Big Blue Machine Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 I have lived through four prime ministers, Brian Mulroney, Kim Campbell, Jean Chretien, Paul Martin. It's a tie between Jean Chretien and Brian Mulroney. As you regard to premiers, I have lived through five premiers, David Peterson, Bob Rae, Mike Harris, Ernie Eves, and Dalton "The Liar" McGuinty. My favourite premier would be Mike Harris. Who are favourite prime ministers and premiers in your like time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caesar Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 I have lived through many more than you. Mine is Trudeau; you may not always liked what he said but you could always trust his word. Premiers here in BC have been plentiful; I suppose Mike Harcourt would be one of the nicest and he had no criminal charges. That is a rarity now in BC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Easy, Rene Levesque was Canada's best politician. He was more of a democrat than a separatist. (Trudeau was more of a federalist than a democrat.) Laurier, like Smallwood and Diefenbaker, was an egotist. Mulroney, like Pearson, lacked confidence. Clark was too foolish. Meighen too, I suspect. But Bourassa had the best office (in the HQ building), and Davis the best staff. Lougheed was the toughest, in public. Bouchard was an ordinary guy. For those who choose Trudeau, I met Jacques Hebert in the Montreal Ritz. He was a drunk snob. For me, Trudeau was a snob. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakunin Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 in my life time for the federal i guess il have to chose since trudeau to paul martin so, ill pick murloney by default because i don't like other's. For the provincial, ill have to chose from lesvesque to charest. Since i was too young to look politics before lucien bouchard, i would chose bouchard for its politics, economic point of vue and charest can't be seriously considered . For parizeau and landry, i would consider them good premier but not good premier minister. As for René lesvesque, i was around 2 years old when he retired, its too sad because from what i read and heard, he his what i would call the best prime minister had and he is the perfect prime minister. He is my inspiration, he was a democrate first and that is the best quality a prime minister can have i guess. has for world leaders i would choose, De gaulle, gandhi, mandela, allendes... has for my favorite minister for now its yves séguin who is currently finance minister because i have to chose between the minister i know of and im interested in politics only since ~ 6 years, i dont have many choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplesyrup Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Trudeau hands down. Someone who had a real vision for Canada's future, was 50 years ahead of his time, though he was in the wrong party. Trudeau's low point was the War Measures Act, and his high point was the patriation of the Constitution. The Trudeau and Levesque debates were the high point of politics in Canada for me, and I liked both of them. Bourassa was the worst premier ever in my opinion, very weak, and he was partly responsible for Trudeau bringing in the War Measures Act Jean Lesage is my favourite premier - La Revolution Tranquille, where education was removed from the hands of the clergy and a lay-led Eduction Department was established in Quebec, although I do have a soft spot for some of the Jesuits like Father Malone at Loyola. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caesar Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 The FLQ's kidnapping and murdering was what brought the War Measures into being. I was completely in favour of this action. That is probably why I admired Trudeau the most; he would not bargain with our home grown terrorists despite the fact his own family would be the favoured target. His tough actions brought that situation under control quite quickly. Without the War Measures Act it would probably have spread and grown. Most despised Prime Minister/ Premier would be Mulroney and our present day Gordon Campbell hands down; little competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idealisttotheend Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Trudeau inspired the counrty and made it feel that it was something more than an economic space and an adjunct to the economic and military power of the United States. Trudeau was the last PM to have no connection to Bay Street. Whatever August thinks of Levesque, Trudeau destroyed the man and utterly beat him at his own game. Trudeau stood for something. You might agree with it, you might not but you never questioned his authenticity or commitment to his principles and ideals. For some reason that is rare since the Regean, Thatcher, Mulroney "revolution." Favorite premier? T. C. Douglas of course. He stood up to the doctors over Medicare and created the first socialist government in North America. Show me another current politician who would risk a doctor's strike to get what he knew was right (keep in mind that the Canadian Medical Association gave him an award almost fifty years later.) CBC archieve re: Douglas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjalmar Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 The one who stood out above all the rest in my view was Peter Lougheed, premier of Alberta. The worst prime minister of all was Pierre Trudeau who virtually destroyed Canada -- Canada will never be the same again because of him. In the USA we had Kennedy standing up to the communists offensive arms buildup in Cuba when he placed a quarantine on Russian vessels entering that country in an effort to keep communism from our doorstep. Not too long after that, we see a picture of Trudeau hugging Castro in the newspapers. Shame!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cartman Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Trudeau and Douglas. Campbell is the worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takeanumber Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Klein has been the worse premier. Robichaud was the best premier. I'd have to say Chretien 1996-1999 was the best PM. I'd have to say Mulroney 1984-1991 was the worst PM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Terrible Sweal Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 My time begins with Trudeau as PM. He certainly beats everyone since then, no problem at all. But hey, maybe Paul Martin will surprise me after all. As for premiers, it's harder to say -- Davis presided over some pretty good times for Ontario, but was it his doing? Campbell in PEI did a lot of good. Likewise McKenna and Lord both in NB, lately. Levesque is right up there too. It's easier to pick the worst premier(s). Duplessis. Then Harris and anyone from BC or NS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplesyrup Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 What's not to like about Duplessis? The way it worked in his day was say CIL would get a contract to supply the paint to the provincial goverrnment. Now normally CIL would sell the paint for $5. a gallon, we are talking millions of gallons of paint here, but they would sell it to the government for $7 or $8. Then at election time CIL would provide money (the difference between the regular selling price for the paint and the higher price they charged the government), lots of money to the Union Nationale. Then the UN bagmen, and they actually did this, went to all the towns in Quebec just before the election, and people were offered a case of beer which cost $5 or the cash, whichever was their choice - a gift from their Premier Maurice Duplessis. Don't forget Duplessis also arrested Jehovah Witnesses on behalf of the Catholic Church. There was I believe, a Jewish restauranteur, who used to put up bail money for these JW who got arrested. Duplessis revoked his liquor license and destroyed his business. Renkarelli eventually moved to the US and opened up a restaurant there. Rekarelli's lawyer And Trudeau marched with strikers against Duplessis as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Terrible Sweal Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 What's not to like about Duplessis? The way it worked in his day was say CIL would get a contract to supply the paint to the provincial goverrnment. Now normally CIL would sell the paint for $5. a gallon, we are talking millions of gallons of paint, but they would sell it to the government for $7 or $8. But then at election time CIL would provide money (the difference between the regular selling price for the paint and the higher price they charged the government), lots of money to the Union Nationale. Then the UN bagmen, and they actually did this, went to all the towns in Quebec just before the election, and people were offered a case of beer which cost $5 or the cash, whichever was their choice - a gift from their Premier Maurice Duplessis. Now that was efficiency. Today, patronage is all bogged down in with red tape and corporate middlemen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caesar Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Pierre Trudeau who virtually destroyed Canada -- Canada will never be the same again because of him I would say Trudeau saved Canada; no doubt. Without him, we wouldn't be worrying now about Quebec separating; it would have already been a done deal. It was Mulroney who wrecked Canada's control of its resources and sovernity. (How do you spell that? wish we had a spell checker) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplesyrup Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Sovereignty? caesar.....thanks to Mulroney and these insane trade agreements, instead of being able to supply ourselves with our own oil at a reasonable price, we now have to sell our supplies to the US. Canada can't even decide what to do with our own resources anymore. We desperately need someone like Trudeau again, especially to deal with the likes of Parizeau, Duceppe, Bush, etc. A lot of people have poo-pooed Trudeau's economic abilities, but his family controlled Champlain Oil at one time, and in hindsight, can you imagine how well off Canadians would be now if we still had our oil and could sell some of it for today's and tomorrow's prices. Our business community is so full of hot air most of the time, to the major detriment of Canadians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willy Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Caesar, Quebec didn't sign the constitution in 82. In fact the deal was done with Quebec not in the room. Mulroney, tried to fix the problem with Meech Lake, but failed. Then in Charletown he tried to make everyone happy and failed again. I give him props because he went for it. We had real leadership in those days, for the last 10 years we have bureaucratic management. (nothing I can think of as worse) Yes, I would have to say in my time the best PM is Mulroney. I lived through the Klien revolution and for him to maintain the support he did through the changes to the province is impressive leadership. I have also had personal experience with Don Getty, Glen Clark, Mike Harcourt and Gordon Campbell. Glen Clark takes the prize for being the big looser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplesyrup Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Glen Clark takes the prize for being the big looser. Sounds like another hollow businessman's rant. Is that why he is working for Jimmy Pattison now? Where's the substance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willy Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 As you said in the past, maplesyrup. It is common scence. Fast ferries Patronage (the heads of ICBC, BCHousing, ect.) Union payoffs (inflated contracts e.g. HEU) Questionable book keeping (before the election to state balance books only to find out after it was a lie) Killing any working relationship with Ottawa (militant stance) Killing any working relationship with US (US ships on Vancouver Island being annexed) A shrinking economy (Was down to one mine, consolidation in forestry and closures, corporate offices going to Alberta) Frozen tuition with no new resources (Hurting the ability to receive a quality education) Miss used Hydro revenues (needed massive reinvestment into our power system and they looked at wet winters as a means to balance the books) Ect. I really could go on and on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willy Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 How is he doing as a midlevel manager in a sign company? I hope Jimmy put him in charge of some good union employees. Hey he might be a good sales men but I look for a little more in a Premier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticker Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Trudeau hands down. Someone who had a real vision for Canada's future, was 50 years ahead of his time, though he was in the wrong party. Trudeau's low point was the War Measures Act, and his high point was the patriation of the Constitution. spoken like a ture socialist. you mean the high point was PET's NEP... any vote buying to keep the east happy at the expense of Alberta by a massive discrimination policy. Yea PET was 50 years ahead of his time... in another 50 years there would be no conventional oil for PET to use as an excuse to trash the alberta economy for "the good of the country".. I mean Ontario. then maybe Quebec Hydro "energy" would fall under the definition of "NEP" ... except quebec would get money for having energy not money taken because they have energy. PET was in the wrong party.. instead of hidding behind a liberal party masquerade he just should of run for the head of the NEP I mean NDP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blue Machine Posted August 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 Trudeau pushed the country more apart than he kept it together. He screwed the West with the NEP. He patriated the constuition, which gives too much protection to the people. He stayed too long in power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idealisttotheend Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 Trudeau pushed the country more apart than he kept it together. How? He screwed the West with the NEP. The NEP was controversial but not the rapture that it is now made out to be. Unless of course you prefer Albertan oil to be owned out of Texas instead of Calgary. He patriated the constuition, which gives too much protection to the people. I'm sorry, BBM, but the people can never, ever have too much protection. A democracy exists for the people any other consideration is secondary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blue Machine Posted August 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 Ok, he united the country one way, with a truly national debt. He appointed bad finance ministers. I forget his name, the finance minister in 80 just re-used John Crosbie's budget of 79. Marc Lalonde did more damage with bigger deficits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caesar Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 The NEP was controversial but not the rapture that it is now made out to be. Unless of course you prefer Albertan oil to be owned out of Texas instead of Calgary. I think Mulroney made that almost a done deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplesyrup Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 Does someone have a URL that shows Canada's debt over time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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