European Cup vs. Stanley Cup

Boges · December 8, 2011

ahhh you know the game well... ...I never had sufficient to vertical to be any good...I had a friend who was coach of a national uni championship squad(U of S), I always enjoyed his explanation of the technical aspects of the game...

I thought I knew Volleyball well but I have know clue what a 51 is. :rolleyes:

blueblood · December 8, 2011

ahhh you know the game well... ...I never had sufficient to vertical to be any good...I had a friend who was coach of a national uni championship squad(U of S), I always enjoyed his explanation of the technical aspects of the game...

You always know the sports you played as a teenager. Vball is a game of finesse, mind you football in it's own way is as well. Hockey is almost too fluid to see the finesse part of it.

wyly · December 8, 2011

I thought I knew Volleyball well but I have know clue what a 51 is.

I coached soccer for over 25 years and I'd like to think I know it well but personally knowing coaches from professional of international ability I realize I know very little I actually know...

blueblood · December 8, 2011

I thought I knew Volleyball well but I have know clue what a 51 is.

In my day we called hitting locations by numbers. A 51 is middle of the net strike spot is 1 foot above the net. That means you have to already be in the air when the ball is set so that when your at the top of your jump the ball is at the top of it's arc. This hit is the one where the really big kills come in because essentially a well set ball is right smack in your wheel house and a well hit 51 pretty much goes straight down and hard. It's best used when either power or weak side hitting is established and the middle blocker is already cheating. A 15 was our standard power hitter set, lots of time for the hitter to set up his run.

wyly · December 8, 2011

You always know the sports you played as a teenager. Vball is a game of finesse, mind you football in it's own way is as well. Hockey is almost too fluid to see the finesse part of it.

so true...I don't particularly like baseball, far to slow to keep my attention, but I know it's a highly technical game with many nuances that the average person does not see or grasp...

the same for soccer, to many it looks like a kick and chase game, but the level of technical skill involved is staggering which you can't appreciate until you've played it a respectable level...I always have a good laugh listening to cbc or ctv play by play guys trying to explain it when they haven't a clue...

wyly · December 8, 2011

In my day we called hitting locations by numbers. A 51 is middle of the net strike spot is 1 foot above the net. That means you have to already be in the air when the ball is set so that when your at the top of your jump the ball is at the top of it's arc. This hit is the one where the really big kills come in because essentially a well set ball is right smack in your wheel house and a well hit 51 pretty much goes straight down and hard. It's best used when either power or weak side hitting is established and the middle blocker is already cheating. A 15 was our standard power hitter set, lots of time for the hitter to set up his run.

considerably more advanced than when I played in high school...then it was just get it up and smack it down anywhere...

Shwa · December 8, 2011

No but you're implying that skating is what makes Ice Hockey the most difficult sport. Something that almost any able bodied person can learn to do with a little practice.

Where - in this entire thread, or any other thread - have I said that hockey is "the most difficult sport?" Do tell. Do provide me with a link to that post I made.

Go ahead Boges.

Or are you misrepresenting... again. :rolleyes:

dre · December 8, 2011

BTW, I played league soccer, hockey, rugby, and lacross when I was growing up.

I found rugby and lacross to be more physically demanding than either hockey or soccer.

Boges · December 8, 2011

In your defence, hockey requires the participant to learn how to skate, learn how to use an gaming implement and then coordinate the two. The big ball sports don't require that sort of difficulty and are easier to play.

I made the assumption that this post was in direct response to Olp1fan's link that stated Hockey was the second most difficult sport to boxing.

Therefore I contended that, as skills go, baseball on golf require a much more difficult skill set.

If I mis-represented your true opinion I'm deeply sorry.

Shwa · December 8, 2011

Hitting a ball with a bat is the most difficult thing to do in professional sport,other than going 12 rounds in a professional boxing match...

What is a .300 hitter?I ask this because a .300 hitter is usually the benchmark of an extremely proficient hitter...

It's a guy who fails 7 out of every 10 times he's at the plate!!!

Would anyone take those odds in 'Vegas???

But I would wager that an average professional hockey player would get a big league hit before an average professional baseball player learns to skate. Plus most professional hockey players would love to have a .300 shooting percentage. The top NHL scorer still have a shooting percentage under 25 on a regular basis.

Jack Weber · December 8, 2011

But I would wager that an average professional hockey player would get a big league hit before an average professional baseball player learns to skate. Plus most professional hockey players would love to have a .300 shooting percentage. The top NHL scorer still have a shooting percentage under 25 on a regular basis.

He might get lucky hitting a curveball that did'nt curve....

Most professional hockey players would'nt get out of minor league A ball because they would'nt even get to The Mendoza Line,however...

blueblood · December 8, 2011

considerably more advanced than when I played in high school...then it was just get it up and smack it down anywhere...

High school volleyball in manitoba is what high school football is in Saskatchewan. We would run tandems (middle hitter going for a 51 and a weak side hitter coming in right after and right beside him for a 62 or 63. Ran a 6-2 offense (everyone in the front row eligible to hit, setter in the back row) that's as far as we got. I would have liked it when there was the libero in my day, would have made my life easier.

blueblood · December 8, 2011

He might get lucky hitting a curveball that did'nt curve....

Most professional hockey players would'nt get out of minor league A ball because they would'nt even get to The Mendoza Line,however...

I tried hitting an 85 mile an hour baseball, bloody hard to do, and that was off a throwing arm pitching machine to boot.

The funny thing about golf is the mental aspect about it. You have all the time in the world to hit your shot, I wonder if those PGA players were timed as to how long they take I wonder if their shots would improve.

I'd say catching a hail Mary while in midair on the sidelines with a defender on you and landing in bounds is the most difficult thing to do in professional sport

Edited December 8, 2011 by blueblood

dre · December 8, 2011

Hitting a ball with a bat is the most difficult thing to do in professional sport,other than going 12 rounds in a professional boxing match...

Thats all just subjective, and it depends what you mean by "difficult".

Baseball is about the least demanding sport Iv ever played. Golf, Rugby, and Lacross are the hardest.

Iv been playing golf for 20 years... Iv spent thousands of hours doing it, and play at least 50 times a year. Iv never played a game at par in my life, and "par" isnt even supposed to be exceptional.

Shwa · December 8, 2011

skating is something that is done quickly, most sports are hand/eye coordination a technical skill we all have from birth...soccer requires head/eye, chest/eye, thigh/eye, foot/eye none of which are natural skills we are born with...even when hand/eye is combined with an implement it is still essentially hand/eye...

One might have rudimentary eye-hand coordination from birth, but any technical expertise is learned.. just as head/eye, chest/eye, etc., and the technical use of a gaming implement such as a hockey stick or bat. However, all of this rests on the eye's ability to gaze and sort information.

I had this debate with a football player who went on about the incredible technical skill needed to complete an over the shoulder catch while on a dead run, to which I responded, "ok, now catch the ball on dead run with your chest then in the next step bury it in the back of a goal with your foot without the ball ever touching the ground"...

The football would have been better to discuss the technical skill of holding on to the ball with one hand while simultaneously getting hit by a 250 lb linebacker.

proficient technical soccer is more difficult to acquire...which goes a long way to explaining why canada is a dominant hockey power but rank 72nd in soccer despite that soccer is our most popular sport...

I have it on good information that part of our problem is the elite development program itself and it's inability to properly train athletes at the levels required to develop that technical proficiency.

Boges · December 8, 2011

Thats all just subjective, and it depends what you mean by "difficult".

Baseball is about the least demanding sport Iv ever played. Golf, Rugby, and Lacross are the hardest.

Iv been playing golf for 20 years... Iv spent thousands of hours doing it, and play at least 50 times a year. Iv never played a game at par in my life, and "par" isnt even supposed to be exceptional.

Rugby is difficult because of the physical demands on your body and that you both have to be strong and able to run for a long period of time.

But the skill required to hit a baseball or hit an approach shot in golf that stops on a dime required a completely different skill set.

Edited December 8, 2011 by Boges

blueblood · December 8, 2011

One might have rudimentary eye-hand coordination from birth, but any technical expertise is learned.. just as head/eye, chest/eye, etc., and the technical use of a gaming implement such as a hockey stick or bat. However, all of this rests on the eye's ability to gaze and sort information.

The football would have been better to discuss the technical skill of holding on to the ball with one hand while simultaneously getting hit by a 250 lb linebacker.

I have it on good information that part of our problem is the elite development program itself and it's inability to properly train athletes at the levels required to develop that technical proficiency.

Also the fact that we in north America only recently got a somewhat respectable pro soccer league. I think the problem is development at the high school level which is critical because those players in UEFA start at pretty young ages.

Jack Weber · December 8, 2011

Thats all just subjective, and it depends what you mean by "difficult".

Baseball is about the least demanding sport Iv ever played. Golf, Rugby, and Lacross are the hardest.

Iv been playing golf for 20 years... Iv spent thousands of hours doing it, and play at least 50 times a year. Iv never played a game at par in my life, and "par" isnt even supposed to be exceptional.

If you're talking about pure physicality??

You're right about baseball...

If you're taking into account the necessary mental approach??

Well,that's a gamechanger...

Shwa · December 8, 2011

He might get lucky hitting a curveball that did'nt curve....

Most professional hockey players would'nt get out of minor league A ball because they would'nt even get to The Mendoza Line,however...

Maybe, but they would still be able to hit the ball before a baseball player could skate well enough to take a meaningful shot.

Of course each elite sport has specific requirements to achieve that elite level. (For example, the top NCAA baseball players regularly hit over a .400) However, the difficulty in playing the sport is something else altogether. Hockey players of any age would have less difficulty playing sports that do not require skates than the players of those skateless sports playing hockey.

Boges · December 8, 2011

LOL the MLS isn't respectable.

It's where washed-up Euro's go to die.

Boges · December 8, 2011

Maybe, but they would still be able to hit the ball before a baseball player could skate well enough to take a meaningful shot.

Of course each elite sport has specific requirements to achieve that elite level. (For example, the top NCAA baseball players regularly hit over a .400) However, the difficulty in playing the sport is something else altogether. Hockey players of any age would have less difficulty playing sports that do not require skates than the players of those skateless sports playing hockey.

They also get to hit with aluminum bats. PING!!!!

dre · December 8, 2011

Rugby is difficult because of the physical demands on your body and that you both have to be strong and able to run for a long period of time.

But the skill required to hit a baseball or hit an approach shot in golf that stops on a dime required a completely different skill set.

The hard part about sports like rugby, soccer, and hockey isnt just the physical part. Its how well you can read the plays and mentally keep track of whats going on on the field. Take a look at Gretzky for example. Not a great skater, not a great shooter, not even a particularly athletic person. But he could see the ice and understand the plays from down on the ice as well as someone sitting in the press box.

Golf is a thinking mans game as well. You live and die by your mental approach to the game.

Jack Weber · December 8, 2011

Maybe, but they would still be able to hit the ball before a baseball player could skate well enough to take a meaningful shot.

Of course each elite sport has specific requirements to achieve that elite level. (For example, the top NCAA baseball players regularly hit over a .400) However, the difficulty in playing the sport is something else altogether. Hockey players of any age would have less difficulty playing sports that do not require skates than the players of those skateless sports playing hockey.

They're also allowed to use aluminum bats in NCAA baseball....

Ping!!!