BC Teachers Getting Screwed...Again

[bleeding heart]

Pct: Churchill, so I understand, did not make any such remark....which, it should be pointed out, is meant to be a throwaway aphorism, not a piece of "wisdom" to be made by conservatives a million times on internet forums...lest we forget (if we are to take it seriously, which we aren't meant to), it describes all young "non-socialists"--quite insultingly, I should add--as virtual sociopaths.

Edited March 24, 2014 by bleeding heart

[Pct2017]

Pct: Churchill, so I understand, did not make any such remark....which, it should be pointed out, is meant to be a throwaway aphorism, not a piece of "wisdom" to be made by conservatives a million times on internet forums...lest we forget (if we are to take it seriously, which we aren't meant to), it describes all young "non-socialists"--quite insultingly, I should add--as virtual sociopaths.

So, what you are saying is that all hope is lost for our friend Socialist? This is a sad day indeed. I must say you could have been a bit more gentle in breaking the news to him. You cruel, cruel person.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Pct2017

[socialist]

So, what you are saying is that all hope is lost for our friend Socialist? This is a sad day indeed. I must say you could have been a bit more gentle in breaking the news to him. You cruel, cruel person.

Well aren't they lucky in BBC where the BCTF has taken the neo- Liberal Government to the Supreme Court in defense of BC kids & win not only once, but twice.

[overthere]

This has nothing to do with getting a raise. It has to do with reducing class sizes that will benefit all learners. The neo-libs are trying to privatize education. That would be terrible for democracy as only the rich will benefit.

It is certainly a complete coincidence that decreasing class sizes by collective agreement means that many more teachers will be hired and many more dollars will flow to the teachers union. And many more dollars will flow from taxpayers pockets.

[socialist]

It is certainly a complete coincidence that decreasing class sizes by collective agreement means that many more teachers will be hired and many more dollars will flow to the teachers union. And many more dollars will flow from taxpayers pockets.

Well, with the high % of struggling learners these days, small class sizes is a no brainer which will, yes, result in the need for more teachers. Are you a neo-liberal who is driven by corporate interests in education? Because if you are, you could care less about the learners. Public education is for the good of all society and democracy and it must be paid by taxpayers who benefit from the positive influence public education has on society.

[overthere]

Well, with the high % of struggling learners these days, small class sizes is a no brainer which will, yes, result in the need for more teachers. Are you a neo-liberal who is driven by corporate interests in education? Because if you are, you could care less about the learners. Public education is for the good of all society and democracy and it must be paid by taxpayers who benefit from the positive influence public education has on society.

I went to school when class sizes were much larger than they are now.

Yet... you're saying that there are many more 'struggling learners ' today? Are the teachers that much worse now, despite their high pay and superb benefits?

Perhaps we ned to cull the poor performers, somehting that has never been attempted in Canada. Wouldn't your union like that: accountability for results.

Oh, and speaking of results.... Edmonton Public Board( a big one) unofficially capped class sizes about five years ago.

Since then, universal test results have gotten worse. Funny that.

Oh, and I'm a strong supporter of public education, it has worked a charm here. Somehow you equate that with offering a blank cheque to you and your pals. Looks like you need some remedial work in reading comeprehension.

[Bryan]

True. BC teachers are among the lowest paid in Canada.

They look like they are well compensated to me:

http://www.makeafuture.ca/career-resources/salary-finder/

[socialist]

I went to school when class sizes were much larger than they are now.

Yet... you're saying that there are many more 'struggling learners ' today? Are the teachers that much worse now, despite their high pay and superb benefits?

Perhaps we ned to cull the poor performers, somehting that has never been attempted in Canada. Wouldn't your union like that: accountability for results.

Oh, and speaking of results.... Edmonton Public Board( a big one) unofficially capped class sizes about five years ago.

Since then, universal test results have gotten worse. Funny that.

Oh, and I'm a strong supporter of public education, it has worked a charm here. Somehow you equate that with offering a blank cheque to you and your pals. Looks like you need some remedial work in reading comeprehension.

Well, when you went to school there were fewer learners with special needs. and those that had special needs were taken out of the main classroom for individualized instruction. Now everyone is in one class. Smaller class sizes are needed which will result in a need for more educators. That will benefit the learners the most. It's sad that people like you are against helping learners.

The BC neo-liberal government needs to return tax dollars stolen from education and given as a tax break to wealthy corporations. Proper education funding is crucial at this point.

Those of you who lack facts need to read this to understand. http://www.bctf.ca/uploadedFiles/Public/Parents/ParentLetterJobAction_en.pdf

[Pct2017]

Ever wonder what a one string banjo sounds like? Well, young Socialist has given quite the concert on this board. In 27 posts, he has used the term " neo-liberal" ( sometimes even he gets a bit lazy and uses neo-libs, but we have to assume those are days when his 5.5 hours of work have left him drained) 16 times and on 11 times he has stated outright that if you question his superior knowledge about education then you are against all forms of learning. Plink a plink a plink.

You will learn all too soon that to ask him a legit question is futile as all he knows is throw away lines that they teach him down at the teacher union hall. Oh, but he is great with cartoons.

Socialist, obviously you and I see the world through completely different lenses, but at the end of the day, I do feel sorry for you. You are way too young to be bitter at the world. No, it is not a perfect but you should chill a bit and enjoy you place in it.

[socialist]

Ever wonder what a one string banjo sounds like? Well, young Socialist has given quite the concert on this board. In 27 posts, he has used the term " neo-liberal" ( sometimes even he gets a bit lazy and uses neo-libs, but we have to assume those are days when his 5.5 hours of work have left him drained) 16 times and on 11 times he has stated outright that if you question his superior knowledge about education then you are against all forms of learning. Plink a plink a plink.

You will learn all too soon that to ask him a legit question is futile as all he knows is throw away lines that they teach him down at the teacher union hall. Oh, but he is great with cartoons.

Socialist, obviously you and I see the world through completely different lenses, but at the end of the day, I do feel sorry for you. You are way too young to be bitter at the world. No, it is not a perfect but you should chill a bit and enjoy you place in it.

I enjoy my world as I advocate for a better world through social justice. Public education is strong and people like you are in the minority.

[socialist]

This article sums it up beautifully. Some of you ,ow-information voters really need to read this.

http://rabble.ca/news/2014/03/bc-teachers-math-lesson-workers-labour-rights-stability

[Bryan]

Rabble? What other sources are you going to post? Pravda? Granma?

[Pct2017]

This article sums it up beautifully. Some of you ,ow-information voters really need to read this.

http://rabble.ca/news/2014/03/bc-teachers-math-lesson-workers-labour-rights-stability[/size]

That was certainly a balanced piece of reporting. The part about the fact that those bastard neo-libs that the people of BC recently re- elected yet again have been able to negotiate collective agreements with 100% of all public sector unions which do not have teachers in them was somehow omitted. Guess that part got edited out. Guess the other part that got left out due to limited space on a website page is the part about all bargaining has been suspended until April because the union said it would be "impossible" to meet during Spring Break. Other than that and about a thousand other glaring omissions, it was outstanding reporting. Edited March 26, 2014 by Pct2017

[socialist]

That was certainly a balanced piece of reporting. The part about the fact that those bastard neo-libs that the people of BC recently re- elected yet again have been able to negotiate collective agreements with 100% of all public sector unions which do not have teachers in them was somehow omitted. Guess that part got edited out. Guess the other part that got left out due to limited space on a website page is the part about all bargaining has been suspended until April because the union said it would be "impossible" to meet during Spring Break. Other than that and about a thousand other glaring omissions, it was outstanding reporting.

The government has it in for public education. They have been underfunding BC education for years. That's why the Federation has to stand up against the neo-liberal intrusion. I don't think you understand what neo-liberalism is. There are many great articles out there that will enlighten you.

https://bctf.ca/publications/NewsmagArticle.aspx?id=21900

http://www.bctf.ca/publications/NewsmagArticle.aspx?id=20410

http://www.academia.edu/726482/Resisting_the_Common-Nonsense_of_Neoliberalism_A_Report_from_British_Columbia

[Pct2017]

"The government has it in for public education. They have been underfunding BC education for years. That's why the Federation has to stand up against the neo-liberal intrusion. I don't think you understand what neo-liberalism is. There are many great articles out there that will enlighten you."

Plink a plink a plink.

Second verse: Plink a plink a plink.

BTW, you get sent to the corner of the classroom wearing a dunce hat for citing Rabble, then you show that no lesson was learned as the next "source" you cite is the BCTF website. You are truly one of the slowest learners I have ever seen.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Pct2017

[socialist]

"The government has it in for public education. They have been underfunding BC education for years. That's why the Federation has to stand up against the neo-liberal intrusion. I don't think you understand what neo-liberalism is. There are many great articles out there that will enlighten you."

Plink a plink a plink.

Second verse: Plink a plink a plink.

BTW, you get sent to the corner of the classroom wearing a dunce hat for citing Rabble, then you show that no lesson was learned as the next "source" you cite is the BCTF website. You are truly one of the slowest learners I have ever seen.

So you just saw my links were from the BCTF and dismissed them without reading. That shows you lack critical thinking, which is a main focus of public schools in the 21st century.

[Pct2017]

So you just saw my links were from the BCTF and dismissed them without reading. That shows you lack critical thinking, which is a main focus of public schools in the 21st century.

Just a point of curiosity. Do you ever read what you write after you post and say, "Wow, I really am an ass."? Just curious.

So, in your universe, if someone has seen nothing but complete utter self serving garbage on a website time after time and they choose to not waste time on it this time, that person is relegated to having a lack of critical thinking. Wonder what colour the sky is in your alternate world.

Look, I appreciate that you seem to have all the time in the world (do they measure time in your world the same as here on Earth) to search out websites that validate your views, which again is weird, given that you are quick to bemoan just how long your workday is, but maybe you do it while you are firing up a video in class. Maybe spend a bit of time questioning them rather than slathering over them. That would be critical thinking.

Hey look, we are never going to agree on anything. As I have said to you, I actually have sympathy for you as a person because if you only know how to turn left, you will spend your whole life going in circles. You need to chill and enjoy life, but I expect that these words, like everything else that is said to you by anyone who does not agree with you will be lost on you. Be well my friend and maybe this summer go out and hike in the Annapurnas or run a marathon or bike a century or do something other than fretting over a socialist war that has long since been lost.

[socialist]

Just a point of curiosity. Do you ever read what you write after you post and say, "Wow, I really am an ass."? Just curious.

So, in your universe, if someone has seen nothing but complete utter self serving garbage on a website time after time and they choose to not waste time on it this time, that person is relegated to having a lack of critical thinking. Wonder what colour the sky is in your alternate world.

Look, I appreciate that you seem to have all the time in the world (do they measure time in your world the same as here on Earth) to search out websites that validate your views, which again is weird, given that you are quick to bemoan just how long your workday is, but maybe you do it while you are firing up a video in class. Maybe spend a bit of time questioning them rather than slathering over them. That would be critical thinking.

Hey look, we are never going to agree on anything. As I have said to you, I actually have sympathy for you as a person because if you only know how to turn left, you will spend your whole life going in circles. You need to chill and enjoy life, but I expect that these words, like everything else that is said to you by anyone who does not agree with you will be lost on you. Be well my friend and maybe this summer go out and hike in the Annapurnas or run a marathon or bike a century or do something other than fretting over a socialist war that has long since been lost.

I feel sympathy for you. You have no sense of what happens in schools yet you fell like you are an expert because you once attended school. I guess I'm a highway expert because I drive on one. Your views are old fashioned and you have no clue of what is happening. I'll even venture a guess that you have no concept of social justice, just like the neo-liberals and their privatization agenda.

[westguy]

socialist- you drive? OMG lock up the kids

[socialist]

Just a point of curiosity. Do you ever read what you write after you post and say, "Wow, I really am an ass."? Just curious.

So, in your universe, if someone has seen nothing but complete utter self serving garbage on a website time after time and they choose to not waste time on it this time, that person is relegated to having a lack of critical thinking. Wonder what colour the sky is in your alternate world.

Look, I appreciate that you seem to have all the time in the world (do they measure time in your world the same as here on Earth) to search out websites that validate your views, which again is weird, given that you are quick to bemoan just how long your workday is, but maybe you do it while you are firing up a video in class. Maybe spend a bit of time questioning them rather than slathering over them. That would be critical thinking.

Hey look, we are never going to agree on anything. As I have said to you, I actually have sympathy for you as a person because if you only know how to turn left, you will spend your whole life going in circles. You need to chill and enjoy life, but I expect that these words, like everything else that is said to you by anyone who does not agree with you will be lost on you. Be well my friend and maybe this summer go out and hike in the Annapurnas or run a marathon or bike a century or do something other than fretting over a socialist war that has long since been lost.

Are you even aware of the push for personalized learning in BC schools? Didn't think so. Educate yourself with some reality.

[Pct2017]

Are you even aware of the push for personalized learning in BC schools? Didn't think so. Educate yourself with some reality.

Well, that is kind of a quirky thing for you to say. Let us have a look at that.

First, can I assume from your rather self righteous tone that you believe personalized learning to be a good thing no?

Well, it was those rat bastard neo- liberals who introduced the Education improvement Act. One of the elements introduced in that Act was personalized learning plans. But, I bet you say, it would be typical for the corporate loving neo-libs to not fund it right. Well, no. If I recall, there was about $ 100 million assigned to education (all new dollars - the Learning Improvement Fund) in that Act. Yeah, but those privatizing scoundrels were forced into it by our heroic BCTF you assume.

Well, this is where it gets interesting. The Educational Improvement Act was also known as Bill 22. Yes, the same Bill that the BCTF took to court to have overturned. So, as of right now my young friend, no there is no push for personalized learning in BC, due entirely to the BCTF. Hmmm, someone needs to educate himself.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Pct2017

[socialist]

Well, that is kind of a quirky thing for you to say. Let us have a look at that.

First, can I assume from your rather self righteous tone that you believe personalized learning to be a good thing no?

Well, it was those rat bastard neo- liberals who introduced the Education improvement Act. One of the elements introduced in that Act was personalized learning plans. But, I bet you say, it would be typical for the corporate loving neo-libs to not fund it right. Well, no. If I recall, there was about $ 100 million assigned to education (all new dollars) in that Act. Yeah, but those privatizing scoundrels were forced into it by our heroic BCTF you assume.

Well, this is where it gets interesting. The Educational Improvement Act was also known as Bill 22. Yes, the same Bill that the BCTF took to court to have overturned. So, as of right now my young friend, no there is no push for personalized learning in BC, due entirely to the BCTF. Hmmm, someone needs to educate himself.

You are proof that there is a concerted war against their unions and their efforts to protect the middle class from exploitation. Why don't you demand corporations pay more in taxes beyond the low 9% currently paid? BC would be out of debt if they raised corporate taxes. You need to stop drinking the Fraser Institute kool aid and learn to think for yourself.

[Pct2017]

You are proof that there is a concerted war against their unions and their efforts to protect the middle class from exploitation. Why don't you demand corporations pay more in taxes beyond the low 9% currently paid? BC would be out of debt if they raised corporate taxes. You need to stop drinking the Fraser Institute kool aid and learn to think for yourself.

Plink a plink a plink

You are just having the worst day ever, are you not. Did that mean old school principle make you work well into your sixth hour at school today?

OK, so general corporations in BC pay 26% corporate tax when the federal and provincial portions are combined. That number is really, really easy to find on the net. Even you should be able to find it. Oh, on second thought, I'd better help you. You seem pretty tired today.

http://www.kpmg.com/Ca/en/IssuesAndInsights/ArticlesPublications/TaxRates/Federal-and-ProvincialTerritorial-Tax-Rates-for-Income-Earned-General-2013-2014.pdf

Hey, did you get the irony of citing KPMG which is Jenny Kwan's least favourite accounting firm. OK, fair enough. You have to be out here in BC to get that one.

But, you scream at the computer screen, that is nothing compared to the massive amounts of taxes that poor, middle class teachers have to pay. Well, let's have a peek at that. Let us say that a teacher makes $75,000/year in BC. Want to guess what she pays in taxes? Go ahead. Give you a hint. It is $15,200, assuming that she does not defer any income in an RRSP. Wellll, that works out to only 20.2% combined federal and provincial tax.

Hmm, maybe our middle class teacher is not doing so badly on this whole tax thingy after all.

Man, you are just not doing well at all today.

BTW, could you give me one quote whereby I have ever slagged any union other than the BCTF? So let us drop this idea that I am railing against all unions. Just our dear old teacher friends.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Pct2017

[GostHacked]

The teaching profession, like all professions, has members who are dedicated, hard workers and earn less than they deserve. There are a few who are not and should not be in that profession.

My personal experience is that I have seen and dealt with fewer incompetent teachers than incompetent policemen, lawyers, doctors or members of parliament.

But how do you get incompetent police, lawyers, doctors, or members of parliament? If the ratio of incompetent teachers is low compared to other professions, what is being taught in order to have such a boom in incompetence in other lines of work?

[Michael Hardner]

Let us say that a teacher makes $75,000/year in BC. Want to guess what she pays in taxes? Go ahead. Give you a hint. It is $15,200, assuming that she does not defer any income in an RRSP. Wellll, that works out to only 20.2% combined federal and provincial tax.

Somebody making $75K in BC only pays 20% combined taxes ? That sounds wrong.