Syrian Civil War

DogOnPorch · July 10, 2013

As a part of NATO, yes we are.

Ah, OK...fair enough. So what have we sent them so far and how well are these Canadian arms shipments helping the 'rebels' ? Be specific if you could. Are they affecting the outcome of battles?

GostHacked · July 10, 2013

Ah, OK...fair enough. So what have we sent them so far and how well are these Canadian arms shipments helping the 'rebels' ? Be specific if you could. Are they affecting the outcome of battles?

Already addressed and answered several times in this thread.

DogOnPorch · July 10, 2013

Already addressed and answered several times in this thread.

In other words: No Canadian weapons or soldiers are serving or being used in Syria. Most everyone on both sides uses Russian weapons. Are you still going with former Warsaw Pact countries turned NATO supplying all the Russian weapons we're seeing on the battlefield via Turkey? What was it? Poland? Bulgaria? I forget. I had a good laugh, though.

GostHacked · July 10, 2013

In other words: No Canadian weapons or soldiers are serving or being used in Syria.

Hold on I need a triple facepalm picture for this one......

Most everyone on both sides uses Russian weapons. Are you still going with former Warsaw Pact countries turned NATO supplying all the Russian weapons we're seeing on the battlefield via Turkey?

What do you mean 'still going with'? That was never part of my argument to begin with.

DogOnPorch · July 10, 2013

Hold on I need a triple facepalm picture for this one......

What do you mean 'still going with'? That was never part of my argument to begin with.

1. Well you can always post some info as to which Canadian regiment is currently serving in Syria...or not.

2. Somebody keeps claiming NATO...thus Canada...is supplying 'al-Qaeda' (et al) with weapons but can never find any actual evidence of this being put into practice in a meaningful way. Meanwhile, LiveLeak has a dedicated Syria channel. You'd think that some of these "NATO supplied weapons" would turn-up there being used in action. But...alas...no. It was at this point that SOMEBODY made the claim that Russian weapons were being sent from Bulgaria (or one of those other 'arias') to the "Rebels" via Turkey. But, apparently is wasn't you.

GostHacked · July 10, 2013

1. Well you can always post some info as to which Canadian regiment is currently serving in Syria...or not.

That claim you make was never part of my argument.

2. Somebody keeps claiming NATO...thus Canada...is supplying 'al-Qaeda' (et al) with weapons but can never find any actual evidence of this being put into practice in a meaningful way.

There were never specific claims about weapons from Canada. Just like there were never any claims about US M-16s. Both of those claims were brought up by you.

Meanwhile, LiveLeak has a dedicated Syria channel. You'd think that some of these "NATO supplied weapons" would turn-up there being used in action. But...alas...no. It was at this point that SOMEBODY made the claim that Russian weapons were being sent from Bulgaria (or one of those other 'arias') to the "Rebels" via Turkey. But, apparently is wasn't you.

So why do you continue to frame your responses to specific arguments that were never made in these Syria thread?

Edited July 10, 2013 by GostHacked

DogOnPorch · July 10, 2013

That claim you make was never part of my argument.

There were never specific claims about weapons from Canada. Just like there were never any claims about US M-16s. Both of those claims were brought up by you.

So why do you continue to frame your responses to specific arguments that were never made in these Syria thread?

So we're now in agreement that Canada isn't supplying 'rebels' in Syria? Excellent.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

So we're now in agreement that Canada isn't supplying 'rebels' in Syria? Excellent.

We are in agreement that Canada is not supplying soldiers and/or weapons to the FSA. However, being a part of NATO, we are 'obligated' to assist Turkey, how that support is given I am not sure of.

Canada has given money to help refugees, and I suspect money has been given to the FSA.

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/politics/archives/2013/01/20130130-132831.html

OTTAWA - Canada pledged another $25 million in humanitarian aid to Syria on Wednesday.

But now this is the third time you have attempted to twist my stance to a specific argument that was never made.

I'll wait for the 4th, 5th, 6th attempts .... you might get it right soon enough.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

:rolleyes:

Your stance has been that Canada is supporting 'the rebels'.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

Your stance has been that Canada is supporting 'the rebels'.

My stance had been NATO supporting the rebels.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

My stance had been NATO supporting the rebels.

...what is this? The witch scene from Holy Grail?

GH: Good thing we are doing the right thing by supporting the rebels. Good thing we would support a chemical weapon attack from the rebels but not from Assad .... at least there is consistency.

The only 'we' you and I belong to is Canada. But if you wish to say you meant NATO, that's also fine. Now it brings us again to the next point: where is the evidence of meaningful NATO support on the battlefield? Not food for the women and children...but weapons for al-Qaeda? I can provide endless examples of Russian designed weapons. But NATO weapons in Syria? Not so much. I did point out one interesting video of M-48 Pattons...an old American built tank...showing-up in Syria, but you weren't interested as to how they got there.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

The only 'we' you and I belong to is Canada. But if you wish to say you meant NATO, that's also fine. Now it brings us again to the next point: where is the evidence of meaningful NATO support on the battlefield? Not food for the women and children...but weapons for al-Qaeda? I can provide endless examples of Russian designed weapons. But NATO weapons in Syria? Not so much. I did point out one interesting video of M-48 Pattons...an old American built tank...showing-up in Syria, but you weren't interested as to how they got there.

I've already dealt with that. Now you are going full circle yet again.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

I've already dealt with that. Now you are going full circle yet again.

You showed me an example of a sniper rifle that I can buy online.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

You showed me an example of a sniper rifle that I can buy online.

Your 'questions' have already been addressed in this thread and others.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

Your 'questions' have already been addressed in this thread and others.

lol...no they haven't GH which is why I'm a bulldog when it comes to wild claims like NATO supplying al-Qaeda. Easy to say...not so easy to show in practice.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

lol...no they haven't GH which is why I'm a bulldog when it comes to wild claims like NATO supplying al-Qaeda. Easy to say...not so easy to show in practice.

Why do you take my suspicions as 'fact' and feel the need to bulldog counter them?

Why do you continue to frame and re-frame my stance each and every time you don't get the answer or reaction you are looking for?

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

Why do you take my suspicions as 'fact' and feel the need to bulldog counter them?

Why do you continue to frame and re-frame my stance each and every time you don't get the answer or reaction you are looking for?

You can't prove your suspicions? Tens of thousands of combat videos coming out of both sides in Syria but not one showing a crate marked 'NATO weapons for al-Qaeda' in plain view? Are they being taken down as they are posted?

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

You can't prove your suspicions? Tens of thousands of combat videos coming out of both sides in Syria but not one showing a crate marked 'NATO weapons for al-Qaeda' in plain view? Are they being taken down as they are posted?

What exactly are you fishing for?

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

What exactly are you fishing for?

I'll just call your 'suspicions' unfounded at best...influenced by speculative MSM reporting.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

I'll just call your 'suspicions' unfounded at best...influenced by speculative MSM reporting.

Turkey is a part of NATO right?

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

Turkey is a part of NATO right?

It is...but that doesn't mean it's like the Hell's Angels in a barroom brawl. Either way, you haven't provided even a shred of proof of Turkish weapons being supplied to al-Qaeda, either. But, you're indeed suspicious.

Edited July 11, 2013 by DogOnPorch

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

It is...but that doesn't mean it's like the Hell's Angels in a barroom brawl. Either way, you haven't provided even a shred of proof of Turkish weapons being supplied to al-Qaeda, either. But, you're indeed suspicious.

Good thing you have paying attention. As I said, I have provided links to back my suspicions. But please do NOT take MY word for it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012/09/22/syria-free-army-turkey-command.html

Rebels will continue to operate in Turkey

In the past few months, rebels have been able to capture wide swaths of territory along the Turkish border and three border crossing points on the frontier, which has allowed them to ferry both material and people to help in the fight to oust Assad. The rebels also have seized control of several neighbourhoods in the northern Syrian city of Aleppo, the country's largest and commercial capital, in weeks of bloody fighting.

Despite the announcement that the FSA's command centre has been shifted to Syria, the rebels will continue to rely on Turkey, which has been one of the bases for fighters and supplies flowing back and forth into Syria.

Sit Ubu sit. Good bulldog.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

Good thing you have paying attention. As I said, I have provided links to back my suspicions. But please do NOT take MY word for it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012/09/22/syria-free-army-turkey-command.html

Sit Ubu sit. Good bulldog.

Reduced to name calling? Really?

Again...just words from unknown reporters. Let's see some of these apparent NATO weapons/personnel in action. If they're the overall deciding factor in this war (not just an old M-16 from Gulf War I) they should be EVERYWHERE. Assad's supporters would make sure we had the vids on our hot l'il desktops. We have the technology...

Meanwhile, I've spotted supposed Iranian POWs, ancient US tanks and Hezbollah shooting-off Scuds to name but a few outside players at work in Syria. Both sides have been caught on camera doing absolutely horrific things that NOBODY in the West condones. Eating hearts...beheadings...crushed under tank treads...blown up with grenades...sadistic torture...rape...etc. All on camera. And EVERYWHERE...Russian designed non-NATO weapons. Like 95-99%...EVERYWHERE.

GostHacked · July 11, 2013

Reduced to name calling? Really?

Hmm maybe I read somewhere that you called yourself a bulldog. I could be mistaken!

lol...no they haven't GH which is why I'm a bulldog when it comes to wild claims like NATO supplying al-Qaeda. Easy to say...not so easy to show in practice.

Quadruple facepalm?

Again...just words from unknown reporters. Let's see some of these apparent NATO weapons/personnel in action. If they're the overall deciding factor in this war (not just an old M-16 from Gulf War I) they should be EVERYWHERE. Assad's supporters would make sure we had the vids on our hot l'il desktops. We have the technology...

Post #95 dealt with this.

I'll recap just for you.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-57590531/u.s-training-syrian-rebels-at-secret-bases/

(CBS News) WASHINGTON -- Since late last year, the CIA has been training small numbers of Syrian rebels at secret bases in Turkey and Jordan, CBS News has confirmed.

The training has included the use of anti-tank and anti-aircraft weapons, which have been provided by Arab countries, and which the rebels say they badly need to counter the firepower of the Syrian army.

So far, you'd have to say the training hasn't succeeded, since in the past several weeks, the tide of battle has turned in favor of the government forces.

I missed the other article that was mentioned there.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57589252/u.s.-syria-used-chemical-weapons-crossing-red-line/

If they were not supporting them then .. they are now!!

The president has made a decision about providing more support to the opposition that will involve providing direct support to the [supreme Military Council]. That includes military support," Deputy National Security Adviser for Strategic Communication Ben Rhodes told reporters.

Let's not forget about Mr McCain's visit to the FSA.

Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., who met with the rebels last month and has been a vocal critic of the president's Syria policy said in a joint statement with Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C.: "We appreciate the President's finding that the Assad regime has used chemical weapons on several occasions. We also agree with the President that this fact must affect U.S. policy toward Syria. The President's red line has been crossed. U.S. credibility is on the line. Now is not the time to merely take the next incremental step. Now is the time for more decisive actions."

Fact - FSA was and still is operating from bases in Turkey.

Fact - US military is in Turkey to help train Syrian Rebels.

Fact - The FSA is made up of many foreign fighters including known terror groups, one in particular Al-Queda.

Fact - No one has any solid evidence that the Assad regime OR the FSA used chemical weapons.

Meanwhile, I've spotted supposed Iranian POWs, ancient US tanks and Hezbollah shooting-off Scuds to name but a few outside players at work in Syria. Both sides have been caught on camera doing absolutely horrific things that NOBODY in the West condones. Eating hearts...beheadings...crushed under tank treads...blown up with grenades...sadistic torture...rape...etc. All on camera. And EVERYWHERE...Russian designed non-NATO weapons. Like 95-99%...EVERYWHERE.

I now challenge you to counter my claims with a comprehensible argument with links to back up your argument.

DogOnPorch · July 11, 2013

Again...a lot of talk...but it's not coming out in the actual action footage. Perhaps every single time somebody in Syria catches NATO supplied weapons and soldiers on camera they meet a tragic end. There is that chance. I could also win the NYS Lottery and meet ET.

You can call me DOP if you don't wish to write out the full name.