cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Stop telling me what to do. I'll "argue" any point I see fit. You seem to be under the impression that you police this board. Newsflash. You don't. I'll tell you your arguments are crap, when your arguments are crap. Deal with it. Quote
The_Squid Posted November 12, 2012 Author Report Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) That's just it - you don't have a clue. Many people of the same faith don't share all beliefs of said faith. For example, not all Methodists believe in Hell; one can't assume that anyone who is a Methodist believes in Hell and ascribe that belief to him/her. As for what Romney believes, it doesn't matter what his personal beliefs are - it has nothing to do with the office he was seeking. My point is that if people knew Romney believed in the planet Kolob (assuming he does) and that he wears special underwear, etc. that he would have lost votes. I think that these beliefs are far enough outside the mainstream (in most places) that this would have harmed his election chances. I'm sure Utah would have still voted for him. Others will disagree I am sure.... What do you think about that hypothesis? Edited November 12, 2012 by The_Squid Quote
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 My point is that if people knew Romney believed in the planet Kolob (assuming he does) and that he wears special underwear, etc. that he would have lost votes. I think that these beliefs are far enough outside the mainstream (in most places) that this would have harmed his election chances. I'm sure Utah would have still voted for him. Others will disagree I am sure.... Strangely, it would appear you were remiss for even bringing it up; just as cybercoma was wrong for the unique sin of telling a poster her argument is not good. Bad Squid and Cybercoma; bad! Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Her argument is not good because it's like saying we can't know that a Cardinal in the Catholic Church believes Christ is the saviour. It's a stupid argument because being a Cardinal in the Catholic Church is a profession of those beliefs, just as being a Bishop in the LDS Church is a profession of believing in that faith's tenets. She's doing what she usually does, arguing for no other reason than to argue, and now she's going to throw a tantrum because I pointed out why her argument makes absolutely no sense. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Strangely, it would appear you were remiss for even bringing it up; just as cybercoma was wrong for the unique sin of telling a poster her argument is not good. And maybe some of us are tired of his personal attacks, regardless of what others post, in an effort to silence contrary views. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 (edited) And maybe some of us are tired of his personal attacks, regardless of what others post, in an effort to silence contrary views. Personal attacks? Like you calling me a Queen? I said her argument is garbage and pointed out exactly why. I'm playing the argument not the person, unlike your post above. And take a look at what you're saying. I'm not silencing contrary views. I'm shooting down an argument that attempts to silence discussion. Saying we can't possibly know what anyone believes, even when they're a Bishop in the LDS Church, is an attempt to shut down any conversation about Romney's beliefs. It's AW that's trying to shut down discussion with her absurd position of radical doubt. Edited November 12, 2012 by cybercoma Quote
Shady Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Wow. Even after the election is over, Romney Derangement Syndrome carries on. Whatever gets you through your day I guess. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 My point is that if people knew Romney believed in the planet Kolob (assuming he does) and that he wears special underwear, etc. that he would have lost votes. I think that these beliefs are far enough outside the mainstream (in most places) that this would have harmed his election chances. I'm sure Utah would have still voted for him.Others will disagree I am sure.... What do you think about that hypothesis? Anyone who cares about a candidate's political beliefs to that extent knows what the mainstream Mormon beliefs are and would be pressing for answers. Did his religion cost him votes? Many people still think that Obama is a Muslim. Did that cost him votes? I think it likely was a wash. But again, if people cared that much about Romney's beliefs, it would have been an issue. people would have made it an issue. Who cares what kind of underwear he wears? I don't know if Obama wears boxers or briefs, and I can't think of one reason why I should know. So I think most Americans really don't care that much about a president's personal religious beliefs as long as it's not being brought into the campaign - ie: isn't anything that policy will be based on. Quote
Shady Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 And maybe some of us are tired of his personal attacks, regardless of what others post, in an effort to silence contrary views. I totally agree. His personal attacks are getting out of control. Somebody needs to do something about it soon. I'm not sure who he thinks made him the post sheriff. Quote
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 And maybe some of us are tired of his personal attacks, regardless of what others post, in an effort to silence contrary views. He is making no more effort to "silence [anyone's] views" than your disagreements with posters' points and styles of rhetoric are an effort to do so. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
eyeball Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 I'm betting that ridiculing Romney's belief system would inspire as many people to vote for him as not. When push comes to shove between theists and atheists birds of a feather no matter how strange a bedfellow will flock together. The shared sense that they have a right to the belief's that have them runs strong. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 I totally agree. His personal attacks are getting out of control. Somebody needs to do something about it soon. I'm not sure who he thinks made him the post sheriff. As I'm criticizing AW's argument, you and bush_cheney continue to discuss me personally as a poster. Who's making it personal? Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 He is making no more effort to "silence [anyone's] views" than your disagreements with posters' points and styles of rhetoric are an effort to do so. Yes he is....he purposely belittles other posters like this: Maybe you're not even posting, but a script written by someone to just contradict everything people say, regardless of what they say. We get to say whatever we want within forum rules, not to be shouted down by the usual members who don't like it. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 I totally agree. His personal attacks are getting out of control. He made no personal attacks...but received at least one in resposne. As you no doubt well know. Somebody needs to do something about it soon. Cybercoma Derangement Syndrome. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 As I'm criticizing AW's argument, you and bush_cheney continue to discuss me personally as a poster. Who's making it personal? If you don't like it, stop doing it yourself. This is not your forum. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Guest American Woman Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 And maybe some of us are tired of his personal attacks, regardless of what others post, in an effort to silence contrary views. Amen to that. I, for one, am tired of his condescending demands to not post this or that - even to the point where he purports to speak of what Greg does or doesn't want posted/discussed. Quote
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Yes he is....he purposely belittles other posters If there's anyone not in a position to criticize this style of debate...... Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 I've never spoken for Greg. Give me a break. I think the posts in this thread speak for themselves. People can read through them and I'm sure they will see exactly what I did: criticize an argument that was silly and offered nothing to the conversation, other than a poor attempt to shut it down. When that failed, you all decided to derail the argument by discussing ME personally, rather than any argument that is being made. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 He is making no more effort to "silence [anyone's] views" than your disagreements with posters' points and styles of rhetoric are an effort to do so. Oh, really. So telling me to "stop arguing for argument's sake" - when that wasn't even what I was doing - isn't an attempt to silence me? What do you think telling someone to stop doing something means? I'll make any point I think is relevant, regardless of what Cybercoma thinks about it - and his telling me to "stop" making a point because he thinks it's "crap" IS making it personal. Quote
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 Oh, really. So telling me to "stop arguing for argument's sake" - when that wasn't even what I was doing - isn't an attempt to silence me? ???? Of course not. you're oversensitive. What do you think telling someone to stop doing something means? I don't think you understand the connotations of "attempt to silence me" and "efforts to silence me." I'll make any point I think is relevant, regardless of what Cybercoma thinks about it - and his telling me to "stop" making a point because he thinks it's "crap" IS making it personal. No. It is not. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 But you are arguing for the sake of arguing. You don't have an intelligent point to make. Your entire argument in this thread has been that we can't know what Romney's religious beliefs are, although he's a Bishop in the LDS Church. That's like saying we can't know that a Roman Catholic Bishop believes in the ideas of the Roman Catholic Church. It's a ridiculous argument that you can only be making for the sake of being argumentative. There is no rational person that would look at a bishop in a Church and argue that you can't possibly know what their religious beliefs are. Quote
bleeding heart Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 When that failed, you all decided to derail the argument by discussing ME personally, rather than any argument that is being made. "The Queen" is guilty of personal attacks now.......how interesting. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
cybercoma Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 "The Queen" is guilty of personal attacks now.......how interesting. Yeah. Call me a Queen, then accuse me of making personal attacks. How ridiculous. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 I've never spoken for Greg. Give me a break. I think these are the kinds of conversations Greg would rather see in the chatroom, but fill your boots guys. I think the posts in this thread speak for themselves. People can read through them and I'm sure they will see exactly what I did: criticize an argument that was silly and offered nothing to the conversation,other than a poor attempt to shut it down. That's not for you to decide. As it stands, The Squid and I are having an interesting discussion. That it's not interesting to you matters not at all. That you don't see it as relevant matters not at all. The point I brought up is a VALID point. That you think otherwise matters not at all. Again. Back off. I'll make any point I want to make. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted November 12, 2012 Report Posted November 12, 2012 But you are arguing for the sake of arguing. You don't have an intelligent point to make. Again. THAT'S NOT FOR YOU TO DECIDE. You don't get to determine if my point is "intelligent" or not. Quote
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