Ontario Auto insurance

[Alta4ever]

We always have had that system. They simply added more steps in the ladder. I know, this is part of your usual 'sanity of Alberta' in the middle of a really insane country argument, but I don't buy it. On avreage, Manitobans pay less for more. You can compare single models all day. That's irrelivant, and I'm done discussing this with you. You can keep your system, we'll keep our's.

You have only one model of auto insurance private we have only one model public, so ya we are comparing single models. The fact is you lose you have got nothing, as was said before your piece of sh_t study isn't worth the time or money invested.

Actually you have not always had that system it was based on merits/demarits the model grid is new, hence its being called the NEW Driver Safety Rating or was the new on the MPI website lost on you

[Alta4ever]

I know, this is part of your usual 'sanity of Alberta' in the middle of a really insane country argument, but I don't buy it.

I think you just upset because the two online tools you used to try and prove me wrong have in fact proved you wrong. Thanks for bringing Kanetix and the MPI website quote tool into the argument, they are providing the rates that have proved you so wrong.

The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is.

Winston Churchill

Edited August 27, 2010 by Alta4ever

[Bonam]

Bonam you aren't just paying to cover damage to the car, you are paying so that if you or someone elese is injured that you don't end up living you life in absolute squaller. Have you ever though about what you earning potential is for the rest of your life? What if all that is taken away tomorrow because some one t-boned you at an intersection? You aren't just buying insurance to cover your car, its to cover you and your mistakes.

Yes, I realize all that, and I still think $2600+ per year is way too much to pay for that. Look, on average, you are always gonna lose money by being insured compared to not being insured. That's how insurance companies make money. They charge premiums, and then if you have claims cover your costs. The money that comes in has to be more than the claims they pay out, much more, because they also have to pay employee salaries, build and maintain office buildings, hire lawyers, and (if private) generate some profit. So over the course of your life you are very likely to pay more in insurance premiums than you collect in claims from the insurance company. This applies to any kind of insurance. Thus, my general philosophy is that I'd much rather self-insure: save money yourself to get you through life's rough spots. Many people lack the self-discipline for this and just spend money and thus benefit from the safety net of having insurance, but for those that are more reserved, insurance is a net money drain that offers little value.

So, when it comes to car insurance, I'd much rather just get the minimum allowable by law and keep more money in the bank.

As for your scenario of being disabled and unable to work for the rest of your life and thus living in squalor as a result... first: no realistic insurance payout is gonna sustain you for most of your life, second: in Canada, the government will pay for your medical expenses, disability allowance, pension, welfare, etc, anyway, and third: your life is gonna suck anyway if that happens.

[Alta4ever]

As for your scenario of being disabled and unable to work for the rest of your life and thus living in squalor as a result... first: no realistic insurance payout is gonna sustain you for most of your life, second: in Canada, the government will pay for your medical expenses, disability allowance, pension, welfare, etc, anyway, and third: your life is gonna suck anyway if that happens.

A liability payout will if you go to court and sue for it, accident benefits will not.

The prices is where it is because of claims frequency and severity.

[Bryan]

I think you just upset because the two online tools you used to try and prove me wrong have in fact proved you wrong. Thanks for bringing Kanetix and the MPI website quote tool into the argument, they are providing the rates that have proved you so wrong.

Kanetix is the site that I quoted to you first, the one that came back with significantly higher rates than what I'm paying here for all three of my cars. You told me they were unreliable, but now they're all you've got? Do have another site I can try? I'm more than willing to concede your point, if you ever actually get around to making one.

[Alta4ever]

Kanetix is the site that I quoted to you first, the one that came back with significantly higher rates than what I'm paying here for all three of my cars. You told me they were unreliable, but now they're all you've got? Do have another site I can try? I'm more than willing to concede your point, if you ever actually get around to making one.

My point is call a broker.

[Topaz]

As far as I can see it just another reason to vote the Libs out! Why would any party bring this into law when an election is so close?? All Ontario drivers are going to have pay more just to get what they have now and the 50,000, isn't worth the paper it was wrttien on. Again the Insurance companies and the province screw drivers again.

[BubberMiley]

I pay $1200 a year to insure my Toyota SUV and I'm getting a 45% rebate this year.

So it will be around $700.

That's about $60 a month.

I love public insurance in Manitoba.

[guyser]

I pay $1200 a year to insure my Toyota SUV and I'm getting a 45% rebate this year.

So it will be around $700.

That's about $60 a month.

I love public insurance in Manitoba.

Dont move to Toronto....might be just a tad more than $60 a month

[Moonlight Graham]

My driver rating went up this year, but so did my insurance! It went up $150 from last year. BAH!

[Bryan]

My point is call a broker.

Will your broker get you a 45% year end refund if the insurance company makes larger than expected profits?

http://www.winnipegsun.com/news/manitoba/2011/04/01/17832831.html

Drivers will be getting an average of $450 each back from Manitoba Public Insurance, the result of a surplus that’s been building up since 1994 and is no longer needed.

“The money should be returned to ratepayers, we hope by the end of May. It may be early June,” said Dan Guimond, vice-president of strategy and innovation at MPI.

The rebate will be 45% of your 2009-10 basic Autopac premium

[guyser]

Will your broker get you a 45% year end refund if the insurance company makes larger than expected profits?

Appears that way.

[Tilter]

I lived in BC for 10 years, continuously paying MORE to insure with a compulsory public ONLY alternative to private insurance.

I moved back to Ontario and [paid about 25% less for better coverage.

I guess the privately owned insurers realized that they weren't reaming the public enuf and so, with the blessings of our McPremier, lowered the coverage for a more costly product. I guess this is OK except that I find it quite painful to sit down

[Oleg Bach]

There should be a non profit public option for EVERYTHING that the government creates a legal requirement for. Otherwise price gouging is guaranteed.

Auto ensurance is a tax..it is a shifty arrangement between the corporations and their governmental friends. A tax should only be used when the proceeds go into the public purse - not the private purse.

[blueblood]

Appears that way.

Its pretty easy to do that with a govt insurance which can undercut any competition on the taxpayer's dollar or in manitobas case, alta and ontarios tax dollar.

Is the insurance company you work for publically traded?

[Bryan]

Its pretty easy to do that with a govt insurance which can undercut any competition on the taxpayer's dollar or in manitobas case, alta and ontarios tax dollar.

Is the insurance company you work for publically traded?

They don't receive tax money. Their entire budget is from insurance premiums. Those premiums are already lower than what you can get privately, AND we the rate payers get a refund when the company shows a profit. I'll openly admit that in the abstract at least I'm no fan of scoialism, but in practice I'm really happy that we have MPIC here, especially compared to what they have in Ontario.

[blueblood]

They don't receive tax money. Their entire budget is from insurance premiums. Those premiums are already lower than what you can get privately, AND we the rate payers get a refund when the company shows a profit. I'll openly admit that in the abstract at least I'm no fan of scoialism, but in practice I'm really happy that we have MPIC here, especially compared to what they have in Ontario.

A private company can't compete against a crown corp in the insurance business. The crown corp has the backing of the taxpayer and can run at a loss if need be.

[Smallc]

A private company can't compete against a crown corp in the insurance business. The crown corp has the backing of the taxpayer and can run at a loss if need be.

No, it can't. You don't know what you're talking about. MPI is regulated by a board that determines what it has to make to be self sufficient and to be ready for emergencies. The difference is, MPI doesn't get to keep huge profits from premium levels that they never should have charged.

[guyser]

Its pretty easy to do that with a govt insurance which can undercut any competition on the taxpayer's dollar or in manitobas case, alta and ontarios tax dollar.

Is the insurance company you work for publically traded?

I do not work for an insurance company. I am a broker repping many (20+) companies.Some of those are, some of those aren't

Edited April 4, 2011 by guyser

[guyser]

Those premiums are already lower than what you can get privately, AND we the rate payers get a refund when the company shows a profit. I'll openly admit that in the abstract at least I'm no fan of scoialism, but in practice I'm really happy that we have MPIC here, especially compared to what they have in Ontario.

Bryan, I wouldnt be so quick to sluff off Ontario.

Really, you get what you pay for.

MPIC does not release costs on an average claim basis despite being 'public 'company. MPIC also is vastly different in that there is no ability to sue for pain and suffering, and has a cap on injuries at $2500 (IIRC)

Couple that with a vastly reduced population and concentration of drivers and you automotaically get lower costs.

Ontario pays the hisghest claims followed by Alta then BC. One of those is the public insurer.

$10800,$6110,$2900, respectively.

If you never need to claim, great , enjoy the savings, but remember you are much more on your own should the proverbial s*** hit the fan.

[Smallc]

and has a cap on injuries at $2500 (IIRC)

I don't think that's correct.

[BubberMiley]

I don't think that's correct.

You're right. It isn't even close to correct.

http://www.mpi.mb.ca/english/claims/PIPP/benefits.html

[blueblood]

Bryan, I wouldnt be so quick to sluff off Ontario.

Really, you get what you pay for.

MPIC does not release costs on an average claim basis despite being 'public 'company. MPIC also is vastly different in that there is no ability to sue for pain and suffering, and has a cap on injuries at $2500 (IIRC)

Couple that with a vastly reduced population and concentration of drivers and you automotaically get lower costs.

Ontario pays the hisghest claims followed by Alta then BC. One of those is the public insurer.

$10800,$6110,$2900, respectively.

If you never need to claim, great , enjoy the savings, but remember you are much more on your own should the proverbial s*** hit the fan.

Couple that when there are a great deal of grain farms and their fleet of vehicles. That's every trailer and every size of truck. And then the toys on top of it.

Smallc, let's say the provincial govt got into the gas retail business and decided that a 1% profit margin was good enough and would pay out the potential profits to customers. I don't think there would be many gas stations owned by regular people around anymore. The same goes for the insurance industry.

My beef with the public insurance is that I can't hedge my insurance bill by being a shareholder. Yah 500 bucks for 17 years is nice and everything, but so is an appreciating stock, especially one that pays dividends

[guyser]

You're right. It isn't even close to correct.

http://www.mpi.mb.ca/english/claims/PIPP/benefits.html

Apologies, I misread my own source. That is for the Atlantic Provinces.....its kid of worse for Manitoba, no ability to sue for pain and suffering.

[guyser]

Couple that when there are a great deal of grain farms and their fleet of vehicles. That's every trailer and every size of truck. And then the toys on top of it.

Huh?

Smallc, let's say the provincial govt got into the gas retail business and decided that a 1% profit margin was good enough and would pay out the potential profits to customers. I don't think there would be many gas stations owned by regular people around anymore. The same goes for the insurance industry.

From what i understand (heresay?) I dont think they make more than that.