruate though.

Wait MICROAGRESSION!!!!!

On the other hand, no unnecessary erections and I won't get accused of manspreading.

Also, higher life expectancy, more job opportunities, more scholarships, less likely to commit suicide, less likely to be a victim of violent crimes (being a victim of assault suffering brain damage is not pleasant), less likely to be murdered, more funding for gender-specific cancers, greater chance of your emotional concerns being taken seriously, full control over my ability to reproduce, genital integrity as an infant, not subject to drafts in any western countries, etc.

Edit: I feel this thread is going a bit off topic.

Edited November 3, 2015 by -1=e^ipi

[BC_chick]

I would add several other things to that list.

Being a woman certainly has some advantages, but generally speaking, it's difficult to say that men have it *harder* than women. Do you honestly believe that or are you just saying that we have it equally bad but nobody takes men's grievances seriously?

[cybercoma]

Look, I'm not going to look into the studies again for you, Euler. Several times you've posted articles and figures out of context and have been caught. I'm not going to go through every single study you post to contextualize things for you and everyone else who reads this thread. The notion that white men are somehow disadvantaged in our society is laughable at best.

[-1=e^ipi]

Being a woman certainly has some advantages, but generally speaking, it's difficult to say that men have it *harder* than women. Do you honestly believe that or are you just saying that we have it equally bad but nobody takes men's grievances seriously?

I used to dismiss a lot of my experiences as 'the grass being greener on the other side' but recent developments in my life and society at large has changed my position greatly (as well as learning about differing perspectives on gender issues).

Whether women or men have it 'worse off' is going to depend greatly on many factors. 50 years ago men generally did have it better off relative to women. But times change. The experience of baby boomers is going to vary relative to that of millennials. The experience of people in rural areas will vary compared to urban areas. And even for people in the same city of the same generation, someone growing up in a traditionalist family will have different experiences compared to someone in a non-traditionalist family.

But for a millennial living in an urban area growing up in a non-traditionalist family such as myself, there is basically zero benefit to being male (except maybe some really minor things like not getting catcalled, not getting periods, having the ability to reach higher on shelves and arguably the ability to pee standing up (though this is debatable)) and only disadvantages. This is really apparent if you are in need of help or are a victim of a violent crime. If you are about to get mugged and assaulted and call out for help, do you think that people in cars passing by that have full view of everything will stop to help or at least call the cops if you are male? No, you aren't worth their time. Instead you deserve to have brain damage, get victim blamed by your supposed loved ones and have your concerns get dismissed by physicians. Also, having a twin sister so that you can witness year after year of double standards helps you observe sexist discrimination in society.

[-1=e^ipi]

I'm not going to look into the studies

So you would prefer I don't back up claims with supporting evidence?

Okay then, I guess women are paid 75% of what men are paid for the same work and 1 in 4 women will get raped in their lifetime if that's the standard of evidence you like. Hurray for the wonderful claims made by Obama and Trudeau.

The notion that white men are somehow disadvantaged in our society is laughable at best.

Your continued dismissal of the problems faced by a large group of people are microaggressions.

And I don't even take the position that being white is a net disadvantage in our society. But male, most likely if you are a millennial in an urban area. People will talk about how the life expectancy gap, the homeless gap, the suicide gap, the criminal sentencing gap, the violent crime victim gap, etc. are evidence that blacks are disadvantaged relative to whites, but somehow that same criteria doesn't apply when discussing outcome differences between men and women.

[cybercoma]

So you would prefer I don't back up claims with supporting evidence?

I would prefer you take the time to understand the things you're posting, instead of just regurgitating talking points from places like Breitbart.

[poochy]

So if you are a person and went somewhere where you stood out and, you know, stood out, and those people that noticed acted a certain way, like asking you where you are from, are they microaggresive, etc, or are they just doing things that people do?

People, they sure are human.

[Smallc]

People, they sure are human.

Hey, quit stereotyping!

[Black Dog]

But for a millennial living in an urban area growing up in a non-traditionalist family such as myself, there is basically zero benefit to being male (except maybe some really minor things like not getting catcalled, not getting periods, having the ability to reach higher on shelves and arguably the ability to pee standing up (though this is debatable)) and only disadvantages. This is really apparent if you are in need of help or are a victim of a violent crime. If you are about to get mugged and assaulted and call out for help, do you think that people in cars passing by that have full view of everything will stop to help or at least call the cops if you are male? No, you aren't worth their time. Instead you deserve to have brain damage, get victim blamed by your supposed loved ones and have your concerns get dismissed by physicians. Also, having a twin sister so that you can witness year after year of double standards helps you observe sexist discrimination in society.

So you're taking your (alleged) personal experiences and projecting it on to entire groups, which is merely the mirror image of the behaviour you deride in "SJWs".

Has it also ever occurred to you that maybe the things you've experienced in your life weren't due to your gender? I've seen a lot of MRA-types who blame gender discrimination for their own personal choices and failings.