A Sign of What Do-Gooders Can Accomplish

[Bryan]

Every single service that is offered in the DTES is required and we absolutely need more recovery centers.

The pimps and the pushers agree with you. It's been very good for business.

Edited November 17, 2014 by Bryan

[WestCoastRunner]

The pimps and the pushers agree with you. It's been very good for business.

A very good reason for legalized prostitution where they can offer services in a safe working environment. And a very good reason for legalized mj.

[Bryan]

A very good reason for legalized prostitution where they can offer services in a safe working environment. And a very good reason for legalized mj.

People are being forced into prostitution. People are getting hooked on things far more dangerous than pot.

There are no good reasons for any of that.

[WestCoastRunner]

People are being forced into prostitution. People are getting hooked on things far more dangerous than pot.

There are no good reasons for any of that.

Those injection sites are helping prostitutes to get off the street. They are being exposed to social workers/nurses etc while receiving their 'safe' needles that they would otherwise not receive. Why don't you look into the number of prostitutes that have gotten off the streets because of these injection sites before you pull the rug out from under them. And of course there are far more dangerous drugs on the street then mj. I get that.

[WestCoastRunner]

Those injection sites are helping prostitutes to get off the street. They are being exposed to social workers/nurses etc while receiving their 'safe' needles that they would otherwise not receive. Why don't you look into the number of prostitutes that have gotten off the streets because of these injection sites before you pull the rug out from under them. And of course there are far more dangerous drugs on the street then mj. I get that.

Canadians should actually be proud that we are taking a stand to provide these needle exchange sites.

[Bryan]

And of course there are far more dangerous drugs on the street then mj. I get that.

You don't seem to "get" much of anything. The sum total of the programs at DTES is a situation that is much worse than it was, at a cost of $1 million a day. The program does not work as claimed.

Canadians should actually be proud that we are taking a stand to provide these needle exchange sites.

They are an embarrassment to the entire nation that never should have been allowed in the first place.

[WestCoastRunner]

You don't seem to "get" much of anything. The sum total of the programs at DTES is a situation that is much worse than it was, at a cost of $1 million a day. The program does not work as claimed.

They are an embarrassment to the entire nation that never should have been allowed in the first place.

If you don't think I get 'much of anything', those are your thoughts. I don't intend to argue with you on that one. I get 'plenty'.

As far as the solutions to the DTES, I think they are on the right track, however, we have a long way to go to provide treatment for these people and if other communities and neighbourhoods would step up to the plate instead of the 'nimby' syndrome, we would go a long way to solving these issues.

[Shady]

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

[WestCoastRunner]

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

You are compare the DTES with the 'black family'? Incredible. I can't help but LOL.

Edited November 17, 2014 by WestCoastRunner

[On Guard for Thee]

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

The Liberals are responsible for substance abuse now are they? How low will you go?

[WestCoastRunner]

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

I am embarrassed to admit that this statement came from a Canadian.

[Black Dog]

My contempt is for spending lots of money on solutions that don't solve things. As for solutions offered up by the 'argus'' of the world, well, since what's going on there is the eyeball solution we can conclusively state it doesn't work AT ALL. So maybe we should look for the Argus solution to do better, eh?

You just said you don't have a solution. There are do-gooders and then there are do-nothings. You've made it clear which one you are.

[The_Squid]

Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty.

"the black family"??? Is this a cut/paste job? LOL

[Black Dog]

This is a great example as to what liberal social policy actually accomplishes. Which is to say, it makes things worse, destroys lives, and makes people even more dependent on the government. It's the unintended consequences of good intentions, and symbolism over substance. Now, we've just got substance abuse. Thanks to their nonsensical policies. The same type of thing has happened south of the border as well. Where liberal social policy has completely destroyed the black family, which has led to huge problems in education, out of wedlock children, and mass poverty. Even with massive government funding over several decades.

Of all the moronic Shady posts, this is the most recent.

I had no idea slavery, Jim Crow, racist housing policies and the War on Drugs were examples of liberal social policy at work, but then I don't live in the Shadyverse where down is up and hamburgers eat people.

[Argus]

Pretty close to talking dollars and cents, services and so on...

All we need is some links and we're off to the races...

The original cite I posted contained this information.

[Argus]

You just said you don't have a solution. There are do-gooders and then there are do-nothings. You've made it clear which one you are.

No, I said I had not suggested a solution, in response to your complaining about my solution.

[Argus]

Canadians should actually be proud that we are taking a stand to provide these needle exchange sites.

Why? What good are they doing compared to, say, mandatory drug treatment?

[Argus]

Now you're just making things up. Provide a reference to back up your claim that a million dollars a day are being spent on harm reduction in the east side of Vancouver.

Why would you even come into this topic and yet not read the cite which accompanied the very first post?

[dre]

We dont need half measures, we need the government to get out of the business of criminalizing recreation drugs and put all the money saved into treatment.

All drugs should be decriminalized, and all prosecution should be replaced with treatment.

Ten years ago, Portugal decriminalized all drugs. One decade after this unprecedented experiment, drug abuse is down by half:

Health experts in Portugal said Friday that Portugal’s decision 10 years ago to decriminalise drug use and treat addicts rather than punishing them is an experiment that has worked.

“There is no doubt that the phenomenon of addiction is in decline in Portugal,” said Joao Goulao, President of the Institute of Drugs and Drugs Addiction, a press conference to mark the 10th anniversary of the law.

The number of addicts considered “problematic” — those who repeatedly use “hard” drugs and intravenous users — had fallen by half since the early 1990s, when the figure was estimated at around 100,000 people, Goulao said.

Other factors had also played their part however, Goulao, a medical doctor added.

“This development can not only be attributed to decriminalisation but to a confluence of treatment and risk reduction policies.”

Many of these innovative treatment procedures would not have emerged if addicts had continued to be arrested and locked up rather than treated by medical experts and psychologists. Currently 40,000 people in Portugal are being treated for drug abuse. This is a far cheaper, far more humane way to tackle the problem. Rather than locking up 100,000 criminals, the Portuguese are working to cure 40,000 patients and fine-tuning a whole new canon of drug treatment knowledge at the same time.

None of this is possible when waging a war.

[Black Dog]

No, I said I had not suggested a solution, in response to your complaining about my solution.

So let's hear your solutions. I'll make the popcorn.

[ReeferMadness]

Why would you even come into this topic and yet not read the cite which accompanied the very first post?

Clearly it's you that don't read your own cites. Or maybe you just don't understand them.

As of 2009, there were more than 250 service agencies and housing operations in the Downtown Eastside, spending a total of $360 million per year. Roll in the spending on social assistance, and the area easily costs that $1 million a day.

It says they spend money - but it says nothing about what they spent that money on. Food banks. Housing. Counseling. Hot meals. Clothing.

Could be pretty much anything. But your cite doesn't even mention harm reduction.

[Michael Hardner]

The original cite I posted contained this information.

I agree with the philosophy that programs need to be monitored for effectiveness, but I think that article is terribly one-sided. There's no response to the claims at all, that I can find.

[cybercoma]

All drugs should be decriminalized, and all prosecution should be replaced with treatment.

I'm with you on that. Drug abuse should be treated as a medical problem, not a legal one. If we can't even get marijuana decriminalized however, how on earth are you even going to argue for decriminalizing everything else? People simply aren't ready for it. You literally need a paradigm shift in consciousness. It's going to take probably another generation, now that recreational marijuana is slowly being decriminalized (Alaska, Washington, and Colorado now).

[Argus]

I'm with you on that. Drug abuse should be treated as a medical problem, not a legal one. If we can't even get marijuana decriminalized however, how on earth are you even going to argue for decriminalizing everything else?

It's odd that the group which is most vociferously in favour of banning tobacco smoking also seems to be most vociferously in favour of decriminalizing marihuana smoking.

[Argus]

So let's hear your solutions. I'll make the popcorn.

Forced treatment for addicts and the mentally ill, life at hard labour for smugglers, major dealers, and minor repeat dealers.