The Truth About Obamacare

[bush_cheney2004]

Just shows how many subliterate cretins live in America.

Really? That's all you have ? Millions more "subliterate cretins" from around the world have always chosen the U.S. over Canada, and always will.

Edited November 2, 2013 by bush_cheney2004

[Guest American Woman]

Aren't senators supposed to be the mature statesmen? I mean, as mature as you get in your country these days...

I'm not sure how things are in Canada, but in the U.S., "mature" isn't synonymous with "lacking a sense of humor."

Just shows how many subliterate cretins live in America.

Hmmmm. So American is populated with a bunch of "subliterate cretins," yet I hear tell that what happens in America, the lone Super Power, affects the rest of the world - so what does that say about the rest of the world? Seriously.

[Smallc]

Rush Limbaugh is pretty successful, eh? And let's face it, liberals do things that can be made fun of too; it's not a one-sided thing.

Maher is hardly funny, IMO. Colbert and Stewart most definitely make fun of the liberals/left, too.

This post proves you missed the point....I didn't say it wasn't funny to make fun of Liberals. I said that Conservatives tend to be unfunny and Rush Limbaugh isn't a comedian.

[Guest American Woman]

This post proves you missed the point....I didn't say it wasn't funny to make fun of Liberals. I said that Conservatives tend to be unfunny and Rush Limbaugh isn't a comedian.

Whatever label you want to put on him, your "conservatives tend to be unfunny" says more about where you're coming from politically than it does about how funny they are. That's the bottom line. So no, I didn't miss the point at all. Edited November 2, 2013 by American Woman

[Smallc]

Whatever label you want to put on him, your "conservatives tend to be unfunny" says more about where you're coming from politically than it does about how funny they are. That's the bottom line. So no, I didn't miss the point at all.

No, actually, it doesn't. I think it's funny to make fun of stupid liberals just as much as I do stupid conservatives. Conservatives just don't tend to do as well at comedy, and that's why there aren't many Dennis Millers (and even he isn't as popular as the likes of the three that I mentioned along with many other liberal comedians).

[Guest American Woman]

No, actually, it doesn't. I think it's funny to make fun of stupid liberals just as much as I do stupid conservatives. Conservatives just don't tend to do as well at comedy, and that's why there aren't many Dennis Millers (and even he isn't as popular as the likes of the three that I mentioned along with many other liberal comedians).

I think it does, and the fact that you think Bill Maher is funny is testament to that. Furthermore, I'm guessing you would find Limbaugh a lot funnier if he made fun of Republicans, too; ie: you don't think Republicans are funny because they don't do that. But here's the thing - there have been plenty of funny Republicans. I doubt if any of the liberal comedians you find funny will be able to match Bob Hope, for example. I think you're assuming that all comedians are Democrats. Another successful Republican that comes to mind: Jay Leno. I believe Jerry Seinfeld is, too.

At any rate, this is getting to the point where it's taking the thread off topic, so I've made my point - and so I'm done.

Edited November 2, 2013 by American Woman

[Smallc]

I think it does, and the fact that you think Bill Maher is funny is testament to that.

I think he's funny, because he's funny. It's not only liberals that watch him and find him funny.

Furthermore, I'm guessing you would find Limbaugh a lot funnier if he made fun of Republicans, too; ie: you don't think Republicans are funny because they don't do that.

I would find him funnier if he were a comedian probably. You know, I'm not the first person to make this observation. Look it up, there are a ton of articles. Generally, conservative comedy doesn't work, because it doesn't deal in the truth. Obama isn't a Kenyan socialist, and that just isn't funny.

You seem to have a real problem with generally accepted truths, and I'm not sure why. There aren't many successful conservative comedians. That's just a fact.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Smallc

[Smallc]

Perhaps in the end it's just because, in the words of Stephen Colbert, "reality has a well-known liberal bias." Reality is funny. The rest is just wearing silly costumes for Andrew Breitbart.

http://gawker.com/5460506/why-arent-conservatives-funny

That sums it up pretty well.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Smallc

[bush_cheney2004]

The truth is that Obamacare is pretty damn funny...so far.

[Smallc]

And everyone from all corners makes fun of it. I don't personally find this particular thing (Obamacare and the difficult rollout) terribly funny, but, hey, that's just me.

[Guest American Woman]

The truth is that Obamacare is pretty damn funny...so far.

That is the truth, all right!

"There was some good news today for embattled Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius. Obamacare will cover all her injuries after the White House throws her under the bus. She is totally covered." –Jay Leno

[bush_cheney2004]

And everyone from all corners makes fun of it. I don't personally find this particular thing (Obamacare and the difficult rollout) terribly funny, but, hey, that's just me.

Bingo...we now know that "funny" is not your area of expertise. And that's OK.

[Smallc]

Most people from countries with universal healthcare really don't find anything to do with the situation in the US funny, I would think.

[Argus]

I'm not sure how things are in Canada, but in the U.S., "mature" isn't synonymous with "lacking a sense of humor."

Sorry? Sense of what? Maybe it's just our general belief in politeness and good manners, but a senator foisting a book upon a cabinet secretary and then preening for the cameras doesn't strike me as humourous except insofar as this individual managed to get himself elected.

Hmmmm. So American is populated with a bunch of "subliterate cretins," yet I hear tell that what happens in America, the lone Super Power, affects the rest of the world - so what does that say about the rest of the world? Seriously.

I didn't say there weren't semiliterate cretins elsewhere. I just commented on the fact that so many of the Americans' senior politicians are so bug-eyed nutty that they must have an extraordinary number of idiots amongst their electorate.

I think someone referenced Maher earlier and I happened to catch a bit of him on CNN last night. He was commenting (he's not the first) on how so many Americans are in silos, where the only thing they see is the likes of FOX news and Rush Limbaugh, and so their view of the world is so extraordinarily insular and nutty. These are the people who elect the likes of Bachman and Cruz and Paul and King and Gohmert.

[Argus]

Whatever label you want to put on him, your "conservatives tend to be unfunny" says more about where you're coming from politically than it does about how funny they are. That's the bottom line. So no, I didn't miss the point at all.

As a conservative, I don't find them so much funny as crooked and nuts.

[Shady]

Anyways, on to things that acutally matter.

You Also Can't Keep Your Doctor

My grievance is not political; all my energies are directed to enjoying life and staying alive, and I have no time for politics. For almost seven years I have fought and survived stage-4 gallbladder cancer, with a five-year survival rate of less than 2% after diagnosis. I am a determined fighter and extremely lucky. But this luck may have just run out: My affordable, lifesaving medical insurance policy has been canceled effective Dec. 31

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304527504579171710423780446

Another success story as a result of Obama's great and compassionate health care reform. Heckuva job Barry. Heckuva job.

[waldo]

Anyways, on to things that acutally matter.

Another success story as a result of Obama's great and compassionate health care reform. Heckuva job Barry. Heckuva job.

Shady, why do you advocate for "junk insurance"... why do want all those Americans to have "junk healthcare insurance"?

That Florida woman's canceled Blue Cross policy? It's junk insurance --- She can get a real plan for only $165 a month

Conisder the case of Diane Barrette, a 56-year-old woman from Winter Haven, Fla. Her story was featured in this CBS News report and endlessly echoed on the Internet. She was upset because Blue Cross Blue Shield of Florida was canceling her $54-a-month “GoBlue plan 91” and offering to replace it with a $591-a-month “Blue Options Essential plan.”

Sounds terrible—except that Barrette’s expiring policy is a textbook example of a junk plan that isn’t real health insurance at all. If she had ever tried to use it for anything more than an occasional doctor visit or inexpensive prescription, she would have ended up with tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars of medical debt.

Here are some of the gory details. (You can see the rest for yourself on this complete plan summary from the insurance company.)

- The plan pays only the first $50 of doctor visits, leaving Ms. Barrette to pay the rest. Specialist visits can cost several hundred dollars.

- Only the first $15 of a prescription is covered. Some prescriptions can cost hundreds or even thousands of dollars a month

- The plan only pays for hospitalization for "complications of pregnancy," which are unlikely given Ms. Barrette's age and in any event only the first $50 is covered.

- It pays $50 for a mammogram that can cost several hundred dollars, and only pays $50 apiece for advanced imaging tests such as MRIs and CT scans and then only when used for osteoporosis screening.

"She's paying $650 a year to be uninsured," Karen Pollitz, an insurance expert at the nonprofit Kaiser Family Foundation, said. "I have to assume that she never really had to make much of a claim under this policy. She would have lost the house she's sitting in if something serious had happened. I don't know if she knows that."

Okay, but can't we be outraged that Ms. Barrette will have to fork over $591 a month for a replacement plan? Actually, no, because she has other and better options than the costly plan Blue Cross Blue Shield wants to put her in. She get real insurance that covers all essential health benefits for well under $200 a month.

She has said her income is about $30,000 a year. It would be nice to look up her choices on HealthCare.gov, which is running the marketplace in Florida. But you can't do that without actually applying for coverage.

So, using tools available through eHealthinsurance.com (I'll walk you through this useful resource tomorrow), I determined that she qualifies for a premium subsidy of $320 a month. She can use that to purchase a Humana Direct Silver 4600/6300 plan for $165 a month.

[waldo]

the ShadyHand!

[Shady]

Shady, why do you advocate for "junk insurance"... why do want all those Americans to have "junk healthcare insurance"?

That Florida woman's canceled Blue Cross policy? It's junk insurance --- She can get a real plan for only $165 a month

She can't keep the doctors she's had for the past few years. The Liar-In-Chief promised otherwise. And the new "great" plan by the Kaiser official that know what's best for everyone, better than the individuals themselves have huge deductibles. The Liar-In-Chief promised that people could keep their plans if they liked them. She had a very good plan, that she liked. She can't keep it, or her doctors. Obama's a disputable lying liar.

[BubberMiley]

This Modern World is funny. Conservatives should be funny like that.

[On Guard for Thee]

She can't keep the doctors she's had for the past few years. The Liar-In-Chief promised otherwise. And the new "great" plan by the Kaiser official that know what's best for everyone, better than the individuals themselves have huge deductibles. The Liar-In-Chief promised that people could keep their plans if they liked them. She had a very good plan, that she liked. She can't keep it, or her doctors. Obama's a disputable lying liar.

Your comment certainly is disputable. But I don't think that's the word you meant.

You know what a lying liar is btw, that's an honest person. ha ha

[waldo]

She had a very good plan, that she liked. She can't keep it, or her doctors. Obama's a disputable lying liar.

no - again, that plan was "junk insurance". The reasons why were provided to you directly in the article and the quote extract. Let me reinforce a part of the article I didn't initially quote... an additional article extract that clearly speaks to the junk failings within her pre-OCare plan:

To put these two plans in perspective, let's imagine that Ms. Barrette's luck runs out and she receives a diagnosis of breast cancer that will cost $120,000 to treat.

Under her current junk plan, she would probably receive no more than a few hundred dollars of benefits for doctor visits and drugs. It wouldn't cover her surgery, her chemotherapy, her many expensive medications, or the repeated diagnostic tests she'd likely require. She would end up with probably $119,000 of unpaid medical bills. With the Humana plan, those bills top out at $6,300 a year, no matter what.

[waldo]

Obama's a disputable lying liar.

in your forever 'BreitbartBubble', you conveniently ignored my earlier post - here... the one that narrowed down the affected populace to ~5% of Americans. Granted, the graph was a bit unwieldy given it's size... however, there are a lot of these slicing & dicing type graphs/charts surfacing as your type of perpetuated nonsense is being confronted. Here's another one - enjoy! (this one speaks to an ~3% of Americans being affected; i.e., needing to buy something beyond their current "junk insurance" levels!

[waldo]

and yet... another blow to the "disputable lying liar" ShadyMeme!


Another Obamacare horror story debunked

Deborah Cavallaro is a hard-working real estate agent in the Westchester suburb of Los Angeles who has been featured prominently on a round of news shows lately, talking about how badly Obamacare is going to cost her when her existing plan gets canceled and she has to find a replacement.

The bottom line is that Cavallaro's assertion that "there's nothing affordable about the Affordable Care Act," as she put it Tuesday on NBC Channel 4, is the product of her own misunderstandings, abetted by a passel of uninformed and incurious news reporters.

Her current plan, from Anthem Blue Cross, is a catastrophic coverage plan for which she pays $293 a month as an individual policyholder. It requires her to pay a deductible of $5,000 a year and limits her out-of-pocket costs to $8,500 a year. Her plan also limits her to two doctor visits a year, for which she shoulders a copay of $40 each. After that, she pays the whole cost of subsequent visits.

This fits the very definition of a nonconforming plan under Obamacare. The deductible and out-of-pocket maximums are too high, the provisions for doctor visits too skimpy.

As for a replacement plan, she says she was quoted $478 a month by her insurance broker, but that's a lot more than she'll really be paying. Cavallaro told me she hasn't checked the website of Covered California, the state's health plan exchange, herself. I did so while we talked.

Here's what I found. I won't divulge her current income, which is personal, but this year it qualifies her for a hefty federal premium subsidy.

At her age, she's eligible for a good "silver" plan for $333 a month after the subsidy -- $40 a month more than she's paying now. But the plan is much better than her current plan -- the deductible is $2,000, not $5,000. The maximum out-of-pocket expense is $6,350, not $8,500. Her co-pays would be $45 for a primary care visit and $65 for a specialty visit -- but all visits would be covered, not just two.

Is that better than her current plan? Yes, by a mile.

If she wanted to pay less, Cavallaro could opt for lesser coverage in a "bronze" plan. She could buy one from the California exchange for as little as $194 a month. From Anthem, it's $256, or $444 a year less than she's paying now. That buys her a $5,000 deductible (the same as she's paying today) but the out-of-pocket limit is lower, $6,350. Office visits would be $60 for primary care and $70 for specialties, but again with no limit on the number of visits. Factor in the premium savings, and it's hard to deny that she's still ahead.

The sad truth is that Cavallaro has been very poorly served by the health insurance industry and the news media. It seems that Anthem didn't adequately explain her options for 2014 when it disclosed that her current plan is being canceled. If her insurance brokers told her what she says they did, they failed her. And the reporters who interviewed her without getting all the facts produced inexcusably shoddy work -- from Maria Bartiromo on down. They not only did her a disservice, but failed the rest of us too.

[Spiderfish]

Your comment certainly is disputable.

Not really, at least when it comes to his point on deductibles...

So, using tools available through eHealthinsurance.com (I'll walk you through this useful resource tomorrow), I determined that she qualifies for a premium subsidy of $320 a month. She can use that to purchase a Humana Direct Silver 4600/6300 plan for $165 a month.

If you read the next line in the article that wasn't included from the original quote...

It's not the most generous plan in the world. The deductible is $4,600 and the only things the plan pays for outside the deductible are preventive services, the first $500 of diagnostic lab tests and x-rays in the year, and "diagnostic" office visits, meaning going to the doctor because you're feeling awful and need to know what's wrong. Visits for treatment are subject to the deductible. There's a separate $1,500 deductible for prescription drugs, after which there's a copay of $10 for generics and $50 for brand-name drugs.

Edited November 5, 2013 by Spiderfish