GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 He should actually listen to the people and step down. Sacking the whole government won't buy it for Mubarak, not this time. Dictators seldom step down without a fight... That'd be bad if Mobarack fights via the military to stay in power... Fighting radicalizes people, when support or lack thereof from countries like the US and Canada isn't forthcoming they remember that... The military will decide the outcome of this situation one way or another... The military leadership (below Mobarack) is who the west should be looking at and talking to (if possible)... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
Jack Weber Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Dictators seldom step down without a fight... That'd be bad if Mobarack fights via the military to stay in power... Fighting radicalizes people, when support or lack thereof from countries like the US and Canada isn't forthcoming they remember that... The military will decide the outcome of this situation one way or another... The military leadership (below Mobarack) is who the west should be looking at and talking to (if possible)... This essentially squares up with my position in that there is not going to be very much democratic change in Egypt.It's either going to be a slightly kinder face of Fascistic military rule or the far worse option of Islamic theocratic rule(Islamofascism) Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
wyly Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Dictators seldom step down without a fight... That'd be bad if Mobarack fights via the military to stay in power... Fighting radicalizes people, when support or lack thereof from countries like the US and Canada isn't forthcoming they remember that... The military will decide the outcome of this situation one way or another... The military leadership (below Mobarack) is who the west should be looking at and talking to (if possible)... extremism breeds extremism..which result in Iran's radical theocracy Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 This essentially squares up with my position in that there is not going to be very much democratic change in Egypt.It's either going to be a slightly kinder face of Fascistic military rule or the far worse option of Islamic theocratic rule(Islamofascism) it's a bit premature to be predicting what type of government will be in place when it's all over... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
Jack Weber Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) it's a bit premature to be predicting what type of government will be in place when it's all over... I think it's extremely unlikely that a representative democracy is coming to Egypt any time soon... The major players in the region probably would'nt allow it to happen because the populous of Egypt might freely elect someone those major players might not be able to control... Edited January 30, 2011 by Jack Weber Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 This essentially squares up with my position in that there is not going to be very much democratic change in Egypt.It's either going to be a slightly kinder face of Fascistic military rule or the far worse option of Islamic theocratic rule(Islamofascism) I think there could be a third outcome... The military sides with Mobarak and violently puts down the revolt/protests... Because of all the resulting deaths and devestation the US withdraws it's support of Mobarak... Mobarak seeks to replace that funding by turning to other players like Iran... THAT scenario, I believe, would be the worst outcome of this... One I hope doesn't come about... As I said, the military will decide this... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
Jack Weber Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) I think there could be a third outcome... The military sides with Mobarak and violently puts down the revolt/protests... Because of all the resulting deaths and devestation the US withdraws it's support of Mobarak... Mobarak seeks to replace that funding by turning to other players like Iran... THAT scenario, I believe, would be the worst outcome of this... One I hope doesn't come about... As I said, the military will decide this... That's a very real option,although,I think that road will led to Islamofascism... Actually,it leads to 3(a) and (B )... (a)If that were to happen,and the US cut off the money tap,turning to the likes of Iran would really ratchet up things to the boiling point.I'm dubious of this for two reasons.The first is that Egypt is a predominantly Sunni nation and Iran is staunchly Shi'ite..Major differences there.Also,the ethnic angle does'nt line up,as Egypt is predominantly Arab and Iran is Persian...Major differences there... To me,a more likely scenario is along the lines of what you're thinking... ( B ) The US turns off the money tap,and Egypt turns to Saudi Arabia.It's the Saudi's that are the major funder of the radical Wahhabite sects,including the Muslim Brotherhood.Arab and Arab,Sunni and Sunni...And a major problem for Israel and the US on Israel's Western Border that could easily funnel arms into Gaza..Welcome to the battle ground of WW3. None of those are scenario's I'd like to see,but extremely probable if Mubarak decides to clamp down... Edited January 30, 2011 by Jack Weber Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 That's a very real option,although,I think that road will led to Islamofascism... Actually,it leads to 3(a) and (B )... (a)If that were to happen,and the US cut off the money tap,turning to the likes of Iran would really ratchet up things to the boiling point.I'm dubious of this for two reasons.The first is that Egypt is a predominantly Sunni nation and Iran is staunchly Shi'ite..Major differences there.Also,the ethnic angle does'nt line up,as Egypt is predominantly Arab and Iran is Persian...Major differences there... To me,a more likely scenario is along the lines of what you're thinking... ( B ) The US turns off the money tap,and Egypt turns to Saudi Arabia.It's the Saudi's that are the major funder of the radical Wahhabite sects,including the Muslim Brotherhood.Arab and Arab,Sunni and Sunni...And a major problem for Israel and the US on Israel's Western Border that could easily funnel arms into Gaza..Welcome to the battle ground of WW3. None of those are scenario's I'd like to see,but extremely probable if Mubarak decides to clamp down... No arguement... Saudi Arabi is the better fit although I wouldn't totally dismiss Iran in the equasion... In fact, I'd say, Saudi Arabia may be used by the US to provide said funding to Mobarak... Unfortunately, it's more than likely that both Mobarak and the worst elements in the Middle East realize this path also... If the Military acts against the protestors all bets are off regarding any stability in the region... The US giving Mobarak a BIG "Golden Parachute" to leave Egypt may be the only answer at this point... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
Jack Weber Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 No arguement... Saudi Arabi is the better fit although I wouldn't totally dismiss Iran in the equasion... In fact, I'd say, Saudi Arabia may be used by the US to provide said funding to Mobarak... Unfortunately, it's more than likely that both Mobarak and the worst elements in the Middle East realize this path also... If the Military acts against the protestors all bets are off regarding any stability in the region... The US giving Mobarak a BIG "Golden Parachute" to leave Egypt may be the only answer at this point... Hello Swiss bank accounts? A Mobuto Sese Seko reprise? How's that worked for the DRC in the intervening years? Fun and games...Fun and games... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
JB Globe Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 I disagree....the pathetic ones are the Egyptians themselves. Live free or die. It takes a brave, brave man to criticize folks living under a dictatorship. Remind me again - how dangerous it is to type on the internet from your mother's basement? I mean hell, you're not even talking shit to Egyptians, you're doing this on a message board where you know they won't call you out, and when they don't have internet. So, on behalf of folks like Khaled Said and others who have been silenced - go fuck yourself. Quote
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 It takes a brave, brave man to criticize folks living under a dictatorship. Remind me again - how dangerous it is to type on the internet from your mother's basement? I mean hell, you're not even talking shit to Egyptians, you're doing this on a message board where you know they won't call you out, and when they don't have internet. So, on behalf of folks like Khaled Said and others who have been silenced - go fuck yourself. Well said, but the swearing diminishes your response and isn't needed... Besides, he's a Bushy American and can't help being crase and ignorant like his idol... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 It takes a brave, brave man to criticize folks living under a dictatorship. Has nothing to do with bravery....it is my free speech right to do so....DUH! Remind me again - how dangerous it is to type on the internet from your mother's basement? My mother does not have a basement. I mean hell, you're not even talking shit to Egyptians, you're doing this on a message board where you know they won't call you out, and when they don't have internet. No...now I am "talking shit" to you...a bigger pinhead who is not so brave either. So, on behalf of folks like Khaled Said and others who have been silenced - go fuck yourself. Okay. Do you feel better now? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Hello Swiss bank accounts? A Mobuto Sese Seko reprise? How's that worked for the DRC in the intervening years? Fun and games...Fun and games... The best of bad options is still a bad option and the best option. - GWiz Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Well said, but the swearing diminishes your response and isn't needed... Besides, he's a Bushy American and can't help being crase and ignorant like his idol... No worries....even douche bags like him have a right to their opinion. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) No worries....even douche bags like him have a right to their opinion. Agreed... BTW, Name calling diminishes responses too... Edited January 30, 2011 by GWiz Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
jbg Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 I disagree....the pathetic ones are the Egyptians themselves. Live free or die. At least you know how to read New Hampshire's license plate. That much I'll give you credit for. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 At least you know how to read New Hampshire's license plate. That much I'll give you credit for. Huh? I'm curious, would you mind explaining what you mean by that? btw, pleased to meet you, I'm new here and I don't think we've met... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
jbg Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Does anyone actually expect the Palestinians, assuming they do kick the Israelis out, to have a free and democratic state? Yes. I expect it to exceed Israel's in organization, freedom and providing a good life. The whole reason that the Muslim world and Arab world experiences violence, grinding poverty and other problems is Zionism and Israel. Otherwise the whole region from Morocco down to Nigeria and accross to Pakistan would be prosperous and free. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
jbg Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) Huh? I'm curious, would you mind explaining what you mean by that? btw, pleased to meet you, I'm new here and I don't think we've met... The slogan on New Hampshire's license plate is "Live Free or Die", just as Quebec's is "Je Me Souviens" and in better days was "L'Belle Provence". Edited January 30, 2011 by jbg Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
GWiz Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 The slogan on New Hampshire's license plate is "Live Free or Die", just as Quebec's is "Je Me Souviens" and in better days was "L'Belle Provence". I see, thanks, mine is Friendly Manitoba... Licence plates or "tags" as Americans call them can tell you a lot about a person... In fact you're the only American I've met that calls them "licence plates", many Americans I've met look at you kinda funny when you call them that and don't really know what your talking about... Anyway, I liked "The Beautiful Province" (Quebec's) better too... Quote There are none so blind, deaf and dumb as those that fail to recognize, understand, and promote TRUTH...- GWiz
jbg Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 I see, thanks, mine is Friendly Manitoba... Licence plates or "tags" as Americans call them can tell you a lot about a person... In fact you're the only American I've met that calls them "licence plates", many Americans I've met look at you kinda funny when you call them that and don't really know what your talking about... Anyway, I liked "The Beautiful Province" (Quebec's) better too... Credit card slips and repair slips say "license plates". We don't mis-spell it as "licence" or mis-spell defense as "defence" either except in our Constitution. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Guest American Woman Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 Credit card slips and repair slips say "license plates". We don't mis-spell it as "licence" or mis-spell defense as "defence" either except in our Constitution. I don't know of anyone who doesn't refer to them as license plates, much less anyone who wouldn't know what someone is referring to when talking about license plates. Methinks GWiz is "yanking your chain" as he likes to call it. Quote
scribblet Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 The Egyptians are writing their own destiny now, let's hope it doesn't turn into worse than what they have now. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/crisis-in-egypt/euphoria-gives-way-to-fear-on-cairo-streets-after-protests/article1887830/ Also just heard on the news that Jordan is now on a similar path as the 'unrest' spreads there !! Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
GostHacked Posted January 30, 2011 Author Report Posted January 30, 2011 The Egyptians are writing their own destiny now, let's hope it doesn't turn into worse than what they have now. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/crisis-in-egypt/euphoria-gives-way-to-fear-on-cairo-streets-after-protests/article1887830/ Also just heard on the news that Jordan is now on a similar path as the 'unrest' spreads there !! It's happening in a few countries in the area. Egypt, Jordan, Tunisia, I've read stuff about Morocco, Algeria, Syria. I mean something big is on the horizon here. Quote
nicky10013 Posted January 30, 2011 Report Posted January 30, 2011 It's happening in a few countries in the area. Egypt, Jordan, Tunisia, I've read stuff about Morocco, Algeria, Syria. I mean something big is on the horizon here. I don't think so. Tunisia yeah, Egypt yeah but they're not connected. Isolated protests through Jordan and Morocco isn't exactly surprising. This stuff is a regular occurance in the Middle East. What's happening in Egypt is making what's happening in other countries seem that much more important. Quote
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