On Guard for Thee Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Think about how old kids are when they first go to school. You think all they need at that point is 1 plus 1 are 2? Quote
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Oh good. Anecdotes. Well I've seen first hand that teachers don't do that. Teachers feel that they should allow children to think for themselves and try not to inject themselves into it. Now what? There is nothing about teaching social justice that allows for independent thought. It's teaching one opinion or one side of a story. What if you took a course in politics and all they taught you was "why conservatism is better"? Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
cybercoma Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 There is nothing about teaching social justice that allows for independent thought. It's teaching one opinion or one side of a story. What if you took a course in politics and all they taught you was "why conservatism is better"? This just tells me you've never sat in a social justice course ever and are just making crap up because that's what you believe happens. Quote
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 This just tells me you've never sat in a social justice course ever and are just making crap up because that's what you believe happens. Why don't you enlighten me? Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Michael Hardner Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 There is nothing about teaching social justice that allows for independent thought. It's teaching one opinion or one side of a story. What if you took a course in politics and all they taught you was "why conservatism is better"? Are you saying conservatism is the opposite of justice ? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
eyeball Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 So, your Ok with some girl that you don't even know teaching your child to be a good little socialist from kindergarten right on up? It's bad enough now without someone actually mandating it! It would be a hell storm to mandate religion, but they want to mandate socialism now. FFS, it's madness! Yup, teach them to distrust the system, that's what I subscribe to. I had to laugh when my daughter, as punishment for her run in with the cops, had to drive around town in the back of the RCMP cruiser to get their perspective on things. The constable rolled the windows down while driving through the local trailer park, "to smell who's smoking pot" he said, to which my daughter apparently quipped, "you're wasting your time here then because it's a lot easier to smell down at the other ritzier end of town". Attitude with a capital A that one had, the apple of my eye. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Are you saying conservatism is the opposite of justice ? Conservatism is not socialism. The point is, which i'm sure you know; teaching socialism or feminism alone is just as bad as teaching bible studies. BTW - What does justice mean to you? Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 The idea of "social justice" being taught by a group of people who have no issue telling the world that they're the pillars of society and deserve more than everybody else...and who actually fish for charity from people making a fraction of what they do - well, that just delicious irony. Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Michael Hardner Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Conservatism is not socialism. The point is, which i'm sure you know; teaching socialism or feminism alone is just as bad as teaching bible studies. BTW - What does justice mean to you? Fairness - and that includes feminism. Do you believe women deserve equal rights ? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Fairness - and that includes feminism. Do you believe women deserve equal rights ? justice equals distribution, not fairness! Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Fairness - and that includes feminism. Do you believe women deserve equal rights ? Is this question relevant? Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Michael Hardner Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Is this question relevant? Let's see: you just asked me what justice means to me, and said teaching feminism is bad. Can I not ask you questions ? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
cybercoma Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Yup, teach them to distrust the system, that's what I subscribe to. I had to laugh when my daughter, as punishment for her run in with the cops, had to drive around town in the back of the RCMP cruiser to get their perspective on things. The constable rolled the windows down while driving through the local trailer park, "to smell who's smoking pot" he said, to which my daughter apparently quipped, "you're wasting your time here then because it's a lot easier to smell down at the other ritzier end of town". Attitude with a capital A that one had, the apple of my eye. You can't smell cocaine when you drive by a house. It's interesting what "we" choose to vilify and how its policed. Quote
cybercoma Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Conservatism is not socialism. The point is, which i'm sure you know; teaching socialism or feminism alone is just as bad as teaching bible studies. BTW - What does justice mean to you? Why do you think that teaching people about these things, means teaching people to agree with them? Are you one of those nutters who thinks teaching children about homosexuality means they're going to become homosexuals when they otherwise wouldn't? Quote
cybercoma Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Is this question relevant? Seeing as the definition of feminism is the belief that women deserve equal rights, it's acutely relevant to what you've been saying. Quote
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) So, at the heart of the matter is "feminism". We want to officially teach feminism to children at the earliest ages. I'm still waiting for you to enlighten me as whats in these courses and how they are taught. Edited September 30, 2014 by Hal 9000 Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Michael Hardner Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 I'm still waiting for you to enlighten me as whats in these courses and how they are taught. I actually posted the curriculum above. Are you going to answer my question ? It's poor form to ask a question, then once you get an answer turn and run away from your own questions. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 I actually posted the curriculum above. Are you going to answer my question ? It's poor form to ask a question, then once you get an answer turn and run away from your own questions. of course I believe in equal rights...for everybody. You posted a loose outline the curriculum, but what do you actually think gets taught? Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
Michael Hardner Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 of course I believe in equal rights...for everybody. You posted a loose outline the curriculum, but what do you actually think gets taught? There's a link as well. I'm glad to hear you're a feminist though. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
overthere Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Primarily, sure. But they still teach values - Canadian values, fair play, etc. They hate disciplining students, but I haven't heard that they hate teaching values in any form. Things like civics are part of the curriculum. I did not say they hate teaching it in any form, I said they were willing to reinforce values taught by parents. Unfortunately, so often kids come to school now with little idea on how to work and play with others, basic manners are absent. That's what they hate, having to assume the role of parents in order to get their jobs done. In the main, their job is and should be teaching a curriculum of instruction. Every moment spent otherwise is a waste of expensive resources, and cheats those children whose parents have taught them how to behave with other people. I'm not talking about normal class discipline which is something everybody has to learn. Quote Science too hard for you? Try religion!
guyser Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Good parents help teach their children. Good teachers teach their students - they do not try to parent.Huge overlap that one cannot get away from unless you school your own children. Quote
Big Guy Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 Huge overlap that one cannot get away from unless you school your own children. Agreed - except that the parent is far better qualified and informed than the teacher to parent. Some people (like myself and I suspect Hal) feel that I know better than any teacher as to what aspects of morality, ethics, faith, values, interpersonal relationships, etc I want my child to be exposed to and consider. I know far, far more about my child's history, friendships, family influences and maturity than any teacher. For example - teach my children the "plumbing" of the reproductive system and leave it to me to explain how, when and why it should be used. Teach my child the reality of the mismatch of the have and have not's of this world and leave it to me to explain if this is a good thing or a bad thing, why it happened and what (if anything) he\she should do about it. I expect teachers to follow the law and spirit of the given curriculum without trying to interpret it to their personal views and values. That is a very difficult thing to do. But that is why it pays well. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Hal 9000 Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) I have twins and every single year, I have to fight the school because they insist that twins need to be separated for their own social well being. EVERY F@@KING YEAR! Edited September 30, 2014 by Hal 9000 Quote The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so. - Ronald Reagan I have said that the Western world is just as violent as the Islamic world - Dialamah Europe seems to excel at fooling people to immigrate there from the ME only to chew them up and spit them back. - Eyeball Unfortunately our policies have contributed to retarding and limiting their (Muslim's) society's natural progression towards the same enlightened state we take for granted. - Eyeball
guyser Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) Agreed - except that the parent is far better qualified and informed than the teacher to parent.If only that were true. Great sentiment, far from reality though. Works the other way around too. Some people (like myself and I suspect Hal) feel that I know better than any teacher as to what aspects of morality, ethics, faith, values, interpersonal relationships, etc I want my child to be exposed to and consider. I know far, far more about my child's history, friendships, family influences and maturity than any teacher.True for the most part, take out the friendships part and I am with you. A teacher sees far more of the interaction betw your child and his friends in a week than you do in a month. Edited September 30, 2014 by Guyser2 Quote
overthere Posted September 30, 2014 Report Posted September 30, 2014 I know far, far more about my child's history, friendships, family influences and maturity than any teacher. Correct and teachers love parents who are both informed ad involved in teaching values to their own children. It frees them to do their job. I expect teachers to follow the law and spirit of the given curriculum without trying to interpret it to their personal views and values. That is a very difficult thing to do. But that is why it pays well. If only that was possible. In the meantime, they are teaching kids not to punch people in the face randomly, stop stealing at will, why doing school work is important, when and why we say please and thank you..... and so on. Quote Science too hard for you? Try religion!
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