wyly Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 No, atheists aren't necessarily antitheists -- which is the actual belief position you are describing. And atheists are not necessarily anti-religious; it just happens that most people who join an organization based on disbelief in God and religion, are more likely to see religion as overwhelmingly harmful, than atheists who don't belong to atheist organizations. getting atheists to join an organization of atheists has to be like herding cats... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 getting atheists to join an organization of atheists has to be like herding cats... This atheist has one cat ... almost impossible. Especially when she has to go see the vet ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 You're just not my type, sweetheart. -k It's because I am black....uhh I mean old! - You really don't have a clue what type I am...the clicking of a keyboard reveals nothing about me...I actually am a very private person...and I am every good womans type..providing you not afraid of men with great power and talent - and no money to speak of... "sweet heart" ---------------------------? That phrase in that context shows arrogance and a bit of feminist eccentric institutionalization.....I would have rather been called my love....or maybe angel - or what ever...but SWEETHEART reminds me of some old lady who plays cards with the girls - who drinks whiskey....and really was never loyal to her husband but loved his pay cheaque ----in other words that aunt you could never stand but feared...as a child....... Thanks -k - you are not my type - which makes you my type....if you could type - I would hire you to do the posting and I would go off and nap...like a senile old man that I am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 It's because I am black....uhh I mean old! - You really don't have a clue what type I am...the clicking of a keyboard reveals nothing about me...I actually am a very private person...and I am every good womans type..providing you not afraid of men with great power and talent - and no money to speak of... "sweet heart" ---------------------------? Maybe you should keep a few more things private, especially since boasting about your sexual prowess has nothing to do with the thread topic! FYI, most women aren't impressed by guys claiming they are better than the men they have in their lives. You are venturing into stalker territory with this kind of talk. Thanks -k - you are not my type - which makes you my type....if you could type - I would hire you to do the posting and I would go off and nap...like a senile old man that I am. If I recall, you are offended by a response she made to you that quoted your feeble attempt to offend atheists. Why not go to the places that encourage internet dating and hookups, since this is supposed to be a discussion forum about issues. I'd rather see more women participating on this board, which sometimes looks like a sausage fest; but showing some respect for women....specifically dealing with their comments, rather than the fact that they are women, might be a good first step. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 getting atheists to join an organization of atheists has to be like herding cats... The problem is that after you get past not believing in God, it's difficult to find common ground. Even secular humanist organizations like C.F.I. - which have a set of philosophical principles as a base, still can have widely divergent views on how to deal with believers, how society and government should be run....everything from socialists to anarcho-capitalists. One guy I used to converse with at meetups was a young engineer who happened to be a huge fan of Frederich Nietzsche....and refreshing my memory by going over Nietzsche's ideas, I found that I am even more averse to his take on the world than I was when I read about him 30 years earlier. When it comes to religious institutions; they can be caught up in controversies that split them apart, but for the most part, they have generally accepted dogma and doctrines that provide some unity to keep the group together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Why do they even need to spend money to advertise at all? Because they believe the world would be a better place without religions. Seems like money well spent to me! All they have to do is just ignore all religions. If only that were true... Unfortunately, we have (so-called) leaders that allow religious dogma to influence their decision making in what is supposed to be a secular society. This needs to be pushed back against. To fund-raise and to advertise as a collective group clearly indicate that an atheist is now no longer just a description of someone who don't believe in the existence of God.....but clearlyt is a group believing in the non-existence of God. It is another "religion. Not at all. Your definition of "religion" is incorrect. "a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny; an institution to express belief in a divine power; " Atheism doesn't meet the definition of the term religion. If anything, it is more akin to a political movement than it is to a religion. "a group of people working together to achieve a political goal" THe political goal being the removal of religion as an influence in the political sphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 If I recall, you are offended by a response she made to you that quoted your feeble attempt to offend atheists. Why not go to the places that encourage internet dating and hookups, since this is supposed to be a discussion forum about issues. I'd rather see more women participating on this board, which sometimes looks like a sausage fest; but showing some respect for women....specifically dealing with their comments, rather than the fact that they are women, might be a good first step. Clearly you have this board all wrong. It is all about old dudes trying to pick kimmy up, the politics is secondary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Clearly you have this board all wrong. It is all about old dudes trying to pick kimmy up, the politics is secondary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) For all we know Kimmy is an old dude too. Ya gotta be careful hitting on folks on the internet. Edited January 14, 2011 by dre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 The problem is that after you get past not believing in God, it's difficult to find common ground. Even secular humanist organizations like C.F.I. - which have a set of philosophical principles as a base, still can have widely divergent views on how to deal with believers, how society and government should be run....everything from socialists to anarcho-capitalists. One guy I used to converse with at meetups was a young engineer who happened to be a huge fan of Frederich Nietzsche....and refreshing my memory by going over Nietzsche's ideas, I found that I am even more averse to his take on the world than I was when I read about him 30 years earlier. When it comes to religious institutions; they can be caught up in controversies that split them apart, but for the most part, they have generally accepted dogma and doctrines that provide some unity to keep the group together. well that makes sense other than being atheists there is nothing to bind us together, the only thing we have in common is we have nothing in common (if that makes any sense)...we're a herd of cats each minding his/her own business and trying to figure out how to get religious folk to do the same... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 For all we know Kimmy is an old dude too. Ya gotta be careful hitting on folks on the internet. Kimmy could be a crossdressing transexual whose real name is Karl... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Maybe you should keep a few more things private, especially since boasting about your sexual prowess has nothing to do with the thread topic! FYI, most women aren't impressed by guys claiming they are better than the men they have in their lives. You are venturing into stalker territory with this kind of talk. I thought it was quite interesting that proclaiming his sexual prowess was the first thing out of his mouth when he felt threatened. If I recall, you are offended by a response she made to you that quoted your feeble attempt to offend atheists. Why not go to the places that encourage internet dating and hookups, since this is supposed to be a discussion forum about issues. I'd rather see more women participating on this board, which sometimes looks like a sausage fest; but showing some respect for women....specifically dealing with their comments, rather than the fact that they are women, might be a good first step. I appreciate the sentiment. I just hope nobody here is under the impression that Oleg has me upset or offended or anything like that. He's of no concern at all to me. Usually I would ignore him, but sometimes you gotta give the ant-farm a shake. Y'know? For all we know Kimmy is an old dude too. Ya gotta be careful hitting on folks on the internet. Who really knows who's who on the internet? But I can promise this much: I would never ever date any of you kooks anyway. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 I thought it was quite interesting that proclaiming his sexual prowess was the first thing out of his mouth when he felt threatened. I hope it's not what he uses as a pickup line! I appreciate the sentiment. I just hope nobody here is under the impression that Oleg has me upset or offended or anything like that. He's of no concern at all to me. Usually I would ignore him, but sometimes you gotta give the ant-farm a shake. Y'know? I figured you're not easily phased by that kind of talk, but it gets on my nerves that he seems to feel the need to derail threads like this. It's the same thing every time. Who really knows who's who on the internet? But I can promise this much: I would never ever date any of you kooks anyway. A few others have covered this point also. You never know who you're talking to....for all we know bush_cheney may be either the real Bush or the real Cheney.....more likely the latter I suppose. I used to have jpeg sent to me in an email titled: "your internet dream girl".....which of course featured some dirty, scruffy old guy with a beard, sitting at the keyboard, naked from the waist up. That picture could be more effective than warning labels on cigarette packages! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 A few others have covered this point also. You never know who you're talking to....for all we know bush_cheney may be either the real Bush or the real Cheney.....more likely the latter I suppose. I like to imagine him as the former VP, on our little message board sharing his wit and insight. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 Because they believe the world would be a better place without religions. Seems like money well spent to me! Many churches advertise. If people "of faith" see fit to promote their vision of the world, why shouldn't others? Not at all. Your definition of "religion" is incorrect. "a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny; an institution to express belief in a divine power; " Atheism doesn't meet the definition of the term religion. If anything, it is more akin to a political movement than it is to a religion. "a group of people working together to achieve a political goal" THe political goal being the removal of religion as an influence in the political sphere. I know lots of atheists, and none are actually dedicated to that goal (or any other common political cause that I'm aware of.) But the rest, I agree with. Some atheists hold a strong belief that there is no god, which might be argued to be an unprovable position resulting from faith, but I'm not sure that that's adequate to meet the requirements of a religion. The problem is that after you get past not believing in God, it's difficult to find common ground. I've written before that I think people are hard-wired to find common causes, because it's how we survived as a species. Early on the common cause was the survival of one's family unit or tribe... but with survival no longer a day to day struggle, other things have taken that place in peoples' lives. Religion and nationalism. I think that when tens of thousands of people march into a football stadium wearing giant foam cheese wedges on their heads, their shared identity and shared desire for a specific outcome is something that provides something almost spiritual for them. I've written that I think conspiracy theories fill the same sort of role for some people. I haven't read the book, but this concept sounds like what I'm getting at. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted January 16, 2011 Report Share Posted January 16, 2011 Kimmy could be a crossdressing transexual whose real name is Karl... Would'nt that be "Karlita"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted January 16, 2011 Report Share Posted January 16, 2011 Who really knows who's who on the internet? But I can promise this much: I would never ever date any of you kooks anyway. -k Dating is out of the question,of course,because I'm married... However,you and I could have some interesting conversations about Boxing and Whiskey... Most likely ending up with us lacing up the gloves and trying to beat the crap out of each other in a semi drunken stupor!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted January 16, 2011 Report Share Posted January 16, 2011 Would'nt that be "Karlita"? ya it could...and I knew a guy in highschool named Kim...and he was into matial arts and boxing, KIM? KIMMY? ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted January 16, 2011 Report Share Posted January 16, 2011 Dating is out of the question,of course,because I'm married... However,you and I could have some interesting conversations about Boxing and Whiskey... Most likely ending up with us lacing up the gloves and trying to beat the crap out of each other in a semi drunken stupor!!! I'm married too. Well, not married married...no ceremony or marriage documents were signed. But we're married anyway, as far as I can figure. (16 years counts, is all I'm sayin'.....) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 16, 2011 Report Share Posted January 16, 2011 I've written before that I think people are hard-wired to find common causes, because it's how we survived as a species. Early on the common cause was the survival of one's family unit or tribe... but with survival no longer a day to day struggle, other things have taken that place in peoples' lives. Religion and nationalism. I think that when tens of thousands of people march into a football stadium wearing giant foam cheese wedges on their heads, their shared identity and shared desire for a specific outcome is something that provides something almost spiritual for them. I've written that I think conspiracy theories fill the same sort of role for some people. I haven't read the book, but this concept sounds like what I'm getting at. -k Interesting! Although when I think of the sports analogy, I get the feeling that some of us are more hard-wired to find common cause and rally round the flag than others. Maybe this is why I've never been a rabid sports fan. I would get more enthused about my hometown winning the Grey Cup, or the Leafs winning the Stanley Cup, if the players actually came from the local area. What does it mean now to win? Our Russians are better than your Russians! I think this may be part of the reason why Junior A Hockey died in a lot of markets. Back in the 60's, the six NHL clubs all had their own Junior A farm clubs, that sported identical uniforms as the pros, and the best players were drafted by those teams. So, in Niagara Falls, most of the city were Boston Bruin fans, because so many of the players (except Bobby Orr) came from the Junior A Flyers. We watched the best of them like: Derek Sanderson, Bill Goldsworthy, Don Marcotte, Jim Lorentz, Steve Atkinson, and maybe a few others, play for the Bruins; and even if they were traded off to other teams, the connection between Niagara Falls and Boston stuck. After the farm club system of organizing Junior A was dropped, many fans started losing interest in the local Junior club. I guess the Granfalloon instinct wasn't strong enough to carry on afterwards for minor hockey in the Niagara Peninsula. I guess the worst Granfalloon cult we have with us these days is nationalism, since some people can be motivated by appeals to patriotism by demagogues who want to build empires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 Maybe you should keep a few more things private, especially since boasting about your sexual prowess has nothing to do with the thread topic! FYI, most women aren't impressed by guys claiming they are better than the men they have in their lives. You are venturing into stalker territory with this kind of talk. If I recall, you are offended by a response she made to you that quoted your feeble attempt to offend atheists. Why not go to the places that encourage internet dating and hookups, since this is supposed to be a discussion forum about issues. I'd rather see more women participating on this board, which sometimes looks like a sausage fest; but showing some respect for women....specifically dealing with their comments, rather than the fact that they are women, might be a good first step. What are you talking about "venturing int stalker territory" - this is the web with a bunch of people I will never met or care to meet - are you some sort of trouble maker or set up artist...talking your stero-typical electronic stalker stuff and shove it... I was not claiming to be better - I was simply stating the fact that I love woman and have had a lot in my love - I respect them dearly...as for prowess - that's a term that YOU use... NOW for the privacey factor _ I don't publish secretly - everyone knows my real name and where I live...frankly...I grew up in a family that was open - the only thing that should be keep private are finacial affairs - IF you have to be private - then you should not be doinging it..... It is you that have no respect for woman - or men for that matter - I have never had a problem with -k .........some how you interjected like a jerk - mind your own business... The problem these days is that men really don't like their mothers or woman in general - they just parrot the appropriate things - I adore the female - I believe they are the greatest creation on the face of the earth and a great joy ---------Perhaps you should stop looking at them as objects and you might fair better.....suddenly I am bore with this sight.............as for atheists....who mimic God...I have about as much respect for them as dishonourable gay people who MIMIC females.... And for future reference it is YOU that has a tendency to stalk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 as for atheists....who mimic God...I have about as much respect for them as dishonourable gay people who MIMIC females.... You wouldn't recognize the majority of gay men as gay if you were to meet them. (Which, by the way, I guarantee you have...met gay men without knowing they're gay.) Similarly, lots of straight men are what we often terrm "effeminate," and yet I don't believe they're trying to mimic anything. Don't worry so much about an appearance of the feminine. It's not an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 You wouldn't recognize the majority of gay men as gay if you were to meet them. (Which, by the way, I guarantee you have...met gay men without knowing they're gay.) Similarly, lots of straight men are what we often terrm "effeminate," and yet I don't believe they're trying to mimic anything. Don't worry so much about an appearance of the feminine. It's not an issue. Yup, this guy I worked with at this one call center was gay and I never knew it. He did not act like your stereotypical gay man. He was a man, a gay man's man. Whoever was his partner was definitely wore the skirt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Squid Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) Many churches advertise. If people "of faith" see fit to promote their vision of the world, why shouldn't others? Absolutely. Free speech and all that... I know lots of atheists, and none are actually dedicated to that goal (or any other common political cause that I'm aware of.) But the rest, I agree with. Perhaps you are correct.... maybe it is such a disparate group that it can't be called a political movement either. It certainly doesn't fit the definition of a "religion", despite the claims of many theists. Some atheists hold a strong belief that there is no god, which might be argued to be an unprovable position resulting from faith, but I'm not sure that that's adequate to meet the requirements of a religion. Someone who fervently doesn't believe in the supernatural is decidedly non-religious. Non-belief cannot be a religion by definition. I've written before that I think people are hard-wired to find common causes, because it's how we survived as a species. Early on the common cause was the survival of one's family unit or tribe... but with survival no longer a day to day struggle, other things have taken that place in peoples' lives. Religion and nationalism. I think that when tens of thousands of people march into a football stadium wearing giant foam cheese wedges on their heads, their shared identity and shared desire for a specific outcome is something that provides something almost spiritual for them. I've written that I think conspiracy theories fill the same sort of role for some people. Perhaps.... but I believe that before religion, while humans were still in "survival mode" there was something very similar to religion.... superstition. Fear of the unknown would have been an ever-present concept. Creating myths about lightening, earthquakes, death... any natural phenomenon that couldn't be explained and that was potentially harmful (or not). These superstitions probably morphed in to religion and it has evolved from there. I like Hitchens' (I think that's where I heard it) concept of why we survived for so long and why we looked out for each other long before there was ever a religious set of morals... empathy. We (most of us) are hard-wired (evolved) to feel empathy. Empathy helps us as a species because it allows us to to care for our neighbour and vice versa. Interesting, but a bit of a rambling, article on the evolution of empathy. http://www.sharpbrains.com/blog/2010/02/02/the-evolution-of-empathy/ Edited January 18, 2011 by The_Squid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 18, 2011 Report Share Posted January 18, 2011 What are you talking about "venturing int stalker territory" - this is the web with a bunch of people I will never met or care to meet - are you some sort of trouble maker or set up artist...talking your stero-typical electronic stalker stuff and shove it... I was not claiming to be better - I was simply stating the fact that I love woman and have had a lot in my love - I respect them dearly...as for prowess - that's a term that YOU use... So, how did that end up with bragging about your cock, and saying that you could satisfy her better than her husband or boyfriend etc.. That does not sound like love to me, or respect for women for that matter; it sounds like the only way you can deal with women is for sexual purposes. NOW for the privacey factor _ I don't publish secretly - everyone knows my real name and where I live...frankly...I grew up in a family that was open - the only thing that should be keep private are finacial affairs - IF you have to be private - then you should not be doinging it..... And I don't share my personal information online. I quit Facebook for this reason. But, even anonymously, there are some things that should be discussed privately, rather than blabbed for everyone else who can't get away, to have to put up with. It is you that have no respect for woman - or men for that matter - I have never had a problem with -k .........some how you interjected like a jerk - mind your own business... You mean that when you're talking to guys, you brag about the size of your cock too? You weren't having a private conversation in case you're not aware -- you posted right here for all to see, so don't go making some bullshit argument about violating your privacy. You could have sent an IM or an email or something, if you were having a private chat. The problem these days is that men really don't like their mothers or woman in general - they just parrot the appropriate things - I adore the female - I believe they are the greatest creation on the face of the earth and a great joy ---------Perhaps you should stop looking at them as objects and you might fair better.....suddenly I am bore with this sight.............as for atheists....who mimic God...I have about as much respect for them as dishonourable gay people who MIMIC females.... Thanks for noticing that the thread topic was atheists! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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