Good Job Global Warming ERR Killing Frost in April

[Boges]

This really sucks!

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/early-thaw-and-late-freeze-lay-waste-to-ontarios-orchards/article2427150/

“I’ll tell you, I’ve never seen anything like this,” he says.

Extreme weather over the past few months has had a devastating impact on fruit growers throughout Ontario, Quebec, and northeastern United States. Unusually warm temperatures in March coaxed fruit trees out of their winter dormancy early. Subsequent deep frosts, occurring as recently as late April, damaged the blossoms, crippling their ability to pollinate. In Ontario, the fruit industry is expecting to record tens of millions of dollars in losses, according to early estimates.

Apples, cherries and plums have been hardest hit. In the Georgian Bay area, from Owen Sound to Collingwood, one of the largest apple-growing areas in Ontario that produces about 25 per cent of the province’s apples, growers have lost 80 per cent of their crop, says Brian Gilroy, chairman of the Ontario Apple Growers, which represents growers throughout the province. Some individual growers have been completely wiped out.

I had a feeling when I saw trees blooming in mid-march that something was wrong. But the really crappy April was the problem.

There's no real evidence that climate change is the culprit here. Growing stuff is a gamblers game. Just really bad luck this year. How can you blame a warm March and a cold April at the same time?

But this hits everyone. I eat an apple a day at lunch because I can buy a bag of them for usually less than $4. I'm not going to continue that healthy behaviour if the price of an apple becomes prohibitively expensive.

Looks like we might have to enjoy stuff that's not locally grown this coming year.

[Michael Hardner]

Do you eat apples all year round ? If so, you're not eating locally grown for more of the year.

[Boges]

Do you eat apples all year round ? If so, you're not eating locally grown for more of the year.

They say grown in Ontario on them.

From what I gather you can put apples in a climate controlled, low oxygen rooms for the winter and they stay reasonably fresh.

[Michael Hardner]

They say grown in Ontario on them.

From what I gather you can put apples in a climate controlled, low oxygen rooms for the winter and they stay reasonably fresh.

Really. The apples I see in Loblaws all say USA on them, except in the fall.

[Boges]

Really. The apples I see in Loblaws all say USA on them, except in the fall.

I checked. Farmer's Market Empire Apples. Grown in Ontario. Purchased at a No Frills.

Those aren't the ones you buy by the pound. You buy a bag of smaller apples at a flat rate. Probably the runts of the litter, but it is spring.

[waldo]

There's no real evidence that climate change is the culprit here. Growing stuff is a gamblers game. Just really bad luck this year. How can you blame a warm March and a cold April at the same time?

ya, ya... MLW member 'Simple' tried to slough off the past recent years of dramatic high northern to mid latitude warming as simply "an isolated Arctic warming anomaly"... one with out any reach 'south', one without other impacts:

yes, warming is more prominent in Northern latitudes; however, warming is most certainly occurring in mid/southern latitudes. What could the reasons be for differences in the degree of warming across the respective latitudinal groupings, hey Simple?

is there anything preventing you from speaking to explanations on greater norther latitudes & Arctic warming? To ferreting out what you call an, "inconvenient truth"? I mean, c'mon Simple... surely fake skeptics must have some supporting rationale to delineate the additional northern latitudes & Arctic warming? Surely!

ok, ok... let's see: how about the greater proportion of land to water surface in the northern hemisphere... with oceans responding much slower to temperature change. Or how about, polar amplification, where changes in cloud cover, increases in atmospheric water vapour, and declining sea ice have all been suggested as contributing factors:

e.g.

The central role of diminishing sea ice in recent Arctic temperature amplification - Nature: James A. Screen & Ian Simmonds

as I said, "polar (Arctic) amplification":

Evidence linking Arctic amplification to extreme weather in mid-latitudes

Key Points

-Enhanced Arctic warming reduces poleward temperature gradient

-Weaker gradient affects waves in upper-level flow in two observable ways

-Both effects slow weather patterns, favoring extreme weather

Arctic amplification (AA)

– the observed enhanced warming in high northern latitudes relative to the northern hemisphere – is evident in lower-tropospheric temperatures and in 1000-to-500 hPa thicknesses. Daily fields of 500 hPa heights from the National Centers for Environmental Prediction Reanalysis are analyzed over N. America and the N. Atlantic to assess changes in north-south (Rossby) wave characteristics associated with AA and the relaxation of poleward thickness gradients. Two effects are identified that each contribute to a slower eastward progression of Rossby waves in the upper-level flow: 1) weakened zonal winds, and 2) increased wave amplitude. These effects are particularly evident in autumn and winter consistent with sea-ice loss, but are also apparent in summer, possibly related to earlier snow melt on high-latitude land. Slower progression of upper-level waves would cause associated weather patterns in mid-latitudes to be more persistent,

which may lead to an increased probability of extreme weather events that result from prolonged conditions, such as drought, flooding, cold spells, and heat waves

.

[Boges]

ya, ya... MLW member 'Simple' tried to slough off the past recent years of dramatic high northern to mid latitude warming as simply "an isolated Arctic warming anomaly"... one with out any reach 'south', one without other impacts:

as I said, "polar (Arctic) amplification":

Evidence linking Arctic amplification to extreme weather in mid-latitudes

Then how does all that explain last winter being really cold and the colder than normal April?

[waldo]

Then how does all that explain last winter being really cold and the colder than normal April?

as stated/quoted, see... increased probability of extreme weather events

[Boges]

as stated/quoted, see... increased probability of extreme weather events

That's a rather convenient explanation. The temperature is warming. Unless it cold then it's just extreme conditions due to the warming.

[waldo]

That's a rather convenient explanation. The temperature is warming. Unless it cold then it's just extreme conditions due to the warming.

nothing convenient... at all. You're just another guy who decided to beak-off about global warming... that there's no evidence. Well, I gave you... some evidence. Apparently, you don't like it - go figure. Why would that be?

[eyeball]

That's a rather convenient explanation. The temperature is warming. Unless it cold then it's just extreme conditions due to the warming.

It stands to reason that more heat in the atmosphere means there's more energy driving the weather systems in it.

[Boges]

It stands to reason that more heat in the atmosphere means there's more energy driving the weather systems in it.

This wasn't caused by extreme weather per say. It was cool conditions that followed warm conditions. Currently the weather is very seasonal in the areas affected.

[eyeball]

This wasn't caused by extreme weather per say. It was cool conditions that followed warm conditions. Currently the weather is very seasonal in the areas affected.

I didn't say it was I simply implied there is more energy moving the things that are in the atmosphere around - warm and cold air masses in this case.

[CPCFTW]

We've angered global warming!!! Repent damn you!! Repent!! The four glaciers of the apocalypse are coming!! Heed the words of the globe:

Thou shalt not support oil exploration and development.

Thou shalt not not drive a hybrid.

Thou shalt not publish the works of contrarian scientists.

Etc.

Edited May 10, 2012 by CPCFTW

[Guest Manny]

Simple experiment-

Part One:

Put ice cubes in empty glass. Pour favourite beverage into glass. Ice melts.

Take sip.

Observation: Despite the ice melting, implying a rise in temperature, liquid in the glass got cooler.

Part Two (advanced thermodynamics)

Place a small pot of water on the stove. Add several ice cubes.

Turn on stove, applying heat.

Observation: Ice cubes melt at an accelerated rate compared to part one.

This creates local eddy currents, causing cooler regions to appear near the ice cubes, while water becomes notably warmer further down.

Continue observing for several minutes, noting size and distribution of ice cubes versus time. Record all observations in your log book...

[waldo]

We've angered global warming!!!

oh my - you are quite the alarmist!

[TheNewTeddy]

Global warming can not be determined by one frost snap, one warm year, or even a decade of change.

The globe is big. It takes a long time to warm up. Come back when you have 50 years of data.

[waldo]

Global warming can not be determined by one frost snap, one warm year, or even a decade of change.

The globe is big. It takes a long time to warm up. Come back when you have 50 years of data.

you're welcome

[GostHacked]

The one thing that people can expect is higher produce prices later this year. During the colder weather in Canada, we get our produce from the USA, Mexico, Brazil, and many other places. Ontario can only grow produce in the warmer times of the year. So if the Ontario crops are devastated now, that will mean higher prices in the fall.