eyeball Posted July 23, 2014 Report Posted July 23, 2014 So is Canada on Assad's side or should we likewise arrest anyone for fighting for Assad? Story 83.201 Everyone who leaves or attempts to leave Canada, or goes or attempts to go on board a conveyance with the intent to leave Canada, for the purpose of committing an act or omission outside Canada that, if committed in Canada, would be an indictable offence under this or any other Act of Parliament for the benefit of, at the direction of or in association with a terrorist group is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term of not more than 14 years. Shouldn't this also read; at the direction of or in association with a dictator? Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Moonlight Graham Posted July 23, 2014 Report Posted July 23, 2014 We don't know the exact charges, like which group this Canadian was aiding, so it's hard to judge this situation right now. We don't even know if this person was acting with a pro or anti Assad group, as far as I know. Quote "All generalizations are false, including this one." - Mark Twain Partisanship is a disease of the intellect.
-1=e^ipi Posted July 23, 2014 Report Posted July 23, 2014 The Harper government has been anti-Assad since day 1 and have been blindly supporting islamist terrorist organizations in Syria. It's pretty obvious. We don't know the exact charges, like which group this Canadian was aiding, so it's hard to judge this situation right now. We don't even know if this person was acting with a pro or anti Assad group, as far as I know. It's pretty obvious it is anti-Assad. Either Al-Nusrah or ISIS. Quote
Big Guy Posted July 24, 2014 Report Posted July 24, 2014 An interesting issue. When you create a law based on who are the good guys and who are the bad guys then you have problems. Good guys become bad guys and vice versa very quickly. Remember the Taliban good guys who got rid of those bad guy Russians in Afghanistan ? And how about that Saddam good guy in Iraq who kept those fanatical Iranians at bay? Was Canada not recently ready to jump on the Western bandwagon to support and encourage those good guy rebels who were going after that Bad ASSAD IN Syria? BTW, what about that "slant eyed yellow menace" country who attacked the good guys at Pearl Harbor and those other bad guys in North Vietnam - those countries which we approach hat in hand trying to negotiate trade agreements? The trouble is that to-day they are not wearing black hats and white hats. If we are not sure then we call them "terrorists", kill them all and let God separate the good ones from the bad ones. And besides, with this legislation, any government can play the role of God - depending on their political bent. Bad legislation. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
On Guard for Thee Posted July 24, 2014 Report Posted July 24, 2014 An interesting issue. When you create a law based on who are the good guys and who are the bad guys then you have problems. Good guys become bad guys and vice versa very quickly. Remember the Taliban good guys who got rid of those bad guy Russians in Afghanistan ? And how about that Saddam good guy in Iraq who kept those fanatical Iranians at bay? Was Canada not recently ready to jump on the Western bandwagon to support and encourage those good guy rebels who were going after that Bad ASSAD IN Syria? BTW, what about that "slant eyed yellow menace" country who attacked the good guys at Pearl Harbor and those other bad guys in North Vietnam - those countries which we approach hat in hand trying to negotiate trade agreements? The trouble is that to-day they are not wearing black hats and white hats. If we are not sure then we call them "terrorists", kill them all and let God separate the good ones from the bad ones. And besides, with this legislation, any government can play the role of God - depending on their political bent. Bad legislation. Laws are pretty much always based on bad guys. You know, murderers, thives and such. What else would we base them on? And your history is a bit off: the Taliban didn't exist when the Ruslies got kicked out of Afg. Maybe you are thinking of Mujahadeen. Also. do you think Sadam kept the Iranians at bay? It's quite obvious who won that war. And if you don't think Assad is a bad guy you have something wrong with you. Quote
jbg Posted July 24, 2014 Report Posted July 24, 2014 It seems like there's no good side to be on. How about France take it back as a colony? It couldn't be worse than what self-determination hath wrought. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
eyeball Posted July 24, 2014 Author Report Posted July 24, 2014 If there really is no good side to be on then we should be just as prepared to charge someone for being on either for the exact same reason, to prevent the spread of these very un-Canadian values in Canada by returning combatants/supporters. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Big Guy Posted July 24, 2014 Report Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) Laws are pretty much always based on bad guys. You know, murderers, thives and such. What else would we base them on? And your history is a bit off: the Taliban didn't exist when the Ruslies got kicked out of Afg. Maybe you are thinking of Mujahadeen. Also. do you think Sadam kept the Iranians at bay? It's quite obvious who won that war. And if you don't think Assad is a bad guy you have something wrong with you. With this legislation the government of the time will decide who are the terrorists and who are the freedom fighters and punish returning diaspora who disagree. It is wrong too often. That is bad legislation. The Taliban are/were the religious source and Pashtun religious leaders in Afghanistan and supporting the Mujahideen who were using American weapons and aid from the West. Saddam's Iraq and Iran had engaged in continuous wars, the last of which took over a million lives - they fought to a stalemate but managed to deplete the military capability of both.. If you notice, the West is no longer condemning Assad as the bloodthirsty dictator. We will soon be looking to him for help against ISIS. I have no intention of arguing history with you or anyone. It is what it is. And I do have periodic and regular health check ups, am proud of my educational background, am doing well financially and have many friends and family who are quite prepared to warn me if/when they perceive that something is wrong with me - but thank you for volunteering your unsolicited diagnosis. I will certainly consider it in the spirit and sensitivity that I believe it was shared. I, on the other hand, do not think that something is wrong with you. You have an opinion, express it freely and have the right to do so. So be it. Edited July 24, 2014 by Big Guy Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
dre Posted July 24, 2014 Report Posted July 24, 2014 I dont even think the Canadian government should have legal standing or jurrisdiction. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
PIK Posted July 25, 2014 Report Posted July 25, 2014 How things have changed. From good fighting evil to evil fighting evil. Quote Toronto, like a roach motel in the middle of a pretty living room.
Big Guy Posted July 25, 2014 Report Posted July 25, 2014 Perhaps that happens when we label anything that we do not understand to be "evil". Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Argus Posted July 25, 2014 Report Posted July 25, 2014 The Harper government has been anti-Assad since day 1 and have been blindly supporting islamist terrorist organizations in Syria. It's pretty obvious. Cite? Evidence? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 25, 2014 Report Posted July 25, 2014 Perhaps that happens when we label anything that we do not understand to be "evil". You can't address, much less fight evil if you refuse to recognize it even exists. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
dre Posted July 25, 2014 Report Posted July 25, 2014 You can't address, much less fight evil if you refuse to recognize it even exists. Every side of every conflict in history thought they were good and the other side was evil. That kind of simplistic binary view is emotionally compelling to some, but its not terribly useful, and its not going to help you understand which competing interests have put two parties at odds. But I guess if the only tool you have is a hammer everything has to look like a nail... Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Argus Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Every side of every conflict in history thought they were good and the other side was evil. Yes, but they weren't all right. This is the thing you seem to overlook. Some of them WERE evil. And it doesn't matter what they thought. Pol Pot WAS evil. So was Stalin. So was Hitler. So were tons of other nasty types throughout history. So your statement is essentially meaningless. And it's not the Ukrainians who are saying the Russian side is evil (well, they are but that's not the point). It's me and most of the West. I have no ethnic, nationalistic or geographic axe grind. And the Russians aren't even Communists any more so I don't have that to persuade me either. My judgement of Putin and his kleptocratic pals is based entirely on their behavior. And yes, it is unquestionably evil. And yes, they are unquestionably the aggressors in this conflict. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Shady Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Yes, but they weren't all right. This is the thing you seem to overlook. Some of them WERE evil. And it doesn't matter what they thought. Pol Pot WAS evil. So was Stalin. So was Hitler. So were tons of other nasty types throughout history.So your statement is essentially meaningless. And it's not the Ukrainians who are saying the Russian side is evil (well, they are but that's not the point). It's me and most of the West. I have no ethnic, nationalistic or geographic axe grind. And the Russians aren't even Communists any more so I don't have that to persuade me either. My judgement of Putin and his kleptocratic pals is based entirely on their behavior. And yes, it is unquestionably evil. And yes, they are unquestionably the aggressors in this conflict. Exactly. It's just more if the moral equivalency nonsense. The only people they can muster the courage to actually call evil, is conservatives in their own countries. Quote
Big Guy Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Exactly. It's just more if the moral equivalency nonsense. The only people they can muster the courage to actually call evil, is conservatives in their own countries. Of course anybody against which we are at war are evil. We know that because God is on our side. God is against evil and since God is on our side against them then they must be evil. When we kill them we are then doing God's work by destroying evil people. That way there is no remorse and these folks then "deserved" to die - women, children, and even the unborn. Some other nations which believe in a different God also claim to be doing their God's work but we know that is not true - our God is better than their God. And besides, they are fanatics and deserve to die - those evil people! Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Shady Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Of course anybody against which we are at war are evil. We know that because God is on our side. God is against evil and since God is on our side against them then they must be evil. When we kill them we are then doing God's work by destroying evil people. That way there is no remorse and these folks then "deserved" to die - women, children, and even the unborn. Some other nations which believe in a different God also claim to be doing their God's work but we know that is not true - our God is better than their God. And besides, they are fanatics and deserve to die - those evil people! Sorry, you lost me. I don't believe in God. Quote
Big Guy Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Sorry, you lost me. I don't believe in God. Well then just don't depend on him/her to be on your side in your next war! Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Shady Posted July 26, 2014 Report Posted July 26, 2014 Well then just don't depend on him/her to be on your side in your next war! I never have. Quote
jbg Posted July 30, 2014 Report Posted July 30, 2014 I dont even think the Canadian government should have legal standing or jurrisdiction. I guess you think that still vests in the Queen? Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
dre Posted July 30, 2014 Report Posted July 30, 2014 I guess you think that still vests in the Queen? Wow... another brilliant post! No... I just dont think we should have laws like this: Everyone who leaves or attempts to leave Canada, or goes or attempts to go on board a conveyance with the intent to leave Canada, for the purpose of committing an act or omission outside Canada that, if committed in Canada, would be an indictable offence Its an attempt to assert extraterritorial jurisdiction. Canadian law should not be applied beyond our borders, this guy was in Syria and subject to Syrian law at the time of his alledged offence. If you really WERE a lawyer as you claim to be you would understand why this is problematic. Should our government bring drug charges against Canadians that smoked dope in Amsterdaam? Should they bring firearms charges against Canadians that carried a handgun in the US? Should we charge them with traffic violations because they drove on the left side of the road while they were in france? Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
jbg Posted July 31, 2014 Report Posted July 31, 2014 Wow... another brilliant post! No... I just dont think we should have laws like this: Its an attempt to assert extraterritorial jurisdiction. Canadian law should not be applied beyond our borders, this guy was in Syria and subject to Syrian law at the time of his alledged offence. I apologize. I did not adequately review the context. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Big Guy Posted August 1, 2014 Report Posted August 1, 2014 Commenting on the OP: "Who's side if any is Canada on?" The Jewish Defence League has been labelled as a terrorist by the USA. Canada has not labelled that organization as "terrorist" Why? Who's side if any is Canada on? Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
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