On Guard for Thee Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 I was referring to when the SCC ripped the page from the criminal code and I totally agreed. Let's keep it out of the legal system. Quote
eyeball Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) "A choice to be made between a woman and her doctor". I'm not sure how one could add to that. It's subtracting from this that's at issue. Edited September 21, 2014 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Keepitsimple Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Thats not true. Anyone no matter thier opinions can join the liberal party just like anyone can join the Conservative party. No difference whatsoever. Big difference. They can't be a candidate for Parliament unless they pledge allegiance to Abortion on Demand......otherwise, Trudeau will cross your name off the list - even if it's against the wishes of the local riding. Stay tuned for a few squabbles from riding associations. Quote Back to Basics
waldo Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Big difference. They can't be a candidate for Parliament unless they pledge allegiance to Abortion on Demand......otherwise, Trudeau will cross your name off the list - even if it's against the wishes of the local riding. Stay tuned for a few squabbles from riding associations. why do you persist in using the term "Abortion on Demand"? I asked you to state the restriction(s) on abortion that you want entrenched into law... you refuse. Presumably those restriction(s) would temper/stop your use of the "Abortion on Demand" phrasing - yes? So, again... please step-up and categorically state what restriction(s) to your perceived existing "Abortion on Demand", you believe must be qualified and defined in law. Quote
Mighty AC Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 even if it's against the wishes of the local riding. Should a candidate be free to take any position provided it's popular with the local riding? If a riding was in favour of Muslim internment camps or outlawing homosexuality, should a party accept a candidate echoing those views because the local association chose them? Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
Peter F Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Im puzzled about what Keepitsimple thinks a party - any party - is for? Quote A bayonet is a tool with a worker at both ends
Peter F Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Big difference. They can't be a candidate for Parliament unless they pledge allegiance to Abortion on Demand......otherwise, Trudeau will cross your name off the list - even if it's against the wishes of the local riding. Stay tuned for a few squabbles from riding associations. So? Whats stopping such a party riding association to abandon this draconian liberal leadership and still running their preferred candidate for parliament? Quote A bayonet is a tool with a worker at both ends
Argus Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Thats not true. Anyone no matter thier opinions can join the liberal party just like anyone can join the Conservative party. No difference whatsoever. I think Trudeau has made it clear that if you don't share his opinions and beliefs you're not welcome in that party. Honestly, why, if you had a strong belief that abortion should in some ways be restricted would you want to be a member of such a party? In Canada the party is the leader, and the leader clearly feels nothing but contempt for you. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Putting what down on paper? The common sense rules? Thats the brilliance of it! There is nothing to write down. You seem to be confused. You were the one who said we already have these rules. Now you claim there are no rules. Frankly, while I'm generally pro-choice I don't like the idea of no rules. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Peter F Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 why, if you had a strong belief that abortion should in some ways be restricted would you want to be a member of such a party? Exactly. Quote A bayonet is a tool with a worker at both ends
Argus Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 (edited) At one point half the people in the country would have been in favour of white only drinking fountains or outlawing homosexuality. That's the same bullshit argument rephrased. It's basically that anyone who has an opinion you don't like should be lumped in with extremists, regardless of how many Canadians share that opinion and how moderate it is. Edited September 21, 2014 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
waldo Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 You seem to be confused. You were the one who said we already have these rules. Now you claim there are no rules. Frankly, while I'm generally pro-choice I don't like the idea of no rules. Argus, shhhhhh! They're unspoken... medical associations, ya know! Quote
Argus Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Im puzzled about what Keepitsimple thinks a party - any party - is for? Clearly it's to vote for a single man who will make all decisions. Frankly, why do we even have MP's? What function do they serve? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Peter F Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 You seem to be confused. You were the one who said we already have these rules. Now you claim there are no rules. Frankly, while I'm generally pro-choice I don't like the idea of no rules. and thats ok with me. Frankly I think the system thats running right now is just dandy. So what would you like written down that keep things just the way they are? Quote A bayonet is a tool with a worker at both ends
Argus Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Argus, shhhhhh! They're unspoken... medical associations, ya know! Unspoken rules by secretive professional groups whose primary interest is their own do not sit well with me. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
waldo Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Unspoken rules by secretive professional groups whose primary interest is their own do not sit well with me. apparently... they set the membership guidelines for so-called 'late-term' abortions... and by jeebus, they monitor practical extension of those quidelines... and dagnabit, they publish details/results of that practical extension. Go figure. Quote
Big Guy Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 Im puzzled about what Keepitsimple thinks a party - any party - is for? I would say whatever the party stands for at the time. I am a paid up member of all three major parties and financially support each. I believe in our form of democracy and in this way get the inside information on what is happening within each party at the same time contributing to keep our form of democracy strong. I believe there are good, honest and dedicated people in all parties and when I vote it is on the basis of many personal criteria. I remain very comfortable with that position. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
eyeball Posted September 21, 2014 Report Posted September 21, 2014 I think Trudeau has made it clear that if you don't share his opinions and beliefs you're not welcome in that party. Oh well, I get the sense that because I'm not a right-winger I'm not welcome in Canada. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Mighty AC Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) That's the same bullshit argument rephrased. It's basically that anyone who has an opinion you don't like should be lumped in with extremists, regardless of how many Canadians share that opinion and how moderate it is. No, we're always in transition. At one point the people who would have voted for segregation were the majority, not extremists. I chose those examples to illustrate that issues of ethics or rights shouldn't hinge on popular opinion. Currently, late term abortions are very rare and are almost exclusively performed when medically necessary or the baby will face severe abnormalities. It's not at all extreme to discuss ways of legislating what we have, though it certainly seems unnecessary at the moment. The only people interested are really blue tie loyalists that want to frame JT as dictator, similar to Harper. Or those that really want to take away the abortion option. I consider the former to be desperate and the latter to be extremists. Both the outgoing PM and JT are content enough with the status quo not to challenge it. Harper will refuse to debate it and sit on the fence, JT has said liberals will not take away choice. On this point I am happy that Harper's desire for power trumps ideology. Edited September 22, 2014 by Mighty AC Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
Mighty AC Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 Frankly, while I'm generally pro-choice I don't like the idea of no rules. I think it's fair to legislate the guidelines, as long as we trust medical professionals to make decisions in accordance to such rules, quickly, on the fly. This will be the eventual reality. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
jbg Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 I see Harper is finally going to go to New York, cap in hand, to visit the UN. I guess he finally realizes his position on the world stage has slipped to such an extent he needs some help from somewhere. Maybe Obama will give him a few tips, at least he can tell you how many troops he has and where.Let's see what he says to that G-dawful body. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
On Guard for Thee Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 I'm sure it will come off as "very clear" he just needs some time on a world stage since it is getting on towards election time and my polls ain't so good. Quote
cybercoma Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 I was referring to when the SCC ripped the page from the criminal code and I totally agreed. Let's keep it out of the legal system. You need to read the SCC's decision in full. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted September 22, 2014 Report Posted September 22, 2014 I have actually. Then you know that only one Supreme Court Judge found that it was a constitutional right to have an abortion? In other words, all others ruled against Trudeau's Abortion on Demand. Quote Back to Basics
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