"the english are waking up!"

[Benz]

I can understand un petit peux.

Merci beaucoup.

Ok thanks, I guess some people are overreacting, eh?

The subject is enough serious to be debated. Someone is dead, another wounded and a terrorist action has been avoided. Maybe it's time for the english canada to stop beleiving the flamers about Quebec.

I don't want to get sovereignity because of the rise of radicalism in TROC. What ever happen to this country, the people never shall forget to keep respecting each others. I hate those flamers, whereever the side they are.

[TheNewTeddy]

The problem with Quebec Sovereignty is the way the Federal Government reacts to it.

[Smallc]

I do understand the constitution, you don't.

[Signals.Cpl]

Surely it goes hand and hand with these guys:

Ahh the MPQ....Defending the virtues of Québécois with toy guns....That about sums up the whole debate.....

I wonder how long they would last against the Cadets...

[CANADIEN]

The English-speaking communtiy in Quebec have more education rights than. let's say, the French-speaking community in Ontario. Or so we hear. Too "bad" it is not quite true.

Under section 23(1) of the Charter, any citizen whose first language learned and still understood is either Enlgish (if living in Quebec) or French (if living outside Quebec) has a right to have his/her children educated in the monority lnaguage of his/her province. That is, a man coming from let's say, Madagascar to Toronto, who becomes a citizen and has children can send them to a French school. And a woman coming from let,s say, Boston to Montreal, who becomes a citizen and has children can send them to an English school.

oops, I mispoke, Quebec is exempt of the application of that rule (article 59 of the Charter) and has its own rule saying she can't. Clearly, Anglophones in Montreal has, in this regard, less rights than Francophones in Toronto.

Well... there's the business of section 23 (3), that states theat there is a right to an education in the minority language anywhere the numbers warrant it. But, this clause, which also applies to Québec btw, is not some sort of weasel statement government can use to prevent education in the minority language as much as possible. On the contrary, courts have made it clear that government had an obligation to provide education in the minority language whenever it was demonstrated there were enough children. Rarely, if ever, have parents claiming that their provincial government was denying them that right lost in court.

[Rocky Road]

The subject is enough serious to be debated. Someone is dead, another wounded and a terrorist action has been avoided. Maybe it's time for the english canada to stop beleiving the flamers about Quebec.

I don't want to get sovereignity because of the rise of radicalism in TROC. What ever happen to this country, the people never shall forget to keep respecting each others. I hate those flamers, whereever the side they are.

Terrorism is ugly.

And I agree respect is key.

Bonne nuit.

Another day has come and gone.

We all retire to our little piece of peace, called home.

The birds hide away, the stars shimmer with the zeal of unknowable mystery.

Men scramble in distant cities, while sleep hushes the breath until morning.

Dreams of impossible worlds, forgotten friends, and honest ambitions.

In this day and age, we have come so far,

Yet we are cemented to the basic premise of good and evil. So where are we really?

In a universe of seemingly infinite hostile worlds, all unrelated to this microcosm

Called life on Earth.

[Benz]

That is, a man coming from let's say, Madagascar to Toronto, who becomes a citizen and has children can send them to a French school. And a woman coming from let,s say, Boston to Montreal, who becomes a citizen and has children can send them to an English school.

oops, I mispoke, Quebec is exempt of the application of that rule (article 59 of the Charter) and has its own rule saying she can't. Clearly, Anglophones in Montreal has, in this regard, less rights than Francophones in Toronto.

You are not talking about a french canadian or english canadian. you are talking about a foreigner that is coming into Canada and become permanent resident or newly citizen. I explained why it works like this with new comers. Care to answer this time or you will just monologue again? Do I need to repeat again?

But, this clause, which also applies to Québec btw, is not some sort of weasel statement government can use to prevent education in the minority language as much as possible. On the contrary, courts have made it clear that government had an obligation to provide education in the minority language whenever it was demonstrated there were enough children. Rarely, if ever, have parents claiming that their provincial government was denying them that right lost in court.

Oh they win. And when the provincal government does not comply, to go back to the court again. With injonctions and so on. Over and over, again and again... this is Canada. You have to fight over and over, up to the supreme court, just to have education in your language, even if your language is among the only two official ones.

There is a place in Nova Scotia where they were suppose to build french schools in 1994. In 1998, the government didn't do it, pretending they don't have the money. In 2000, the judge Arthur LeBlanc decided that the province wasted enough time and ordered the government to build the schools. What the province did? Those muther.... appealed and won at the provincial Appeal court. In 2003, the Supreme Court of Canada was in favor of the french again. I don't have information if the schools are built now. The regions concerned are Chéticamp, Annapolis (Kingston/Greenwood), île Madame, Argyle et Clare.

We are talking about canadians, living in the province for generations and not able to get schools in their language. We are not talking about foreigners that want me to pay their education in english in the only one non-english state of north america.

When the english language won't be a threat to the french, we will reconsider the question.

[g_bambino]

The constitution that we did not sign, allows the federal to put his nose in domains it should not.

The parts of the constitution that set out the federal and provincial governments' areas of responsibility are in the Constitution Act 1867, which was "signed" by Lower Canada representatives in 1867 and which remained unaltered through the process of patriation. The federal government thus cannot force a provincial government to do anything on a matter that is constitutionally within the provinces' purvue. RESPs are optional; they are forced on noone. So, please provide an exmaple of so-called forced federal intrusion in provincial affairs. Otherwise, your complaints continue to be based on myth.

[TheNewTeddy]

You are not talking about a french canadian or english canadian. you are talking about a foreigner that is coming into Canada and become permanent resident or newly citizen. I explained why it works like this with new comers. Care to answer this time or you will just monologue again? Do I need to repeat again?

Oh they win. And when the provincal government does not comply, to go back to the court again. With injonctions and so on. Over and over, again and again... this is Canada. You have to fight over and over, up to the supreme court, just to have education in your language, even if your language is among the only two official ones.

There is a place in Nova Scotia where they were suppose to build french schools in 1994. In 1998, the government didn't do it, pretending they don't have the money. In 2000, the judge Arthur LeBlanc decided that the province wasted enough time and ordered the government to build the schools. What the province did? Those muther.... appealed and won at the provincial Appeal court. In 2003, the Supreme Court of Canada was in favor of the french again. I don't have information if the schools are built now. The regions concerned are Chéticamp, Annapolis (Kingston/Greenwood), île Madame, Argyle et Clare.

We are talking about canadians, living in the province for generations and not able to get schools in their language. We are not talking about foreigners that want me to pay their education in english in the only one non-english state of north america.

When the english language won't be a threat to the french, we will reconsider the question.

I'm going to compiling evidence for a new post explaining how the French language and NAZI ideology have something in common.

...well okay that's a very loose description of what it will be about, but I think the "hook" has been made.

[CANADIEN]

I'm going to compiling evidence for a new post explaining how the French language and NAZI ideology have something in common.

...well okay that's a very loose description of what it will be about, but I think the "hook" has been made.

Ever heard of Howard Galganov? That's the former radio personnslity who comprared Quebec to Nazi Germany... and still has his ears ringing from the response he got from Jewish organizations. They felt he was insulting the memory of the victims of the Holocaust. I agree with them 100%.

[Benz]

I'm going to compiling evidence for a new post explaining how the French language and NAZI ideology have something in common.

...well okay that's a very loose description of what it will be about, but I think the "hook" has been made.

You have no idea how much you are painting yourself in the corner.

Saying that in the same topic regarding this anglos shooting at people, attempting to Marois' life and killed an innocent. It's very difficult to do worse than that.

[PIK]

One thing is for sure, the english are waking up.

[Benz]

The parts of the constitution that set out the federal and provincial governments' areas of responsibility are in the Constitution Act 1867, which was "signed" by Lower Canada representatives in 1867 and which remained unaltered through the process of patriation. The federal government thus cannot force a provincial government to do anything on a matter that is constitutionally within the provinces' purvue. RESPs are optional; they are forced on noone. So, please provide an exmaple of so-called forced federal intrusion in provincial affairs. Otherwise, your complaints continue to be based on myth.

ah bambino! Do I know you or not! lolll

...

I know what will be your next question. A clueless guy like you will ask me again, over and over because you have the memory of a red fish, what programs are you talking about?

So I give you one. Education. Remember the millenium sponsorship? Or the actual REEE Régime Enregistré Épargne Étude! This is intrusion.

In english it's Registered Education Savings Plans.

It's a federal program regarding education. The federal shall not touch education, even in the funding. The moeny must go to the provinces. Neverthenless, it looks good at first sight. Encourages you to save for your children. I do use it because it brings me a great advantage.

But here goes again another difference between our culture and yours. We don't like that kind of program. It's not necessarly a bad one, it's just not what kind of funding we want to do. Because, it gives a huge advantage to those who have enough money to save in first place. But those who can't save, they pay taxes like me. So it means the federal government takes money into their pockets to give it back to the people who are already capable to save. It's a system of favoritism.

In your culture, it makes sense because for you, the only thing that matter, is to put in place a system that gives an advantage to those who saves. In my culture, we rather see this as an unfair thing towards those who can't save.

We can still look at this from a total different point of view. That method is a good one to encourage people to save. If you can save but you don't you are penalised. Without such system, those who can save and don't, maybe they are wasting the money in something they shouldn't. It's never black or white. In the balance, your culture prefer that, mine prefer investing the money directly into the schools. It's not a matter of one is good, one is bad. According to our culture, we have different preferences.

Now back to the federal intrusion. Every province that wants such system, should have their own. If they want to share the mutualisation of the pooling, they can do so. But it should not be a federal program. If it is, then we should have the right to opt out and still get our share.

[g_bambino]

Do I know you or not!

You don't know the constitution, evidently.

It's a federal program regarding education. The federal shall not touch education, even in the funding.

It's quite a leap of logic to say a plan for individuals to voluntarily save to pay for their own private post-secondary education is equivalent to the federal government telling a provincial government how to run its education system. There's nothing to stop a provincial government from constructing the same scheme.

I do use it because it brings me a great advantage... We don't like that kind of program.

[TheNewTeddy]

You have no idea how much you are painting yourself in the corner.

Saying that in the same topic regarding this anglos shooting at people, attempting to Marois' life and killed an innocent. It's very difficult to do worse than that.

I hope you'll read my thread then

My accusation is not a light one, and I need many links and facts to back it up - I'm still gathering these.

[CANADIEN]

You don't know the constitution, evidently.

It's quite a leap of logic to say a plan for individuals to voluntarily save to pay for their own private post-secondary education is equivalent to the federal government telling a provincial government how to run its education system. There's nothing to stop a provincial government from constructing the same scheme.

A tax shelter is not an education program.

[Canada_james]

We MUST stop Quebecs extortion of Canada. They receive more than 50% of all transfer payments from hard working, fiscally responsible Canadians. This must stop. Why should other Canadians go without just so Quebecois could have more. Stand up against extortion Mr Harper. I created a group for us to get as many likes and members as possible so we can put an end to this. http://www.facebook.com/FedUpWithQuebec

Please join and share..thanks

James

[Peter F]

And New France was a French Colony thus they were French Nationals, Protected By French Regular Army Soldiers, Led by French Regular Army Officers supplying militiamen to the defence of the FRENCH Colony. If the British had decided to get rid of them they could have handed them off to France during the Negotiations or send them to every corner of the Empire. Good luck keeping your culture alive if all 70,000 people of Quebec were send in small groups to Australia, Africa, South America, Australia and the 13 Colonies. They were French subjects, just because some of them happened to be born in Quebec means nothing.

Bullshit. Canadiens were the only people living in Canada. Without them guess what Britain had? bugger all. And thats why they had to keep them happy for so long - they were the only ones here. Shipping them all off somewhere would have been a pointless destructive exercise of folly.

And thats why they didnt do it. Hell, the french militia kept the english in check for years and years and it took a major effort by fleet and 3 seperate armies to bring them down.

Shipping them all off could very well have resulted in armed resistance that would require another mass invasion by british armies. So there is a very good reason why they didnt disperse the population: The British needed them and they needed them peacefull.

[Signals.Cpl]

Bullshit. Canadiens were the only people living in Canada. Without them guess what Britain had? bugger all. And thats why they had to keep them happy for so long - they were the only ones here. Shipping them all off somewhere would have been a pointless destructive exercise of folly.

And thats why they didnt do it. Hell, the french militia kept the english in check for years and years and it took a major effort by fleet and 3 seperate armies to bring them down.

Shipping them all off could very well have resulted in armed resistance that would require another mass invasion by british armies. So there is a very good reason why they didnt disperse the population: The British needed them and they needed them peacefull.

Living in Canada?I didn't know Canada existed in 1760... what history books are you basing your bullshit off of? They had the 13 colonies which by the way were British colonies until 15 years later, if they had wanted to the British could have shipped of the French two the four corners of the Empire... French militia? Try again kiddo, if it was not for the French Regulars Quebec would have been in English hands 10 times over the previous 60 years, the French militia like the militia of the colonies in the south was meant to support the Regulars rather than to conduct a war on its own as was proven. You are bring to blow your own horn when it comes to this as the British were already in Montreal and Quebec city in 1763 when peace was signed and if they chose to they could have removed the French Settlers with little problem as they controlled the organized forces, and the colonies to the south which were with much larger populations were itching to do away with Quebec and its French population. Quebec exists due to the mercy that Britain showed them in 1760-1763 and as much as you want to deny it that is the truth.

[jbg]

I hope you'll read my thread then

My accusation is not a light one, and I need many links and facts to back it up - I'm still gathering these.

You have no idea how much you are painting yourself in the corner.

Saying that in the same topic regarding this anglos shooting at people, attempting to Marois' life and killed an innocent. It's very difficult to do worse than that.

Any poster on this Board knows how strongly pro-Anglophone I am. And I have often expressed my views on the fact that many French, in France, were disturbingly neutral towards Nazism. Apparently there was some of that in Quebec. Even Trudeau rode with Nazi motorcycle gangs (source, Son of Quebec, Father of Canada).

That being said, in democracies, shooting and murder are not how one expresses their views. There is nothing as low as murdering a person for expressing their views. O.K., if I had a chance I would have killed Hitler but I digress.

Democracy is about talk, debate, voting, and occasionally non-violent civil disobedience. I am constrained to express rare agreement Benz here. Even if the killer had gotten Marois the killing would have been murder; sinful, and unjustifiable.

[Benz]

A tax shelter is not an education program.

It's related. No one but your children can use the money if they are studying. The money is taken from the same place. It unbalances the chances for the kids.

It's quite a leap of logic to say a plan for individuals to voluntarily save to pay for their own private post-secondary education is equivalent to the federal government telling a provincial government how to run its education system. There's nothing to stop a provincial government from constructing the same scheme.

You don't get a damn thing. It gives a great advantage for the students having parents with money at the expense of those who don't.

[Benz]

Living in Canada?I didn't know Canada existed in 1760...

New France's non official name was Canada. The people of New France called themselve Canadiens in the early times of the colony.

Even at the beginning of Canada in 1867, the anglos did not adopt that name right away. It's at the end of the 19th century that the former british colonialists finally called themselve canadian.

if they had wanted to the British could have shipped of the French two the four corners of the Empire...

Their plan was rather to use Québec against the 13th colonies. They gave the Ohio to Québec so it would be easier for the lords of England to colonize that place instead of leaving it to the colonies.

they could have removed the French Settlers with little problem as they controlled the organized forces

No. The british were not able to manage Pontiac. They had to ask the King of France to call for peace, even if it was not his concern anymore.

If the British wouldn't have raised the taxes so high and create a revolt in the USA, then and only then they could have kick the french out of Québec. after few years. From the moment the US revolution took place, the British needed the french big time.

I suggest you read REAL history books.

[Benz]

We MUST stop Quebecs extortion of Canada. They receive more than 50% of all transfer payments from hard working, fiscally responsible Canadians. This must stop. Why should other Canadians go without just so Quebecois could have more. Stand up against extortion Mr Harper. I created a group for us to get as many likes and members as possible so we can put an end to this. http://www.facebook.com/FedUpWithQuebec

Please join and share..thanks

James

I hope you'll read my thread then

My accusation is not a light one, and I need many links and facts to back it up - I'm still gathering these.

Of course I will keep an eye on what you do. Alot of my fellows don't beleive me when I mentionne about guys like you. "They can't be that bad!". Really? Look! lolll

[Benz]

Any poster on this Board knows how strongly pro-Anglophone I am. And I have often expressed my views on the fact that many French, in France, were disturbingly neutral towards Nazism.

Yeah the collabo as we called them. They had a really bad time once the war was over.

Apparently there was some of that in Quebec. Even Trudeau rode with Nazi motorcycle gangs (source, Son of Quebec, Father of Canada).

I hate that man for everything he was. It's not fair to describ him as a son of Québec while he disdained so much the Québec nation. He is the father of a nation building that doesn't exist.

That being said, in democracies, shooting and murder are not how one expresses their views. There is nothing as low as murdering a person for expressing their views. O.K., if I had a chance I would have killed Hitler but I digress.

Democracy is about talk, debate, voting, and occasionally non-violent civil disobedience. I am constrained to express rare agreement Benz here. Even if the killer had gotten Marois the killing would have been murder; sinful, and unjustifiable.

Thumbs up from a pro-french to a pro-anglo

We must never forget that above our cultural differences, we are all humans and equal to the face of mother nature (or god if it is your beleif). The politic is not above that.

[Rocky Road]

We must never forget that above our cultural differences, we are all humans and equal to the face of mother nature (or god if it is your beleif). The politic is not above that.

Well said.

Many blessings.