Guest Peeves Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 ok. Then you dont refute they are not treated equally as the courts themselves have said. Good. usually such a charge includes proof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 How many settlements have been built or expanded, forcing Palestinians off their land? How is that any more acceptable? How many? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 How many settlements have been built or expanded, forcing Palestinians off their land? How is that any more acceptable? See Canada, USA, and other nations in the Americas. It is quite acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 No. Israel would like to keep evicting people and occupying their land without the hassle of people fighting back.... The Arabs should have thought of that in 1967 when they blockaded the Straits of Tiran. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Who says these Jewish settlers can't be hard working citizens in a future West Bank state? the settlers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 the settlers. Do they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Who says these Jewish settlers can't be hard working citizens in a future West Bank state? They're looking for fighters as the citizens. Definitely not workers who can accomplish anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 They're looking for fighters as the citizens. Definitely not workers who can accomplish anything. I tend to agree that the world is OK with Arabs driving Jews from various areas. Not so much the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 How many settlements have been built or expanded, forcing Palestinians off their land? How is that any more acceptable? So you think Israeli building settlements on land once perhaps illegally claimed by Jordan is equally destructive to the firing of thousands of missiles at Israel civiians to kill them, man,women,children? http://www.commentarymagazine.com/article/the-illegal-settlements-myth/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 So you think Israeli building settlements on land once perhaps illegally claimed by Jordan is equally destructive to the firing of thousands of missiles at Israel civiians to kill them, man,women,children? http://www.commentar...ttlements-myth/ Jordan 'liberated' that part of the former British Mandate. They only gave-up claim in 1988 when the PLO was ready to assume control of this area taken by force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 The commission's report was highly controversial on all sides, both gravely disappointing the families of the victims and angering those who blamed Arab citizens for the unrest of October 2000. Arab advocacy organizations such as Adalah,[5] the Arab Association for Human Rights, and Mossawa argued that the report exonerated Jewish Israeli political figures who played a central role in mishandling the crisis around October 2000, and gave slap-on-the-wrist treatment to those who fired the shots, while severely censuring Arab political figures for incendiary speech. Some commentators believed this amounted to virtual circumvention of due process for Arab citizens.[6] At the same time, the Or Commission's statements were perhaps the first public official acknowledgment of discrimination faced by the Arab citizenry of Israel; Adalah and Mossawa commended the Or Commission for this admission. One year after the release of the commission report, Theodore Or publicly attacked the government for failing to implement its recommendations.[7] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 [/sup] That was about ONE incident, not the daily life of Israeli citizens. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Or_Commission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 That was about ONE incident, not the daily life of Israeli citizens. http://en.wikipedia....i/Or_Commission Im guessing then that english is not your first language?The bold words indicate more than one incident. But thats ok, I do not expect anything less than blind adherence to the script. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuckistani Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 So you think Israeli building settlements on land once perhaps illegally claimed by Jordan is equally destructive to the firing of thousands of missiles at Israel civiians to kill them, man,women,children? http://www.commentar...ttlements-myth/ Yes. It's aggression either way. Taking land is about as aggressive an act as it gets. If the US was doing it to us, we'd likely behave just as the Palestinians do, except for the ululating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Yes. It's aggression either way. Taking land is about as aggressive an act as it gets. If the US was doing it to us, we'd likely behave just as the Palestinians do, except for the ululating. Yet is continues for First Nations in Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuckistani Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) Yet is continues for First Nations in Canada. It does? I thought we were busy settling land claims. Giving FN's a say in resource development in their traditional territories. Huge transfers of federal money. Don't see that so much in Israel/Palestine. Edited November 21, 2012 by Canuckistani Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Hamas is neither moral, ethical nor civilised. Just from the title of the OP, I don't have to read too far into this topic to determine that it is just another baiting thread designed to dehumanize an enemy and justify any and everything done against them.....like this for instance: "Flatten all of Gaza. The Americans didn't stop with Hiroshima – the Japanese weren't surrendering fast enough, so they hit Nagasaki, too," he wrote in the Jerusalem Post. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/9688134/Ariel-Sharons-son-Gilad-calls-on-Israel-to-flatten-Gaza.html that's from Ariel Sharon's son to western media a couple of days ago. Many years ago, during the reign of Menachem Begin, when it started becoming obvious that increased settlements on the West Bank meant that Israel would never withdraw, even under a Labour Government, a prominent Israeli journalist at the time....who's name I can no longer recall, said he feared that his country was becoming exactly what they hated most, and eventually there would be a genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from the territories that Israel covets. The first step along that way is to dehumanize the enemy. Turn them into gooks and savages who have no human qualities, so killing them is not the same as killing "real" people. I think the Nazis had a thing or two to say on the subject many years ago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Do they? It's a safe bet. The settlers are a pox on the Israeli body politic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 It's a safe bet. The settlers are a pox on the Israeli body politic. I see no problem with fixing their little red wagon's by making them citizens of the new state. That should be punishment enough. After enough of them are murdered by terrorists, I'm sure they'll leave. Or at least think about leaving. Until then, you should let them be least you become the monster you so valiantly fight against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 It does? I thought we were busy settling land claims. Giving FN's a say in resource development in their traditional territories. Huge transfers of federal money. Don't see that so much in Israel/Palestine. Not so "busy"....it has been decades. Israel has also given aid to Palestinians. Doesn't settle the underlying issues. "Giving them a say" ? How nice of the Crown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Many years ago, during the reign of Menachem Begin, when it started becoming obvious that increased settlements on the West Bank meant that Israel would never withdraw, even under a Labour Government, a prominent Israeli journalist at the time....who's name I can no longer recall, said he feared that his country was becoming exactly what they hated most, and eventually there would be a genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from the territories that Israel covets.Perhaps the Arabs should have thought about that before provoking the 1967 War by getting ready to invade from Egypt, Syria and Jordan. And of course the previous adventure in 1948. And again from Egypt and Syria in 1973. The first step along that way is to dehumanize the enemy. Turn them into gooks and savages who have no human qualities, so killing them is not the same as killing "real" people. I think the Nazis had a thing or two to say on the subject many years ago! I think they are dehumanizing themselves. The 1972 Olympic Massacre. Kiryot Schmoneh (sp). September 11. Missile attacks on civilian areas. The list goes on and on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) DP Edited November 21, 2012 by Peeves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) " prominent Israeli journalist at the time....who's name I can no longer recall, said he feared that his country was becoming exactly what they hated most, and eventually there would be a genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from the territories that Israel covets.' That 'recall' is so totally ridiculous as to be pure propaganda. Sounds like something Cooky Carter would say. Israel has done nothing violent to Arabs beyond responding to attack. I suspect The Arabs in the WEST BANK are better off than their counterparts in Gaza. You would no that if you kept up with the news from Gaza. http://www.jewishfed....aspx?id=105003 Myth and Fact: The Standard of Living for Palestinians Mitchell G. Bard Jewish Virtual Library Myth “Palestinians living under ‘occupation’ have the lowest standard of living in the Middle East.” Fact When Israel captured the West Bank and Gaza Strip in 1967, officials took measures to improve the conditions that Palestinians had lived under during Jordan’s 19-year occupation of the West Bank, and Egypt’s occupation of Gaza. Universities were opened, Israeli agricultural innovations were shared, modern conveniences were introduced, and health care was significantly upgraded. More than 100,000 Palestinians were employed in Israel, and were paid the same wages as Israeli workers, which stimulated economic growth. The rise in violence during the 1990s, and then the war instigated by Palestinian terrorists beginning in 2000, has taken a heavy toll on the Palestinian economy. To protect its citizens from suicide bombers and other terrorists, Israel was forced to take measures that had a deleterious impact on the economy in the Palestinian Authority. The most serious step was to limit the number of Palestinian workers entering Israel to reduce the risk of terrorists pretending to be workers slipping into the country. This raised the level of unemployment, which, in turn, had a negative spillover effect on the rest of the Palestinian economy. Despite the collapse of the PA economy from the last five years of war, Palestinian Arabs are still better off than many of their neighbors. The most recent Human Development Report from the United Nations ranks the PA 102nd in terms of life expectancy, educational attainment and adjusted real income out of the 177 countries and territories in the world, placing it in the “medium human development” category along with most of the other Middle Eastern states (only the Gulf sheikdoms are ranked “high”). The PA is ranked just 12 places below Jordan and one behind Iran; it is rated ahead of Syria (#105), Algeria (#108), Egypt (#120), and Morocco (#125) (“Human Development Report 2004,” United Nations Development Programme, 2005). Few Palestinians would trade places with Arabs in neighboring countries. Well, perhaps, with one exception. They might aspire to the standard of living in the country ranked 22nd by the UN – Israel. Edited November 21, 2012 by Peeves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 Israel has done nothing violent to Arabs beyond... This is exactly why I normally do not post in these threads. One reason is I dont feel I know enough, and secondly what I do know is countered by many with an agenda against the truth and thirdly anyone not agreeing is castigated to the Pro Pal camp and is a jew hater. But Its so nice to know that any evidence otherwise, any other knowledge inlcuding firsthand knowledge refuting the above captioned phrase is simply waved off by you . Of course it only means you have an agenda and want no truth , just what you can push as the truth. Talk to any sane Israeli soldier who has worked the borders. If he is as honest as the ones I know, they'll tell you that you are full of shit. They harass the arab mothers, beat some of the petulant border crossers, make them wait in the cold rain even tho they see them, 4 times a day, just because they can. I am not against Israel finding peace through means of violence. It will probably take that to do so. The arabs , Hamas et al are nothing I would ever want to nor would support. But to say that Israel is never at fault is a load of hogwash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted November 21, 2012 Report Share Posted November 21, 2012 This is pretty serious business, and it affects a lot of people's lives - as we sit here posting about it. I would hope that we don't see it as "entertainment." What a horrible mindset. I wasn't serious when I said that, hence the "LOL". As for it being none of our business, do you truly believe that? - what goes on in the world, the atrocities, are "none of our business?" With an attitude like that, progress would be all but impossible. Often times it's the outside world's involvement/opinion that turns things around. I specifically said "Who ends up with what" is none of my business, it's up to the Israelis and Palestinians/Arabs to figure that out in a hopeful peace deal that will hopefully occur sometime in the next millenium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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