MiddleClassCentrist Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 (edited) Globe and Mail Article “We’re now in a bit of a dilemma, because now the government has finally come around to supporting these amendments, but now they’ve been rejected,” Mr. Cotler told The Globe and Mail on Wednesday. “They didn’t take the process seriously.” A bunch of ideologues. Reject everyone's idea before even considering it, because it isn't your own. As an after though, realize the amendments made sense and slide them in as "your own". A spokesman for Mr. Toews said the changes came late because the government was still holding discussions with victims of terrorism after the committee ended its review. “If they weren’t finished, why were they rushing through this clause-by-clause [review]?” Mr. Harris said. “Clearly they abandoned a reasoned approach for the sake of a political agenda.” Edited December 1, 2011 by MiddleClassCentrist Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Moonbox Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 I don't really see how it's any different than an opposition that votes against or abstains from every piece of the government's legislation... Of course they're idealogues. Quote "A man is no more entitled to an opinion for which he cannot account than he is for a pint of beer for which he cannot pay" - Anonymous
Topaz Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 So much for Harper's word during the election to work with the opposition parties,so I guess when Tories are told by the PMO to reject, you reject! I did see that committee meeting and Colter kept saying I agree with your bill but it needs these amendments to make air tight for Canadians. Quote
cybercoma Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 I don't really see how it's any different than an opposition that votes against or abstains from every piece of the government's legislation... Of course they're idealogues. And your responsibility as a voter is to turf ideologues, regardless of where they sit in the House. The last thing we need are irresponsible, stubborn law-makers. Canadians deserve passionate, yet reasoned legislators that are willing to compromise. Quote
dre Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 (edited) Exactly kind of governance Canadians deserve. And instead of us demanding that folks in Ottawa act like adults, we will just engage in the same counter productive partisan bickering usual. Edited December 1, 2011 by dre Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Jack Weber Posted December 1, 2011 Report Posted December 1, 2011 This is the Mike Harris government,on a federal scale....I can't remember how many times the Harris' Tories (because it happened so many times)had to go back into legislation they were oh so proud of,because it required ammending the poorly thought out first attempt.. Now we have the Federal Harrisites basically ammending their "Tough on Crime" legislation by using other party's suggestions...The same suggestions they've previously denegrated!!! Expect this to happen often... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Argus Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 So much for Harper's word during the election to work with the opposition parties,so I guess when Tories are told by the PMO to reject, you reject! I did see that committee meeting and Colter kept saying I agree with your bill but it needs these amendments to make air tight for Canadians. You bitch when he rejects the opposition suggestions, and you bitch when he accepts them. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
jacee Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 You bitch when he rejects the opposition suggestions, and you bitch when he accepts them. The ammendments are good. Lying and pretending they are your own ... that's bad. Got it now? Quote
cybercoma Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 You bitch when he rejects the opposition suggestions, and you bitch when he accepts them. You have a point, but don't you think it's a bit of a problem when the government shoots down amendments for no other reason than ideology, only to turn around and accept them later. They can't be added back in, by the way. They have to wait until the bill hits the Senate. In any case, it shows a serious lack of responsibility, accountability, and integrity, imo. A majority government doesn't mean they get to do whatever the hell they want for their term. Otherwise, you might as well just shut down the House and let the rest of the MPs go home to their communities and work there. Quote
Topaz Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 You bitch when he rejects the opposition suggestions, and you bitch when he accepts them. Lets' face it, there's not many experience MP's in the Tories and the ones that were there, they drove away! Either the opposition amendments were good or they weren't. Since they tried to put them back in later, shows three things, they don't know the rules of parliament after 6-7 years, they hate being upstaged, I think its a little of both and they well good ideas. Quote
jacee Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 OTTAWA — Justice Minister Rob Nicholson ignored questions Thursday about how a massive new crime bill will deal with Canadians living with mental illness, including young offenders who find themselves being sentenced as adults. The Conservatives voted down this week all 88 amendments proposed by the opposition parties on Bill C-10, including one by Liberal MP Irwin Cotler that would have allowed judges to take into consideration mental illness when handing down new mandatory minimum sentences. Cotler's amendment, which echoed one proposed by the defence lawyers, would have allowed a judge to delay a mandatory minimum sentence to allow a convicted criminal to get mental health treatment. The government had already included a similar clause for drug addiction. http://m.ctv.ca/topstories/20111202/mental-illness-crime-bill-ottawa-111202.html It's the mentally ill who are being tasered and shot by police. Now they're being sentenced without consideration of need for treatment. Another law that will have to be changed. It's pathetic that these Harperites are so intent on not working with other parties to make GOOD laws instead of this crap. Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 The ammendments are good. Lying and pretending they are your own ... that's bad. Got it now? For Pete's Sake! The Chretien Liberals did that for over 10 years! One of the biggest was the Clarity Act! As usual, it's only wrong if a Tory does it! You're like a windup doll... Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
cybercoma Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 For Pete's Sake! The Chretien Liberals did that for over 10 years! One of the biggest was the Clarity Act! As usual, it's only wrong if a Tory does it! You're like a windup doll... Give me a break. Should every criticism about our current political affairs be prefaced with criticism of things that happened in the past? Quit being so partisan and address the issues at hand. Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 Give me a break. Should every criticism about our current political affairs be prefaced with criticism of things that happened in the past? Quit being so partisan and address the issues at hand. I try to! It's just hard when so many on this forum seem to ONLY take shots at Tories! They constantly give Liberals and/or NDP a free pass! It actually gets to be boring! I've taken shots at Tories too, despite the fact that so many ignorant posters seem to think that I am one! After all, they are ALL politicians! Except of course, Layton, who is apparently now a Saint and no one may now criticize him... Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
cybercoma Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 I try to! It's just hard when so many on this forum seem to ONLY take shots at Tories!The Tories are at the wheel. You don't criticize the passenger for driver errors. After all, they are ALL politicians! Except of course, Layton, who is apparently now a Saint and no one may now criticize him... Let the man rest in peace. There's no reason to criticize people themselves in the first place. You should be criticizing ideas and actions. Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 2, 2011 Report Posted December 2, 2011 The Tories are at the wheel. You don't criticize the passenger for driver errors. Let the man rest in peace. There's no reason to criticize people themselves in the first place. You should be criticizing ideas and actions. This, after all the "Harper is EVIL!" posts? Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
MiddleClassCentrist Posted December 2, 2011 Author Report Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) I try to! It's just hard when so many on this forum seem to ONLY take shots at Tories! If the NDP or Liberals were in power, you'd see more articles for people to talk about regarding things they have done. The news focuses mostly on those in power, if you haven't noticed. The government of the day makes more news than the opposition. Everything reportable regarding the opposition is in response to something the government has done. Edited December 2, 2011 by MiddleClassCentrist Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
olp1fan Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 i don't expect anything less from the brain dead party the cpc needs to be euthanized at the next election Quote
jacee Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 (edited) For Pete's Sake! The Chretien Liberals did that for over 10 years! One of the biggest was the Clarity Act! As usual, it's only wrong if a Tory does it! Unh ... No, it's wrong if any of them do it. No exceptions. Edited December 3, 2011 by jacee Quote
jacee Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 (edited) i don't expect anything less from the brain dead party the cpc needs to be euthanized at the next election So do the Liberals. They're both irretrievably corrupted by power associations with those to whom they owe feasance. In this case the HarperCons, like the HarrisCons, will be backtracking repeatedly, because the extreme ideas are just wrong. They've promised to put them forward to appease the extreme right wing but a lot of them won't survive inspection even by their own 'constituency', as we see here. The Liberals, on the other hand, always made draconian neo-lib slasher policies sound fuzzy. Edited December 3, 2011 by jacee Quote
olp1fan Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 libs havent been in power for 5 years so its time you people quit bringing them up to deflect accusations against the cons Quote
TwoDucks Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 For Pete's Sake! The Chretien Liberals did that for over 10 years! One of the biggest was the Clarity Act! As usual, it's only wrong if a Tory does it! You're like a windup doll... But you agree it's wrong. That's what people have a problem with. They were elected to power initially on the "Liberals are crooks" banner. They would be responsible government and all that, remember? So if Conservatives are just doing what Liberals do, but what Liberals do is unacceptable, that means what, exactly? Quote
Wild Bill Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 But you agree it's wrong. That's what people have a problem with. They were elected to power initially on the "Liberals are crooks" banner. They would be responsible government and all that, remember? So if Conservatives are just doing what Liberals do, but what Liberals do is unacceptable, that means what, exactly? Are you seriously equating a Defence Minister taking a ride in a military aircraft for possible personal use with the AdScam scandal of millions of dollars, only a paltry amount of which could be traced in Judge Gomery's audit? "Mommy! Mommy! I'm sorry I burnt down the house playing with matches! But that's old stuff! Didn't you see that my brother was picking his nose just now?" Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
olp1fan Posted December 3, 2011 Report Posted December 3, 2011 oh my goodness wild bill still doesnt get it!!!!!!' i doubt he ever will i think its time to give up on him Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.