Dudley Georges Benediction

[charter.rights]

Looks like protest works. The final step in turning Ipperwash Park over to Kettle and Stoney Pointers.

Ontario poised to hand disputed park land back 14 years after rally death

"More than 14 years after native protester Dudley George was killed by police during a confrontation over disputed land, Ontario is poised to take the final legislative step in relinquishing control of Ipperwash Provincial Park, The Canadian Press has learned."

One down. Many more to go.

[Mr.Canada]

Mr. George got what he had coming from everything I've read. He was drunk and perpetuating violence against our fine police officers. What did he expect? A pat on the head?

One person cannot attack another person no matter what. This is just more of the same old crap we always see from these minorities. Why not me? Why not me? Look at me, Look at me. Gimme, Gimme, Gimme.

I pass through the mohawk territory north of Toronto every time I go to my cottage. This year I'm going to stop.

In my opinion the natives should consider themselves lucky that we chose to work with our natives and not exterminate them like they did in the USA. You can barely find any natives in the US compared to Canada.

This is the thanks we get for not exterminating them?

High crime rates in cities and areas where the natives are in the majority. Just look at Winnipeg or any major Prarie city, the place is a mess. High % of drug addiction, high % of suicides, high % of crime.

What are the band leaders doing about these problems? Oh let me guess. It's the white mans fault they commit crime, kill themselves and huff glue, how silly of me.

[Shwa]

In my opinion the natives should consider themselves lucky that we chose to work with our natives and not exterminate them like they did in the USA. You can barely find any natives in the US compared to Canada.

Ok, so now you have removed all doubt.

[Topaz]

Hey Mr. Canada, are you Mike Harris by chance? Sounds like him!

[PIK]

Dudley george did not have a gun, how stupid to you think people are. Keep pushing, evenetually we will push back.

Edited March 2, 2010 by PIK

[Wild Bill]

Dudley george did not have a gun, how stupid to you think people are. Keep pushing, evenetually we will push back.

Actually, people are pretty stupid if they think that proving he did not have a gun after the fact means anything. What was important was whether the OPP had sufficient reason to THINK he had a gun during the protest!

When the OPP showed up they had to assume that there was a possibility that some protesters were armed. Remember, this was only a few years after the protest at Oka, where we saw Warriors like Lasagna walking around carrying AK-47s. An OPP police officer would have to be even stupider than the average politician of ANY party to not consider that this protest would be similarly dangerous. After Oka no one will ever be 100% sure native protesters are unarmed again. As Mr. Spock would say: "Logic dictates..."

It's dark and you're facing a noisy crowd that may have the ability to fire a gun at you. Despite your training (or perhaps because you never got enough of it for that situation) you are afraid for your own life. All it takes is one good quick scare and somebody fires his weapon. To say afterwards that the officer had no reason to be afraid is a rather lame-ass observation, especially for someone who may never have been in such a situation.

I am NOT claiming that this justifies the OPP officer shooting Mr. George! I'm simply saying that there are reasons for the tragedy other than just "Mike Harris told them to shoot all the natives 'cuz they're all really racists, eh!"

Sure...and they were supposed to poison the drinking water a la Walkerton while they were at it.

When both sides are boneheads there's not much hope of things being resolved.

Edited March 2, 2010 by Wild Bill

[Guest TrueMetis]

This is the thanks we get for not exterminating them?

What the hell is wrong with you?

Would you thank me for not burning down you house?

[charter.rights]

Actually, people are pretty stupid if they think that proving he did not have a gun after the fact means anything. What was important was whether the OPP had sufficient reason to THINK he had a gun during the protest!

When the OPP showed up they had to assume that there was a possibility that some protesters were armed. Remember, this was only a few years after the protest at Oka, where we saw Warriors like Lasagna walking around carrying AK-47s. An OPP police officer would have to be even stupider than the average politician of ANY party to not consider that this protest would be similarly dangerous. After Oka no one will ever be 100% sure native protesters are unarmed again. As Mr. Spock would say: "Logic dictates..."

It's dark and you're facing a noisy crowd that may have the ability to fire a gun at you. Despite your training (or perhaps because you never got enough of it for that situation) you are afraid for your own life. All it takes is one good quick scare and somebody fires his weapon. To say afterwards that the officer had no reason to be afraid is a rather lame-ass observation, especially for someone who may never have been in such a situation.

I am NOT claiming that this justifies the OPP officer shooting Mr. George! I'm simply saying that there are reasons for the tragedy other than just "Mike Harris told them to shoot all the natives 'cuz they're all really racists, eh!"

Sure...and they were supposed to poison the drinking water a la Walkerton while they were at it.

When both sides are boneheads there's not much hope of things being resolved.

Geez. Even when the truth comes out there are people who still try to justify the murder of Dudley George. Call it what you want. You are apologizing for the crimes committed by the OPP.

Dudley George WAS murdered. He had no gun. And the OPP tried to cover it up. So says the court and the Ipperwash Inquiry.

Oka. Yup there's another one you know nothing about. The armed warriors did not show up until after the Surete du Quebec tried to bust in and beat people up. It was meeting force with force. Funny thing too. 25 Mohawk Warriors held off over 2500 troups. Interesting odds considering that only a cop was killed on that one and no one has been held accountable....especially since he was shot in the back while facing the warriors.

[M.Dancer]

The armed warriors did not show up until after the Surete du Quebec tried to bust in and beat people up. It was meeting force with force. Funny thing too. 25 Mohawk Warriors held off over 2500 troups. Interesting odds considering that only a cop was killed on that one and no one has been held accountable....especially since he was shot in the back while facing the warriors.

If there were no armed thugs there prior, then the surete would have been able bust in. Logic dictates this.

Furthermore, they did not hold off 2500 troops. the government held them off...in fact the troops penetrated the thugs lines at will and took prisoners the sentrys that they had left.

Which indeed, was a funny thing.

[charter.rights]

If there were no armed thugs there prior, then the surete would have been able bust in. Logic dictates this.

Furthermore, they did not hold off 2500 troops. the government held them off...in fact the troops penetrated the thugs lines at will and took prisoners the sentrys that they had left.

Which indeed, was a funny thing.

There were only women, children and old people....just the same at Caledonia. The Surete started to move, and the community responded by flooding the site - more than the Surete expected. When they started hiding in the woods, grabbing and beating protesters ONLY THEN did the Mohawk Warriors show up.

25 against 2500. The government was scared shitless. The Warriors won again.

[Jack Weber]

What the hell is wrong with you?

Would you thank me for not burning down you house?

He's a hillbilly from the sticks who thinks only might(and white) makes right.

[bloodyminded]

Mr. George got what he had coming from everything I've read. He was drunk and perpetuating violence against our fine police officers. What did he expect? A pat on the head?

One person cannot attack another person no matter what. This is just more of the same old crap we always see from these minorities. Why not me? Why not me? Look at me, Look at me. Gimme, Gimme, Gimme.

I pass through the mohawk territory north of Toronto every time I go to my cottage. This year I'm going to stop.

In my opinion the natives should consider themselves lucky that we chose to work with our natives and not exterminate them like they did in the USA. You can barely find any natives in the US compared to Canada.

This is the thanks we get for not exterminating them?

Ha!

So now the Native people owe us--owe us big time--for "not exterminating them."

Beautiful.

[bloodyminded]

What the hell is wrong with you?

Would you thank me for not burning down you house?

Yes, evidently you are a moral giant because you didn't burn down his house; or to be more accurate, you are a great man because, while you DID burn down his house, you allowed him to escape. He owes you for this generosity.

[M.Dancer]

25 against 2500. The government was scared shitless. The Warriors won again.

Of course....

The Mohawks at Oka felt betrayed at the loss of their most effective bargaining chip. Once traffic was flowing again on the Mercier Bridge, the Quebec government rejected further negotiations. On September 25, the final engagement of the crisis took place when a Mohawk warrior walked around the perimeter with a long stick, setting off the flares the army had set up to warn them of escapes from the area. The army turned a hose on the man, but it lacked enough pressure to disperse a crowd. The Mohawk taunted the soldiers and started throwing water balloons at them. By September 26, the Mohawks dismantled their guns and threw them in a fire, ceremonially burned tobacco and then walked out of the pines and back to the reserve. Many were detained by the Canadian Forces and arrested by the SQ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oka_Crisis#Resolution

The Mohawks surrendered and 34 were arrested...that's 9 more than you claim were there.

How many did the Mohawk mafia arrest?

[Topaz]

No one should have died at Ipperwash and the blame goes to Harris himself.

[charter.rights]

Of course....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oka_Crisis#Resolution

The Mohawks surrendered and 34 were arrested...that's 9 more than you claim were there.

How many did the Mohawk mafia arrest?

Women not associated with the Warriors were also arrested. Do better research will ya...

But how many were convicted, and what were they convicted of?

Edited March 3, 2010 by charter.rights

[Shady]

I can't think of a time in history, when has the losing party has ever been treated so well by the conquering party.

I hate to point out the historical facts, but they lost. They were conquered. We won. They have been given land. They're given free education. They're given free healthcare. They pay no taxes. That's a pretty good deal to get as the losing side.

It's not their land anymore. They lost. To the victor go the spoils.

[charter.rights]

I can't think of a time in history, when has the losing party has ever been treated so well by the conquering party.

I hate to point out the historical facts, but they lost. They were conquered. We won. They have been given land. They're given free education. They're given free healthcare. They pay no taxes. That's a pretty good deal to get as the losing side.

It's not their land anymore. They lost. To the victor go the spoils.

Don't just say it because all you are doing is perpetuating myth. But if you can prove it.

You can't, for sure...

[Smallc]

They pay no taxes.

That's over generalizing.

[PIK]

That's over generalizing.

I run a business ,I get native cards jammed in my face all the time. The problem is most are not official cards , home made metis asc cards or homemade native cards and if you don't give in ,they make a scene. I quit giving in and told them to get a proper card or don't come back.But it is the people whiter then me that have these cards , and you wonder how they get them. Know the right native and have money...................

[Smallc]

I'm not sure what you're talking about. Natives have to pay taxes off of reserve. That's certainly the case here.

[M.Dancer]

I'm not sure what you're talking about. Natives have to pay taxes off of reserve. That's certainly the case here.

first nations are supposed to be exempt form sales tax.

[Shady]

first nations are supposed to be exempt from sales tax.

And they can work off the reserve, but live on the reserve, as to not pay income tax.

[Smallc]

first nations are supposed to be exempt form sales tax.

They can get it back, but they have to pay it at the time. That's certainly the way it works everywhere I've seen. I know for a fact though, that many of them never bother to fill out the paper work. A first nations person working and living off reserve will have to pay income tax.

Edited March 3, 2010 by Smallc

[Smallc]

And they can work off the reserve, but live on the reserve, as to not pay income tax.

And that's the deal that Canada made with them.