OCCUPY

[blueblood]

Every time politicians order police to get violent, protesters gain more public support and donation$.

Even the annoyed neighbours in NY support the protesters aims.

Occupiers have exposed the violence ordered by the state against non-violent people who rebel.

Violent corporate 'victory' is short and hollow, because the movement is stronger than any and all politicians.

Who demands it?

The profitmakers ... "venues" ... order police violence against protesters now?

That'll go over well with the public.

State violence is a huge mistake.

This is one of the best youtube videos i've seen

youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFQy5uIGZwA

you can even check out the related videos, there are a few more of his visit to OWS.

All I can say is that those kids should be protesting whatever university they went to and ask for a refund.

[Guest Derek L]

The B.C. Civil Liberties Association is urging the Occupy Vancouver protesters to peacefully and voluntarily clear out from the Vancouver Art Gallery before the city is forced to clear them out Read more: http://www.theprovince.com/news/Civil+liberty+group+urges+Occupy+Vancouver+protesters+leave+before+eviction+threat/5611438/story.html#ixzz1bwi5MVvT

Losing support?

[jacee]

From video link in Derek's link

October 25, 201 Changing his tune, the mayor says the city is negotiating with protesters to peacefully end the ongoing rally outside the Vancouver Art Gallery.

Obviously public pressure is kicking in ...

I can see reason for relocating, with a vault of art under the lawn.

But there's no stopping this.

And violence by police ordered by profiteers ??

WINNING !!!! :)

But this all raises another issue: WHO GIVES ORDERS TO THE POLICE?

Robertson has said he wants to avoid a confrontation or the possibility of violence by. issuing ultimatums or sending in the police, saying he would like to negotiate with the protesters.

Do you think perhaps the VPD has reminded the Mayor that police make their own decisions and are not subject to politicians' whims?

Edited October 27, 2011 by jacee

[blueblood]

From video link in Derek's link

October 25, 201 Changing his tune, the mayor says the city is negotiating with protesters to peacefully end the ongoing rally outside the Vancouver Art Gallery.

Obviously public pressure is kicking in ...

I can see reason for relocating, with a vault of art under the lawn.

But there's no stopping this.

And violence by police ordered by profiteers ??

WINNING !!!! :)

Here's another...

http://hotair.com/archives/2011/10/26/fun-peter-schiff-confronts-occupy-wall-street-protesters/

[capricorn]

WINNING !!!! :)

[ToadBrother]

This is one of the best youtube videos i've seen

youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFQy5uIGZwA

you can even check out the related videos, there are a few more of his visit to OWS.

All I can say is that those kids should be protesting whatever university they went to and ask for a refund.

I still can't figure out what they want.

[blueblood]

I still can't figure out what they want.

From the video it looks like the protesters want straight answers. He's giving it to them in spades.

His views on the fed might be a bit extreme, but he has the basic idea, on the capitalist system. For example he blames the whole fed institution, I blame the guys running it who enact whatever policy.

[eyeball]

I still can't figure out what they want.

What they don't want should be obvious enough, that the gap between the most powerful and wealthiest few percent at the top and everyone else should get any wider.

In fact I'm pretty sure they want that gap to close, and by a fair margin too.

[Guest Derek L]

From video link in Derek's link

October 25, 201 Changing his tune, the mayor says the city is negotiating with protesters to peacefully end the ongoing rally outside the Vancouver Art Gallery.

Obviously public pressure is kicking in ...

I can see reason for relocating, with a vault of art under the lawn.

But there's no stopping this.

And violence by police ordered by profiteers ??

WINNING !!!!

But this all raises another issue: WHO GIVES ORDERS TO THE POLICE?

Robertson has said he wants to avoid a confrontation or the possibility of violence by. issuing ultimatums or sending in the police, saying he would like to negotiate with the protesters.

Do you think perhaps the VPD has reminded the Mayor that police make their own decisions and are not subject to politicians' whims?

Well it’s obvious, the Mayor is kowtowing to the legions of Canadian Football League fans and all the events put on for families that go on over Grey Cup weekend

[seraphim]

What they don't want should be obvious enough, that the gap between the most powerful and wealthiest few percent at the top and everyone else should get any wider.

In fact I'm pretty sure they want that gap to close, and by a fair margin too.

It is a sad day when non-violent protesters are being threatened "with force" to be removed from "public places". I am a working person (full time), with disabilities and I am completely disgusted that the current government is:

IGNORING farmers in Manitoba (farmers voted in favor of keeping the wheat board)

IGNORING the pending financial storm that will inevitably hit Canada (as it has the rest of the globe already)

IGNORING major environmental issues (as in our oil extraction which causes more environmental damage)

IGNORING that several species in Canada are becoming extinct (Polar Bear, birds and other mammals)

IGNORING the cries of the environment in total

If you like it or not we are as ONE in North America, what has happened in the USA will happen in Canada! Our housing prices are out of wack and CMHC is creating a "storm" by financing homes that are going to drop.

I am not looking to become rich, I am looking to improve the standard of living for all people now if that means that there needs to be a "movable social strategy" by the power of the people then this is better than a CIVIL war between the rich and poor.

Listen to the environment, listen to the people, that is NOT something that the Progressive Conservative Government is doing instead they are doing their own thing.

Now people I do not care if you think I am a "misguided", or "impaired" for wanting "FAIRNESS" for the human race but at least I want something more than just "basic survival" for all people. We are stuck on this rock (planet) together, and if there are no significant changes on this half of the globe before the next US call in of the debt, things are going to get ugly very quickly for all of us.

BTW- If you are disabled, be sure to follow these steps so you can BUY FOOD and MEDICAL treatment for yourselves before the government takes this away too.

Click here to learn how to apply for the Disability Tax Credit-> CanadaREVIEW

[ToadBrother]

What they don't want should be obvious enough, that the gap between the most powerful and wealthiest few percent at the top and everyone else should get any wider.

In fact I'm pretty sure they want that gap to close, and by a fair margin too.

As a very general sort of statement of sentiment I can accept that's what they're saying, but it's not like they're providing any actual answers to that, or perhaps they're providing too many. Some of this sounds suspiciously like good old fashioned Marxist class warfare dressed up in fancy new clothes, but it's hard to tell because it looks to me like thousands of people ultimately demanding all manner of different things. It's a sort of ideological Tower of Babel.

[jacee]

Let's see how the police action in Oakland Calif. Is working out for the politicians...

Occupy Oakland: Mayor Jean Quan in Big Trouble After Riot

Occupy Oakland is now forever marked by a decision that could cost Oakland Mayor Jean Quan her job. Calling for the use of 500 police officers in a pre-dawn raid Tuesday morning, followed by more tear gas bombs Tuesday night, has thousands of Oaklanders upset with Quan.

...

Handa reports that the Mayor and Councilmembers received “thousands of calls in protest of the police action.”

...

And in the end, the police wracked more violence in a couple hours, destroyed more property and hurt more people that Occupy Oakland did in two weeks. Keep in mind there was no riot, no emergency, no move made by the protestors other than to refuse to leave. It was the city of Oakland and the police that initiated the violence and chose its time. Many things could have been done instead especially since there was no urgent problem.

...

All I can says is unless a better way is developed, and soon, Occupy Oakland, Occupy Wal Street, and Occupy Atlanta, and all the Occupies in America could result in the destruction of (or perhaps the transformation of) the libera base in this country It’s hard to vote for politicians that gas and shoot your friends.

[Guest Derek L]

Let's see how the police action in Oakland Calif. Is working out for the politicians...

Occupy Oakland: Mayor Jean Quan in Big Trouble After Riot

Occupy Oakland is now forever marked by a decision that could cost Oakland Mayor Jean Quan her job. Calling for the use of 500 police officers in a pre-dawn raid Tuesday morning, followed by more tear gas bombs Tuesday night, has thousands of Oaklanders upset with Quan.

...

Handa reports that the Mayor and Councilmembers received “thousands of calls in protest of the police action.”

...

And in the end, the police wracked more violence in a couple hours, destroyed more property and hurt more people that Occupy Oakland did in two weeks. Keep in mind there was no riot, no emergency, no move made by the protestors other than to refuse to leave. It was the city of Oakland and the police that initiated the violence and chose its time. Many things could have been done instead especially since there was no urgent problem.

...

All I can says is unless a better way is developed, and soon, Occupy Oakland, Occupy Wal Street, and Occupy Atlanta, and all the Occupies in America could result in the destruction of (or perhaps the transformation of) the libera base in this country It’s hard to vote for politicians that gas and shoot your friends.

Selective editing?

As I talked with Ignacio for a video coming later today, Occupy Oakland has placed liberals against liberals. Sanjiv Handa, also in a video coming later today, said it best: “This (the Occupy Oakland people) is Jean’s constituency: single mothers with kids, teachers, educators, all out there..”

Flower Power brought us Nixon.........get ready for it:

[Guest Derek L]

In the end, I’m sure most of the protestors will leave, go back to University, finish, and like the Clash, grow-up and hear their Calling

[jacee]

Occupy Oakland protesters return downtown to claim Frank Ogawa Plaza

OAKLAND -- About 1,000 people gathered peacefully Wednesday in the amphitheater in front of City Hall to discuss the mechanics for a general strike next week. After Tuesday night's violence, hundreds of Oakland residents appeared to have come out to help transform Occupy Oakland from a relatively disorganized, loose-knit movement to a broad- based community drive to implement a general strike. What the protesters are hoping for is the support of unions, teachers, students and workers to shut down the city next Wednesday"

I think the police brutality drew a lot of people out of the hills and into the streets," said Josh Chavanne, 29, a freelance Web designer. "There is nothing like a little inhumanity to turn on people's humanity."

Edited October 27, 2011 by jacee

[jacee]

Oakland Calif, where police used tear gas and rubber bullets, leaving one protester in critical condition the Mayor in trouble with the public and protesters regrouping ...

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_19197518?nclick_check=1

Hundreds of protesters responded Wednesday night by packing the amphitheater at Frank Ogawa Plaza, where they voted to hold a citywide general strike on Nov. 2, when workers and students will be urged to stay home to show support of the Occupy movement.

A grassy section of the plaza - the site of an elaborate encampment that police dismantled Tuesday morning - remained fenced off for cleaning, though not for long. By 7 p.m., the fence had been torn down as the lawn filled with protesters chanting, "Whose park? Our park!" Police officers kept their distance.

http://www.baycitizen.org/occupy-movement/story/hunt-rubber-bullets-occupy-oakland/

Officer Elon Steers, a spokesman for the California Highway Patrol's Golden Gate Division, which includes the Bay Area called rubber projectiles "a routine, non-life-threatening tool" for dispersing crowds, but said that typically only specially trained officers, such as Special Weapons And Tactics team members, carry such munitions. Oakland requested 500 officers from at least 17 agencies to help with its response to the Occupy Oakland movement, beginning with the early-morning eviction on Tuesday of the group’s two-week-old encampment at Frank H. Ogawa Plaza. Of the agencies that helped with the eviction, at least five including the Solano County Sheriff’s Office and the University of California Police Department, did not go on to participate in the response to the protest later that night. At the press conference Wednesday, Jordan said the department had opened a "level one investigation" into the injury of Scott Olsen, and Iraq war veteran, who was critically wounded during a confrontation with police Tuesday night. In a YouTube video, which shows Olsen bleeding from the head, people carrying Olsen tell the cameraman that he was shot. Jordan said the investigation would involve OPD's internal affairs, major crimes and homicide departments; the Alameda County District Attorney's office; and the federal monitor that oversees the Oakland police department

“It’s unfortunate that it happened. I wish it didn’t.

Edited October 27, 2011 by jacee

[WWWTT]

..

I don't think what you said is controversial. Many instances where violence is used and gains much attention where it otherwise wouldn't ie: terrorism, or say Columbine etc. (which was a kind of terrorism one could argue).

The problem i think, as many have noted, is there is no concrete "goal" or endgame for the protests. Even if there is violence, what is it going to achieve? Greater income equality? Greater corporate responsibility? And what does that really mean?

There is a need for an intelligent, well-spoken leader to give direction to this movement and take it away from the perception of just a bunch young idiots who don't even know what they're protesting about. It seems a waste that such a huge, potentially powerful protest movement may end up a great waste of energy with little results.

Actually so far it appears that if there is violence it would originate from the police and not the protestors.

Aswell it appears that this protest does not have a time limit!

Having one or several distinct leaders does have its disadvantages as well as advantages.

Similar protests in the past have failed to provide any signifigant gains(north america),so perhaps the people involved keeping this thing afloat are fully aware this is going to be a test of patience.

Neither one of us are actually directly involved so we can only engage in speculation and I wouldn't be so quik to dismiss the effectivness this protest may have over time.

WWWTT

[Shwa]

Similar protests in the past have failed to provide any signifigant gains(north america),so perhaps the people involved keeping this thing afloat are fully aware this is going to be a test of patience.

You must be a young'n:

Good Bye Charlie Brown

In 1985, the Mulroney government had the largest majority in federal government history. During the election, they promised not to touch seniors' programs. However, in the budget, in an effort to curb the deficit, the government proposed de-indexing the Canada Pension Plan.

This raised the ire of seniors across the country. So much so, that a protest in Ottawa was organized. In attendance was a senior named Solange Denis (d. 2004). While on Parliament Hill, she was able to confront Prime Minister Brian Mulroney and told him in person that if he de-indexed pensions, seniors would not vote for his party in the next election. It would be “Goodbye Charlie Brown.” The next election was at least 3 years away.

Many members of Mulroney’s caucus heard Mme. Denis’s warning and became nervous that they would lose their seats in the next election. These members pressured the Mulroney cabinet and the government eventually did NOT de-index pensions.

A small group of seniors were able to get the largest majority in Canadian history to change their plans.

That is just one interesting example, there are many others.

[WWWTT]

You must be a young'n:

Good Bye Charlie Brown

That is just one interesting example, there are many others.

Thankyou for this example.

However the OCCUPY protest is not about just one single piece of legislation.

Can you provide any examples along the same lines as the G20,and any protests after the Arab spring?

WWWTT

[capricorn]

The Mohawk Warriors have joined Occupy Toronto and are planning a winter long bonfire in the park "to keep hearts warm".

Brace yourselves because the city is not being occupied just by Marxists, anarchists, idealists and anti-capitalists anymore. It has taken a different turn since tucked deep into the makeshift city, the Mohawk warriors have raised their famous red, yellow and black warrior flag and have no plans of leaving anytime soon.

“It will be up to the elders to decide,” said Jason Fleury, who said he was a Mohawk from Alberta. “We we are going to ramp this up with more people arriving here.”

---

“We wouldn’t break the bylaw but Aboriginals don’t need permits for their sacred fires.”

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/10/26/bonfire-of-occupying-vanities-for-city

[blueblood]

Oakland Calif, where police used tear gas and rubber bullets, leaving one protester in critical condition the Mayor in trouble with the public and protesters regrouping ...

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_19197518?nclick_check=1

Hundreds of protesters responded Wednesday night by packing the amphitheater at Frank Ogawa Plaza, where they voted to hold a citywide general strike on Nov. 2, when workers and students will be urged to stay home to show support of the Occupy movement.

A grassy section of the plaza - the site of an elaborate encampment that police dismantled Tuesday morning - remained fenced off for cleaning, though not for long. By 7 p.m., the fence had been torn down as the lawn filled with protesters chanting, "Whose park? Our park!" Police officers kept their distance.

http://www.baycitizen.org/occupy-movement/story/hunt-rubber-bullets-occupy-oakland/

Officer Elon Steers, a spokesman for the California Highway Patrol's Golden Gate Division, which includes the Bay Area called rubber projectiles "a routine, non-life-threatening tool" for dispersing crowds, but said that typically only specially trained officers, such as Special Weapons And Tactics team members, carry such munitions. Oakland requested 500 officers from at least 17 agencies to help with its response to the Occupy Oakland movement, beginning with the early-morning eviction on Tuesday of the group’s two-week-old encampment at Frank H. Ogawa Plaza. Of the agencies that helped with the eviction, at least five including the Solano County Sheriff’s Office and the University of California Police Department, did not go on to participate in the response to the protest later that night. At the press conference Wednesday, Jordan said the department had opened a "level one investigation" into the injury of Scott Olsen, and Iraq war veteran, who was critically wounded during a confrontation with police Tuesday night. In a YouTube video, which shows Olsen bleeding from the head, people carrying Olsen tell the cameraman that he was shot. Jordan said the investigation would involve OPD's internal affairs, major crimes and homicide departments; the Alameda County District Attorney's office; and the federal monitor that oversees the Oakland police department

“It’s unfortunate that it happened. I wish it didn’t.

What no response to the videos/links of the banker giving those kids a lesson in economics? Is that crickets I hear???

[bud]

You must be a young'n:

Good Bye Charlie Brown

That is just one interesting example, there are many others.

unfortunately, in the states at least, the people know of only 2 parties and both parties have been corrupted by the lobby and special interest (corporate) groups.

without money, other parties are unable to show themselves as alternatives to the two party system.

[ToadBrother]

unfortunately, in the states at least, the people know of only 2 parties and both parties have been corrupted by the lobby and special interest (corporate) groups.

without money, other parties are unable to show themselves as alternatives to the two party system.

But I thought 99% of the people were angry. Surely, with that much anger, third parties wouldn't need to do much advertising at all.

[jacee]

What no response to the videos/links of the banker giving those kids a lesson in economics? Is that crickets I hear???

Couldn't hear him for his yelling. Want to give us a synopsis?

[cybercoma]

But I thought 99% of the people were angry. Surely, with that much anger, third parties wouldn't need to do much advertising at all.

No one ever said 99% are angry. The problem is that 99% are getting screwed and the majority of them are complacent.