August1991 Posted October 21, 2011 Report Posted October 21, 2011 Hugo Chavez, the Venezuelan leader calls Muammar Gaddafi’s killing an ‘outrage’. Hugo Chavez expressed anger over the death of Muammar Gaddafi and declared the ousted Libyan tyrant was a martyr. LinkWhat will Iran's president say? Hamas? Our union leaders? Quote
jbg Posted October 22, 2011 Report Posted October 22, 2011 Link What will Iran's president say? Hamas? Our union leaders? He's making a mistake by going there. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Shady Posted October 22, 2011 Report Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Isn't Hugo Chavez a big hero of the left, even in North America? How do they defend this type of idiocy? Edited October 22, 2011 by Shady Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Posted October 22, 2011 It's Hugo....he will soon join Gadaffy due to natural causes. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Post To The Left Posted October 24, 2011 Report Posted October 24, 2011 It's Hugo....he will soon join Gadaffy due to natural causes. Didn't you hear there is a "conspiracy" of medical professionals trying to kill him! Hugo Chavez cancer claim doctor flees VenezuelaA doctor who said Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez had only two years to live has fled the country saying he fears for his life. -- BBC 22 October 2011 "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely." -- Lord Acton Quote
olp1fan Posted October 24, 2011 Report Posted October 24, 2011 Like it or not Gadaffi was better to his people pre revolution than who will govern Libya next under Sharia Law, if I were a Libyan woman I would leave asap Quote
August1991 Posted October 24, 2011 Author Report Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) A walk down memory lane... Ceaușescu Ghaddafi Castro Ghaddafi Reagan Ghaddafi ---- Like it or not Gadaffi was better to his people pre revolution than who will governLibya next under Sharia Law, if I were a Libyan woman I would leave asap So now Progressives speak as the Americans supposedly used to speak: "He may be a sob, but he's our sob."BTW, have you ever spoken to a Libyan woman? Edited October 24, 2011 by August1991 Quote
guyser Posted October 24, 2011 Report Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) BTW, have you ever spoken to a Libyan woman? Only at the Pride Parade. oh...Libyan...sorry. Edited October 24, 2011 by guyser Quote
cybercoma Posted October 24, 2011 Report Posted October 24, 2011 Gaddhafi is a dirtbag. The problem in Libya is going to be what happens next. A commentator on a news program I was watching today made some interesting points. There is absolutely no civil society in Libya. They will need to build everything from the ground up. There are no courts--neither legal system nor infrastructure. There are no political parties. Moreover, Libya is not a homogeneous society. There are three different groups that apparently came together to fight against Italian colonialism during the interwar period. This could be a cluster... bomb. Quote
olp1fan Posted October 25, 2011 Report Posted October 25, 2011 (edited) saddam kept iraq from turning into AQ hell ... now look at it, people are too afraid to even go outside its more dangerous than it was 10 years a go you must hate reality... because libyas future looks very bleak now ---- Edited October 25, 2011 by olp1fan Quote
August1991 Posted October 25, 2011 Author Report Posted October 25, 2011 A commentator on a news program I was watching today made some interesting points. There is absolutely no civil society in Libya. They will need to build everything from the ground up. There are no courts--neither legal system nor infrastructure. There are no political parties. Moreover, Libya is not a homogeneous society. There are three different groups that apparently came together to fight against Italian colonialism during the interwar period. This could be a cluster... bomb.Civil society? The latest buzz word....Libya has about 6 million people and it sells about 500 million barrels of oil abroad every year. At $100 per barrel, that's annual revenue of about $50 billion. (Put that into the Canadian context and imagine a province receiving such an equalization payment.) IMV, Libya has no problem except how various people/factions might fight to get control of the $50 billion annual payment. Heck, it happens in Canada too so as long as the fight is peaceful, it's business as usual. Quote
ToadBrother Posted October 25, 2011 Report Posted October 25, 2011 Civil society? The latest buzz word.... Libya has about 6 million people and it sells about 500 million barrels of oil abroad every year. At $100 per barrel, that's annual revenue of about $50 billion. (Put that into the Canadian context and imagine a province receiving such an equalization payment.) IMV, Libya has no problem except how various people/factions might fight to get control of the $50 billion annual payment. Heck, it happens in Canada too so as long as the fight is peaceful, it's business as usual. Well, therein lies the rub. In a so-called civil society, or as I prefer it, a society in which the rule of law is supreme, we have enforceable mechanisms to resolve such disputes. In a place like Libya, such mechanisms do not exist, as the state was pretty much embodied in Gaddafi, and was run at his whim. For Libya to function properly is going to need not just constitutions and laws, but there is going to need to be a cultural shift by both the rulers and the ruled away from rule by fiat (or, more directly, rule by the sword) towards allowing the organs of state to take over. And that's tricky, because as so many point out, Libya is not a united state, it has various factions who have traditionally, even under Gaddafi's rule, not always been peaceable. The problem with this revolution is that it's going to raise expectations, and the NTC seems to be in overdrive raising them beyond all means. They want quick elections, even while there is no formalized constitutional or government structure. They have guns all over the damned place and dubious control all of them. While everyone had one enemy, it was pretty easy, but this is the moment where factionalism could destroy everything. Somehow everyone is going to have to agree that once a constitution is written and put to a vote, that all parties will abide by that vote and bend to the law, whatever the law may be. It's been done, to be sure, but it's a lot more difficult than the NTC seems to think. Quote
GostHacked Posted October 25, 2011 Report Posted October 25, 2011 Gaddhafi is a dirtbag. The problem in Libya is going to be what happens next. A commentator on a news program I was watching today made some interesting points. There is absolutely no civil society in Libya. They will need to build everything from the ground up. They had already accomplished that under Gadhafi. Som they actually they need to rebuild everything from the ground up .. again. There are no courts--neither legal system nor infrastructure. Correct, humanitarian bombs took care of that as well. There are no political parties. Moreover, Libya is not a homogeneous society. There are three different groups that apparently came together to fight against Italian colonialism during the interwar period. This could be a cluster... bomb. This will be a cluster bomb. Listening to the likes of Webster Tarpley, is saying the same thing we see in Iraq where the different tribes are now fighting each other, is going to be the same in Libya. Before they were not at each others throat under Saddam. For Libya, these factions unified to fight back Italy, and possibly under Gadhafi, and now, they will be pitted against each other. This to me is another example of divide and conquer. Gadhafi was not as bad as people think he is, or how our western media portrays him. It would not matter who was in power in Libya, the west wanted oil. And now we are going to get it, at their huge expense. But hey the new NTC leader is calling for Sharia Law in Libya. Now that's freedom right there folks! /sarcasm Quote
GostHacked Posted October 25, 2011 Report Posted October 25, 2011 saddam kept iraq from turning into AQ hell ... now look at it, people are too afraid to even go outside its more dangerous than it was 10 years a go you must hate reality... because libyas future looks very bleak now ---- This is my concern as well. Wherever the west has intervened under this war on terror, things have gotten worse. Iraq still faces weekly bombings (suicide, truck/car bombs, ect ect ect) and with high casualties. Afghanistan under Karzai brought Sharia Law back into the land, when the Taliban and their Sharia Law was kicked out. I do recall some neighbors of my aunt (here in ottawa) had lived in Libya during the 90s. I do recall them saying it was a very good place to live and the standards of living were comparable to that of western cultures/societies. Quote
cybercoma Posted October 25, 2011 Report Posted October 25, 2011 They didn't do that under Ghaddafi. They have no political parties, no judiciary, nothing. That's the problem right now. By the bye, I provided the link to "civil society" because I wanted people to understand that I meant the structure of social institutions that are completely missing in Libya right now. Quote
August1991 Posted October 25, 2011 Author Report Posted October 25, 2011 Well, therein lies the rub. In a so-called civil society, or as I prefer it, a society in which the rule of law is supreme, we have enforceable mechanisms to resolve such disputes. In a place like Libya, such mechanisms do not exist, as the state was pretty much embodied in Gaddafi, and was run at his whim.Thank God most of our Canadian oil is under the soil of civilised, fair-minded Albertans!Otherwise, we Canadians would face a Ghaddafi dictatorship, or a civil war of Libyan proportions. ----- TB, what's your point? Quote
Rue Posted October 28, 2011 Report Posted October 28, 2011 Thank God most of our Canadian oil is under the soil of civilised, fair-minded Albertans! Otherwise, we Canadians would face a Ghaddafi dictatorship, or a civil war of Libyan proportions. ----- TB, what's your point? maybe if you read one word at a time slowly it will work here let me space the words for you... a society in which the rule of law is supreme, we have enforceable mechanisms to resolve ...disputes. In a place like Libya, such mechanisms do not exist... .... as the state was pretty much embodied in Gaddafi, and was run at his whim. If you have any problems trying to pronounce any of the above words do let me know. Quote
jbg Posted July 23, 2012 Report Posted July 23, 2012 Link What will Iran's president say? Hamas? Our union leaders? Well Israel is far more a threat than Qadafi was or Chavez is. Both have much greater accomplishments for their people than the regime governing the Zionist entity. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
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