Bryan Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Several people here have clearly expressed that Aboriginal rights should be removed from the Constitution and Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist 'as such'. They wish Canada's attempt at forced assimilation had worked completely, and they advocate and promote more of that. Do you believe that Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist in law in Canada? If so, I'll put you on the list. . You should try reading what people actually write, as opposed to deliberately misrepresenting what they've said. Quote
poochy Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 I understand that you would like Aboriginal Rights to be removed from Canadian law. I understand that you would like to see Aboriginal Peoples disappear as 'Peoples'. "attempt to destroy, in whole or in part, a ... group" I understand that you would like to see that genocide happen in Canada. I understand that you and a few other people think genocide is the correct answer. But you are wrong of course, both legally and morally wrong. . What utter crap, it is impossible to take you seriously. Quote
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Do you believe Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist in law in Canada? . Aboriginal people should exist the same as Irish, Pakistani, Russian, Chinese or any other Canadian. The question of should they exist is pure and utter stupidity. Should they have special rights? That is really up to them however I stand by my belief that these special rights are screwing them over and continues to hold them back. If they truly want to move forward, they need to come up with a different way that does not plot us versus them. Quote
jacee Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 You should try reading what people actually write, as opposed to deliberately misrepresenting what they've said. Well then clarify. Answer the question: Do you believe that Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist in law in Canada? I'm just trying to help CSIS out, make it easier for them to find you treasonous bâtards! Quote
jacee Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 What utter crap, it is impossible to take you seriously. You should. Quote
Bryan Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Well then clarify. Answer the question: Do you believe that Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist in law in Canada? I'm just trying to help CSIS out, make it easier for them to find you treasonous bâtards! "Cease to exist"? I've never implied anything of the sort. Quote
jacee Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Aboriginal people should exist the same as Irish, Pakistani, Russian, Chinese or any other Canadian. The question of should they exist is pure and utter stupidity. Should they have special rights? That is really up to them however I stand by my belief that these special rights are screwing them over and continues to hold them back. If they truly want to move forward, they need to come up with a different way that does not plot us versus them. They do have special rights, and special recognition of those rights in our Constitution Act. Do you believe Aboriginal Peoples should cease to exist in law in Canada? . Quote
jacee Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 "Cease to exist"? I've never implied anything of the sort. "Cease to exist" in law in Canada?Ie, constitution, treaties, Indian Act, etc. ... ? . Quote
Bryan Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 "Cease to exist" in law in Canada? Ie, constitution, treaties, Indian Act, etc. ... ? . The question is false. You are insisting on parameters that no one is advocating. Quote
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 "Cease to exist" in law in Canada? Ie, constitution, treaties, Indian Act, etc. ... ? . In that definition then yes....I do. They should be part of the Canadian people. Not separate Quote
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 The question is false. You are insisting on parameters that no one is advocating. I think the Indian act should go as should the treaties. But this has been tried and rejected by the natives as such there isn't much we can do about it but continue to spin our wheels and waste money in bureaucratic bullshit Quote
drummindiver Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 I think not....note the operative phrase "in our society". There's your trouble..... I think so. "our society" also encompasses all 640 FN. Quote
drummindiver Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 If my opinion stands out on this extremely-right-wing-board ... that's a good thing, imo. But I am not alone ... . "This extremely right-wing-board". Oh my. The moderation on this site does not censor you, nor the other ppl of the left leaning variety. Of which this site is most assuredly the majority. Quote
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) And can you just explain, briefly, the difference between THEY and WE... THEY being the natives of centuries past that some people think had a 'country' WE, ie, the Europeans of the time, 'stole'. Edited June 7, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 There is a difference between the same and equal. There's also a difference between assimilation and segregation. We've segregated the natives onto squalid reserves for over a century. A lot of us think that makes absolutely no sense in this day and age and they ought to be brought into our communities, not paid more money to encourage them to stay out in the boonies where we can't see them. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Apparently we did, or at least our governments did. Even if you conclude the purposes were for good, the outcomes certainly were not. And we should set that straight as best we can. Agreed! By bringing them in to live in our communities and getting rid of the archaic indian act and reservations. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Bryan Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 I think the Indian act should go as should the treaties. But this has been tried and rejected by the natives as such there isn't much we can do about it but continue to spin our wheels and waste money in bureaucratic bullshit Sure, and I agree with most of that. But you're not advocating that anyone should "cease to exist" right? Quote
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) It's my position that "should" is a stupid word. Let's deal with the reality we have: We have treaties that allow us to live in this land. We have a Constitution, laws and court precedents that require that we respect those treaties. Our government representatives - Canada - and some Churches tried hard for over a hundred years to decimate and destroy Indigenous children, people, families, communities ... in a concentrated effort to get rid of them as Indigenous Peoples, destroy their legal rights to the land, take full control of the land and it's financial benefits. You know, I suddenly realized what this situation reminds me of. It reminds me of all those cynical Arab governments who have kept up the pretense of supporting Palestinians for decades, and kept them all in their squalid little refugee camps (reservations) for generations rather than accepting them as citizens and integrating them with their own communities. The only difference here is it's not a cynical play on politics on the part of autocratic governments but a wildly stupid sense of chauvinistic, paternalistic arrogance which has self-appointed 'supporters' doing their best to condemn still more generations of natives to refugee camps (reservations) instead of integrating them with the rest of us. Abetted, of course, by a lot of cynical chiefs who know they'd never have it so good if their people wound up going to live in cities. Cries of 'the land belongs to them' coming from some quarters is no different from the Arab governments still demanding Israel be supplanted by an Arab state and all those Jews go home. It's inane and ridiculous, and does nothing but make any real solution impossible. Edited June 7, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
eyeball Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 I think the Indian act should go as should the treaties. But this has been tried and rejected by the natives as such there isn't much we can do about it but continue to spin our wheels and waste money in bureaucratic bullshit So your only real stake in this is the dime you as a taxpayer pay? When I've complained about the cost of paying for something I can't support I've seen those complaints dismissed when someone points out I'm only shelling out a few pennies per dollar towards it. How much is this actually costing you personally out of pocket? Have you had to give up a good part of your livelihood too, the way fishermen have for example? Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Sure, and I agree with most of that. But you're not advocating that anyone should "cease to exist" right? Not at all. As per my previous post I stated to jacee, they should have the same rights as any other Canadaian including the right to exist. No more, no less. She is just trying to play with words because she's desperate to make a point that doesn't exist Quote
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 This board mostly skews left, with a few middle of the road conservatives here and there. Extreme right wing? Who? You have to remember that if someone is so far over to the left they think Fidel Castro is middle of the road they're going to consider almost everyone to be an extremist right winger... Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 Ah ... another one who still believes genocide is the only answer? Is this a 'white racial dominance' thing? I think it's a caring thing. Some people care about the well-being of natives, and think that continuing to waste generations of lives out on reservations in the woods "because that's how their ancestors lived" is a human tragedy. Then there are others, so fiercely wrapped up in their extremist rhetoric and ideological wars that the misery of the natives is nothing more than ammunition they can eagerly use in their sanctimonious battle against mainstream society. To them, the misery of the natives is a great thing since it allows them to self-righteously spew vitriol across the internet as their self-appointed standard bearer. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 So your only real stake in this is the dime you as a taxpayer pay? When I've complained about the cost of paying for something I can't support I've seen those complaints dismissed when someone points out I'm only shelling out a few pennies per dollar towards it. How much is this actually costing you personally out of pocket? Have you had to give up a good part of your livelihood too, the way fishermen have for example? As always you pick out one thing I said and focus on that instead of the point of this whole thing. As long as we are separate there will always be struggles with the US versus THEM mentality. As much as people think natives win with tax breaks or other rights, they lose in so many other ways which is why we see reserves in the conditions they are Quote
eyeball Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 THEY being the natives of centuries past that some people think had a 'country' WE, ie, the Europeans of the time, 'stole'. So you do get it but you just don't care. This isn't so much a struggle between us and them as just between us - those who care and those who don't. Fair enough.If ordinary Canadians continue to find themselves and the value of their labour falling in the face of widening income disparities, it probably won't be long before pissed-off crowds of Idle No More and Occupy folks merge into one. It wouldn't be the first time a popular revolution coalesced around indigenous aspirations. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Accountability Now Posted June 7, 2015 Report Posted June 7, 2015 it probably won't be long before pissed-off crowds of Idle No More and Occupy folks merge into one. It wouldn't be the first time a popular revolution coalesced around indigenous aspirations. They already did. Didn't you see the videos of the rent a mob in Toronto? I would however like an example of a revolution that coalesced around indigenous aspirations. I think the opposite will happen. Right now aboriginals aren't even on the average Canadisns radar. The more legal battles and more attention they bring by reaching for more will only make the ROC realize enough is enough. Especially considering our immigration levels of people who couldn't care less about agreements made by some British dudes Quote
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