Deficit Continues to Shrink

The_Squid · July 28, 2012

Someone the NDP trusts, so probably the Taliban.

That's an assinine comment.

WWWTT · July 28, 2012

Well come on, you don't trust the department responsible just because the information just does not agree with your position, so it makes me wonder who would you trust? Any source as long as they support your argument?

Today Bruce Carson,former Harper adviser was charged with fraud!

And you say that the NDP would trust an extremist group because they are doing the job they were elected to do?

I'm ready for my close up Mr.De Mille

:rolleyes:

WWWTT · July 28, 2012

I hate to say it. But, Harper Derangement Syndrome.

No Shady,I'm sorry to say that it is you that has a bad case of "Harper history" (gingivitis)

WWWTT

Wild Bill · July 28, 2012

Set themselves up for that one???

What are you talking about?

It is the job of the "OFFICIAL OPPOSITION" to challenge and question the government.

That is why they were elected.

Maybe when you do not like the opposition then you think it is stupid of them that they are doing their job.

I guess you set yourself up for that one!

WWWTT

You're right, from an academic perspective, WWWTT. However, in the real world the NDP always seems to take a more extreme position than necessary. Layton earned his "Taliban Jack" sobriquet honestly.

As an example, if Canada had an issue with some NATO partners not pulling their weight in something like the Afghanistan mission, it would be reasonable of an Opposition to question if that was true or not. They might claim that the government was ecpecting too much, or had failed somehow in the diplomatic nice-ities and offended those partners.

The typical NDP response would be to immediately demand we pull out of NATO!

I think you might not have made an important adjustment, WWWTT. The NDP is not just the minor Opposition party any more. They are the PRIMARY one!

This means they are the government in waiting. As such, they should be far less dogmatic and much more down to earth if they expect to garner confidence from voters.

If you expect your party to continue to be the stiff-necked academics they traditionally have been in the past then you will condemn your party to failure! The image you want to project is one of Tony Blair, NOT Syd Ryan!

Do you remember the peasants in Monty Python's Holy Grail, crying political academic convoluted arguments at King Arthur, like those political leftwing windbags that preach in Picadilly Square? A LOT of voters hold that image of the NDP!

You guys would help not just your party but yourselves if you would just LIGHTEN UP!

WWWTT · July 28, 2012

That a boy Wild Bill!

This is the Wild Bill I know now!

Going off on a half witted endless rambling rant, giving meaningless advise and twisting around facts to suit your agenda!

Glad your back man.

Guess there's still no chance that you'll be voting NDP soon hey.No?Maybe?Well think about it anyways.

WWWTT

Signals.Cpl · July 28, 2012

Today Bruce Carson,former Harper adviser was charged with fraud!

And you say that the NDP would trust an extremist group because they are doing the job they were elected to do?

I'm ready for my close up Mr.De Mille

What were they elected to do? Twists the facts until they fit the NDP fantasy?

WWWTT · July 28, 2012

What were they elected to do? Twists the facts until they fit the NDP fantasy?

If you are asking me what the job of the official opposition is than I think you have a long road ahead of you my friend.

But that's ok because there are many here to help you out.

Just don't give up!

WWWTT

Wild Bill · July 28, 2012

That a boy Wild Bill!

This is the Wild Bill I know now!

Going off on a half witted endless rambling rant, giving meaningless advise and twisting around facts to suit your agenda!

Glad your back man.

Guess there's still no chance that you'll be voting NDP soon hey.No?Maybe?Well think about it anyways.

WWWTT

Soon? Not likely. Still, never say never!

For me, it all depends on just what the NDP does with itself over the next election or two.

I could never even consider voting for a Sid Ryan type. A Tony Blair style of leadership is a different story.

These are crucial times for the NDP. It will be fascinating to see just what they do.

Hopefully, they will not take criticism as personally as YOU do!

Edited July 28, 2012 by Wild Bill

Bonam · July 28, 2012

Great point. It's almost Orwellian of them. The opposition complains about a lack of stimulus spending. So they threaten an election. Harper meets them half way and initiates some stimulus. And then they complain about the deficit because of the stimulus spending they asked for. You gotta wonder about their sanity sometimes.

It's not a lack of sanity, it's just partisan politics. Whatever the government does, if you're the opposing party, you want to make it sound as bad as possible. Even if it's what you were asking them to do just a few days ago. Most politicians are guilty of such tactics (the other alternative being claiming undue credit).

Anyway, good news about the deficit.

gunrutz · July 28, 2012

Where did I say those things are the sole cause of deficit???

You have a link???

I guess since I did not say these things your only solution(since you only have one argument) is to add them into a response to my comment!?!?!

And if you think that spending on infrastructure stimulus was the sole cause of our deficit then you have a lot of research to do.

Good luck

WWWTT

Read what i wrote again, you can do it!

Edited July 28, 2012 by gunrutz

WWWTT · July 28, 2012

Read what i wrote again, you can do it!

Yep read it again and you go on a incoherent rant about what you feel was the sole cause of the deficit.

You want to keep ranting,then go ahead,this should be good!

Or maybe you want me to give credit to your ramblings?I don't think that's going to happen so keep writing with the caps on.

WWWTT

gunrutz · July 29, 2012

Yep read it again and you go on a incoherent rant about what you feel was the sole cause of the deficit.

You want to keep ranting,then go ahead,this should be good!

Or maybe you want me to give credit to your ramblings?I don't think that's going to happen so keep writing with the caps on.

WWWTT

Im sorry i don't have the inclination to accommodate your lack of comprehension, perhaps you re-read the whole thread, others have said exactly what i did in different way, maybe that will help you. Or maybe you are just a partisan troll who in reality cares not for truth or honesty, either way the internet is full of people like you and your two minutes are up. But just to give you a hint, think chicken and egg, don't hurt yourself with that one.

WWWTT · July 29, 2012

who in reality cares not for truth or honesty

:rolleyes:

WWWTT

Signals.Cpl · July 29, 2012

If you are asking me what the job of the official opposition is than I think you have a long road ahead of you my friend.

But that's ok because there are many here to help you out.

Just don't give up!

WWWTT

So you are saying that the official opposition is there to twist the facts in to support their fantasy? I'm sorry but I have higher expectation for the official opposition than that. Just to point out one thing, the official opposition needs to reside in reality rather than fantasy and if you don't realize that they need some serious help understanding the government and how it should work.

What happened was the Liberals, the BQ, and the NDP supported increasing the deficit, and once it worked they start blaming the government a minority government btw for creating the deficit and increasing the debt that they(Liberals, NDP and the BQ) helped create.

WWWTT · July 29, 2012

So you are saying that the official opposition is there to twist the facts in to support their fantasy? I'm sorry but I have higher expectation for the official opposition than that. Just to point out one thing, the official opposition needs to reside in reality rather than fantasy and if you don't realize that they need some serious help understanding the government and how it should work.

What happened was the Liberals, the BQ, and the NDP supported increasing the deficit, and once it worked they start blaming the government a minority government btw for creating the deficit and increasing the debt that they(Liberals, NDP and the BQ) helped create.

What happened.What happened?

This is what happened according to you!

You have completely neglected the fact that the conservatives cut the GST/HST.

You have completely neglected the fact that the conservatives increased military spending by over a wopping 50%!

You have completely neglected the fact that the conservatives cut corporate tax rates while corporations feed the super fat CEO's.

You have completely neglected the countless other useless spending binges the conservatives have been on.

You have completely fabricated what it was the opposition before the last election actually supported (increase stimulus spending on much needed infrastructure!)

And then you've got the nerve to tell me that I'm saying the opposition is twisting the facts to support a fantasy?!?!?!

And that the opposition does not understand how the government works?!?!?!

WWWTT

Moonlight Graham · July 30, 2012

so..... Harper Conservatives are on track, presumably, to attempt to fix their own created deficit problem, hey?

The CPC didn't create the worldwide recession, nor did they create Keynesian economics. The Liberals would have done virtually the same thing in regards to taking on a deficit to stimulate the economy.

cybercoma · July 30, 2012

The CPC didn't create the worldwide recession, nor did they create Keynesian economics. The Liberals would have done virtually the same thing in regards to taking on a deficit to stimulate the economy.

Would any other government been stupid enough to slash the government's fiscal capacity as they ramped up spending? Probably not. The Conservatives created the deficit problem when Canada was already being propped up by a strong commodities market. Now it's being waved around as though they should be commended for reducing something that should have never been in the first place.

It's pretty convenient that this comes out at the same time as former aid to Stephen Harper Bruce Carson is charged with fraud by the RCMP.

But the ends justify the means, eh boys? All of this criminality is ok because they're saving the economy.

westguy · July 30, 2012

I think saying things are good is a little circumspect there is labour unrest, people are displeased about reforms to government programs and cuts, as well the government racked up the debt. Bringing the deficit down is a far cry from paying down the debt.

However, was paying down the debt even part of the plan?

The price of consumer goods has skyrocketted since 2008. With recent drought in the US many foodstuffs may increase further. While you can paint a picture of aresponsible government, there is still a lot left in want. Making life better for the rich at the hands of the poor isn't a good government.

Government programs should be hand in hand with poverty elimination, I don't see taxes being adjusted enough to provide the provices with the capacity for poverty reduction, nor greater subsidies for the poor. The removal of programs such as RRAP is just one example of how the government is alienating the poor.

Personal debt is also very high in Canada.

I think passing the costs off and giving people a worse deal isn't improving the government. While some changes are needed, one still needs to see the way the government has gone about doing it, and it is one that alienates regular Canadians, and the poor.

It is also one that abuses the processess of government such as the parliamentary process.

It is also grossly negligent in efficiency.

While everything I would say in review is not negative I will fixate on the negative as they are important points of fixation, in labour interferance, underhandedness, and absence of provision of the poor through assurances.

There is still a lot of waste, government luxury is just one part of that.

Its not all just dollars and cents, there should be a social interest in mind of policy, and I don't think the government is insuring that the provinces are given the leadway. Canadians are too taxed for no social safety net.

While the removal of corporate taxes is good in the long run, there needs to be reorganization of the personal tax system, and drastic reductions in that system, with subsription based program delivery implemented.

There is still a lot of bad programs out there and a lot of bad funding that is purely porkbarrelled nonsense and political bribes. It ain't good enough and it ain't doin it in the right places. Cut perks for the rich and bring the quality of life of the poor to a relative standard though assurances from the programs to provide a streamlined equal oppourtunity program for social housing, local development and self sufficiency. The government is not insuring provision. It is not good results, they are horrible results.

like adscam I presume?

CPCFTW · July 30, 2012

Would any other government been stupid enough to slash the government's fiscal capacity as they ramped up spending? Probably not. The Conservatives created the deficit problem when Canada was already being propped up by a strong commodities market. Now it's being waved around as though they should be commended for reducing something that should have never been in the first place.

Highest revenues of any government in Canadian history!!

Or is it only ok to speak in absolutes when discussing expenditures in lefty la-la land?

Considering they have continued to cut taxes and offer tax credits while the world is mired in a recession, but have managed to increase tax revenues, I think all non-partisan hacks can agree that they've done a great job at maintaining the government's fiscal capacity. Could it be that tax cuts stimulate economic activity that actually increases tax revenue!?! Who would have thought?

cybercoma · July 30, 2012

Highest revenues of any government in Canadian history!!

Yet they're still spending more than they have.

punked · July 30, 2012

Highest revenues of any government in Canadian history!!

Or is it only ok to speak in absolutes when discussing expenditures in lefty la-la land?

Considering they have continued to cut taxes and offer tax credits while the world is mired in a recession, but have managed to increase tax revenues, I think all non-partisan hacks can agree that they've done a great job at maintaining the government's fiscal capacity. Could it be that tax cuts stimulate economic activity that actually increases tax revenue!?! Who would have thought?

Tax Revenue is down from is peak in 2008. Also revenue grew slower after the tax cut then before it which is obvious from the cross tabs on that one. So I am unsure what conclusion you are drawing here, besides the one where you hope no one will post the actual government revenue charts. Here they are.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/11-402-x/2011000/chap/gov-gouv/tbl/tbl02-eng.htm

punked · July 30, 2012

Yet they're still spending more than they have.

It doesn't matter because this years isn't the highest revenues ever anyway. Even if it was we lost 4 years from the revenue high and are only gaining now because the government didn't go with a big enough stimulus to prevent 4 lost years of growth. Thus we are still 4 years behind where we could have been.

cybercoma · July 30, 2012

It doesn't matter because this years isn't the highest revenues ever anyway. Even if it was we lost 4 years from the revenue high and are only gaining now because the government didn't go with a big enough stimulus to prevent 4 lost years of growth. Thus we are still 4 years behind where we could have been.

Oh, I know it. I just like pointing out how his conclusions are wrong even when someone accepts the wrong things that he's saying.

Shady · July 30, 2012

It doesn't matter because this years isn't the highest revenues ever anyway. Even if it was we lost 4 years from the revenue high and are only gaining now because the government didn't go with a big enough stimulus to prevent 4 lost years of growth. Thus we are still 4 years behind where we could have been.

A bigger stimulus can't compensate for a global recession. Unless you wanna borrow a trillion dollars like your buddy Obama did. All we'd be doing is adding to our debt to GDP without anything to show for it. It's better to hold the fiscal line now, and reap the rewards when the global economy recovers some. But you're all about short term gain for long term pain. You need to see the bigger picture and think more long term and stop being so short-sighted.

Shady · July 30, 2012

Would any other government been stupid enough to slash the government's fiscal capacity as they ramped up spending?

Complete nonsense. They didn't slash the government's fiscal capacity. What do you define as a so-called slash? Anyways, keeping in place lower businesses tas rates keeps Canada more competitive in the global economy and actually aids Canada's fiscal capacity in the long run.