Pakistan Is Not Happy

[bush_cheney2004]

As if relations with Pakistan were not bad enough, this NATO action could be the final straw:

(Reuters) - NATO helicopters and fighter jets attacked two military outposts in northwest Pakistan Saturday, killing as many as 28 troops and plunging U.S.-Pakistan relations deeper into crisis.

Pakistan retaliated by shutting down vital NATO supply routes into Afghanistan, used for sending in nearly half of the alliance's shipments by land.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/26/us-pakistan-nato-idUSTRE7AP03S20111126

[eyeball]

What, you worry?

[Shwa]

What, you worry?

With NATO on one side and India on the other, one would think Pakistan would be worrying.

[eyeball]

With NATO on one side and India on the other, one would think Pakistan would be worrying.

With the US on both NATO and India's side I'd expect the whole world to worry but, BC 2004? That just doesn't scan. This ratcheting up of tensions is just the sort of thing he seems to relish most about these events.

[bush_cheney2004]

With the US on both NATO and India's side I'd expect the whole world to worry but, BC 2004? That just doesn't scan. This ratcheting up of tensions is just the sort of thing he seems to relish most about these events.

I'm not worried either way, but President Obama has pointed the finger at Pakistan from day one. The Indians I work worth have nothing but the deepest contempt for Pakistan.

[fellowtraveller]

With NATO on one side and India on the other, one would think Pakistan would be worrying.

Neither of those are Pakistans worst enemies.

Their largest threats are internal: corruption, radical Islam, ignorance and shitty leadership.

[bush_cheney2004]

Neither of those are Pakistans worst enemies.

Their largest threats are internal: corruption, radical Islam, ignorance and shitty leadership.

Yea...pretty much...Pakistan is an excellent example of "arrested development".

[jbg]

As if relations with Pakistan were not bad enough, this NATO action could be the final straw:

(Reuters) - NATO helicopters and fighter jets attacked two military outposts in northwest Pakistan Saturday, killing as many as 28 troops and plunging U.S.-Pakistan relations deeper into crisis.

Pakistan retaliated by shutting down vital NATO supply routes into Afghanistan, used for sending in nearly half of the alliance's shipments by land.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/26/us-pakistan-nato-idUSTRE7AP03S20111126

Neither of those are Pakistans worst enemies.

Their largest threats are internal: corruption, radical Islam, ignorance and shitty leadership.

Yea...pretty much...Pakistan is an excellent example of "arrested development".

It's a sad day when political correctness lets us be pushed around by the likes of Pakistan. Back in the day the warships would have been at the ready giving a lesson in manners. Why not now, or the equivalent of the warships? Is the best we can do to beg for a U.N. Resolution?

[bush_cheney2004]

It's a sad day when political correctness lets us be pushed around by the likes of Pakistan. Back in the day the warships would have been at the ready giving a lesson in manners. Why not now, or the equivalent of the warships? Is the best we can do to beg for a U.N. Resolution?

Partially because back in the day, the warships steamed in to protect (West) Pakistan against India and its Soviet alignment. Another reason for you to hate Nixon I guess.

[jbg]

Partially because back in the day, the warships steamed in to protect (West) Pakistan against India and its Soviet alignment. Another reason for you to hate Nixon I guess.

Great decision on Nixon's part to "tilt" towards Pakistan.

[cybercoma]

It's a sad day when political correctness lets us be pushed around by the likes of Pakistan. Back in the day the warships would have been at the ready giving a lesson in manners. Why not now, or the equivalent of the warships? Is the best we can do to beg for a U.N. Resolution?

Wait a minute.... your country drops bombs in Pakistan and conducts covert military operations without their consent (Bin Laden), basically crapping all over their sovereignty and the US is being pushed around by Pakistan? Come on, jbg.

[Guest American Woman]

I'm trying to understand what happened, and it sounds as if the US/NATO killed Pakistani soldiers in error. Why wouldn't Pakistan be upset?

[bush_cheney2004]

I'm trying to understand what happened, and it sounds as if the US/NATO killed Pakistani soldiers in error. Why wouldn't Pakistan be upset?

Yes, that's the short of it, with more details to follow. How much is $10 billion in US aid since 2001 really worth?

[WWWTT]

I'm trying to understand what happened, and it sounds as if the US/NATO killed Pakistani soldiers in error. Why wouldn't Pakistan be upset?

Agreed

I'm going to assume that Pakistan has to do something symbolic to at least satisfy the radicals within the country.

WWWTT

[Guest American Woman]

Yes, that's the short of it, with more details to follow. How much is $10 billion in US aid since 2001 really worth?

I'm not sure what you're getting at; I don't think it's worth expecting Pakistan to simply dismiss the loss of lives. I don't think it means Pakistan shouldn't be upset. I can't imagine anyone not being upset under the circumstances. I do agree with WWWTT - "Pakistan has to do something symbolic to at least satisfy the radicals within the country." I understand that 'friendly fire' is an unfortunate part of war, but how much of an ally is Pakistan at this point in time - or perhaps more to the point, to what degree does Pakistan feel it's our ally? I suppose this incident may answer those questions.

[Wild Bill]

Wait a minute.... your country drops bombs in Pakistan and conducts covert military operations without their consent (Bin Laden), basically crapping all over their sovereignty and the US is being pushed around by Pakistan? Come on, jbg.

Realistically CC, Pakistan has a very fractured government with no unified stand on things in their region.

In the real world it amounts to "Thanks for the $10 billion in aid! Keep us in the loop as to what's going on! (so we can tip off the Taliban!)".

[Guest Manny]

Back in the day the warships would have been at the ready giving a lesson in manners.

So you mean after you kill a bunch of their people by "accident", and they get pissed at you, you feel the right thing to do is bomb them with naval artillery? What kind of allies are you poeple

[olp1fan]

Pakistan is NATOs enemy

With that being said NATO has to get out of the middle east

we have no reasons to be there killing people

[Topaz]

Yes, that's the short of it, with more details to follow. How much is $10 billion in US aid since 2001 really worth?

Flashback, if you are talking about Pakistan and the US coming together because of 9/11, they had no choice. Bush govt said you'll help us or we'll bury you. Pakistan has never been a friend to Pakistan and the late PM said that she held the US responsible for the killing of her father.

[Guest Manny]

Here is their symbolic response-

Pakistan demands US vacate air base after deadly strikes

"The Pakistani government has demanded the United States vacate an air base within 15 days after blaming NATO air forces for the fatal attack on military outposts in northwest Pakistan."

N we see how mauch of an ally they are.

as an alternative approach, maybeo somebody in the United States could just stand up and say, hey, we're sorry?

[olp1fan]

Yea...pretty much...Pakistan is an excellent example of "arrested development".

A tv show with two Canadian actors btw but yes I agree

It is hard to care about Pakistan when this stuff happens to them

[bush_cheney2004]

I'm not sure what you're getting at; I don't think it's worth expecting Pakistan to simply dismiss the loss of lives. I don't think it means Pakistan shouldn't be upset. I can't imagine anyone not being upset under the circumstances....

I agree, hence this thread. It's a big deal that only makes US/NATO policy for the region that much more difficult. What I am cynically suggesting is that like other incidents in the past, the price in aid will likely go up.

[Guest American Woman]

as an alternative approach, maybeo somebody in the United States could just stand up and say, hey, we're sorry?

"My most sincere and personal heartfelt condolences go out to the families and loved ones of any members of Pakistan security forces who may have been killed or injured," said Gen. John Allen, the top overall commander of U.S. and NATO forces in Afghanistan in a statement.

link

[bush_cheney2004]

.... Pakistan has never been a friend to Pakistan and the late PM said that she held the US responsible for the killing of her father.

Hmmmm...this is a confused but strangely appropriate comment. I'll just let it stand as is.

[Guest American Woman]

I agree, hence this thread. It's a big deal that only makes US/NATO policy for the region that much more difficult. What I am cynically suggesting is that like other incidents in the past, the price in aid will likely go up.

Thanks for the clarification. I see where you are coming from now, and can't say that I disagree.