bjre Posted June 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 BJRE is a common exported propogandist - is this the best they can do? So if someone give you some different view, he is a propogandist, that is your vision of freedom of speech? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjre Posted June 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 To go back to the topic, what are some of the positive bits of information on China that are missing in our media? China has made great change in the past 30 years. The number of poor people in China has reduced from 250 million in 1978 to 20 million in 2007. The poverty rate decreased from 31% to 2.5%. Some people predict that by 2010, 170 million people would be in the middle-income bracket. (I did not find the number of middle class people for now). I try to search “China” “human right” from thestar.com, I find 913 results. I try to search “China” “reform” from thestar.com, I got 180 result, I tried to open some of the pages, I did not find one with positive thinking, all full blames. I think most people in Canada may even don’t have the basic concept that China has more internet users and much more cell phone users than the states. I think the media need some positive thinking, instead of just stop at the stage judging everything with current political religion. When a news item comes, try to think why it happens? Is it just so simple they want ignoring human right? What is that for? What is the reason behind scene? What can be the reasons that make it happen? What is the positive side on what they did? Is there any better solution for that? What can be the worst result of the alternative solutions with western thinking? If the media can do that, if they can do it with solution oriented instead of blame oriented, it will be more trustable and more useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 China has made great change in the past 30 years. The number of poor people in China has reduced from 250 million in 1978 to 20 million in 2007. The poverty rate decreased from 31% to 2.5%. Some people predict that by 2010, 170 million people would be in the middle-income bracket. (I did not find the number of middle class people for now). I try to search “China” “human right” from thestar.com, I find 913 results. I try to search “China” “reform” from thestar.com, I got 180 result, I tried to open some of the pages, I did not find one with positive thinking, all full blames. I think most people in Canada may even don’t have the basic concept that China has more internet users and much more cell phone users than the states.I think the media need some positive thinking, instead of just stop at the stage judging everything with current political religion. When a news item comes, try to think why it happens? Is it just so simple they want ignoring human right? What is that for? What is the reason behind scene? What can be the reasons that make it happen? What is the positive side on what they did? Is there any better solution for that? What can be the worst result of the alternative solutions with western thinking? If the media can do that, if they can do it with solution oriented instead of blame oriented, it will be more trustable and more useful. Media's role is not to salvage countries but to report newsworthy information after having verified its sources. Your numbers on the poverty in China would never have been published without an explicit reference to their origin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Because most people gone after they heard broadcast many hours ago. Was it not you that had said it did not happen in the first place ? are you now saying it may have happened now ? I don't think you understand my piont...It took the Germany Nazi army army most of the day to produce those same amount of killed and wounded, and that was using every weapon system they had in thier army, including Arty, planes, tanks....Are the Chinese Peoples army that good that it only took them a few hours to kill and wound that many people.... Sorry i don't have access to You tube, can you provide another source please.... Watch the following examples: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjre Posted June 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Media's role is not to salvage countries but to report newsworthy information after having verified its sources. Your numbers on the poverty in China would never have been published without an explicit reference to their origin. The manstream media should have this power to take some such kind of data from reliable sources. But I did not find them do so. They have no interest on the positive side of China. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 The manstream media should have this power to take some such kind of data from reliable sources. But I did not find them do so. They have no interest on the positive side of China. Give the source of your information then only you will have some credibility for criticizing media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Give the source of your information then only you will have some credibility for criticizing media. His information and the propogation of it is and will be as bias as our own...I suggest taking it with a grain of salt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjre Posted June 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Give the source of your information then only you will have some credibility for criticizing media. I is not my responsibility to provide news, it should be done by media. But since you are so interested in this, you can find it at http://english.people.com.cn/90001/90776/90882/6273763.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 I is not my responsibility to provide news, it should be done by media.But since you are so interested in this, you can find it at http://english.people.com.cn/90001/90776/90882/6273763.html They and I are not "so interested in this" - what I WANT to hear is from you PERSONALLY...Not some prepared link - or prepared photo - or prepared statement - I want you to talk about yourself - and how you really feel and think - If I want what you have to offer at present I will go to the embassy for China....now lets make friend - talk...what's it really like in China - how is your mother and father - your children - sorry (child) - talk about what is good - and what needs to be improved in China - don't behave like some trade delegate..let's see the human being - I spent some time with a teacher who left China - after a few months we became very close as human beings - he was a wonderful kind and honest human being.......so who are you? Show all that you are to all of us - we do not hate China - look how many of you are here - we just want to be loved by you..the money and the trade is secondary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjre Posted June 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 (edited) And the Tienanmen Square Massacre was a figment of everyone's imagination!Here's filtering at work...courtesy of Google in a comparison of a Google search page of the "Falun Gong" carefully filtered for the Chinese citizen opposite the same page without the filtering software: http://blogoscoped.com/censored/ Almost all news "Falun Gong" gives are lies. So I have no interest in finding if there is any truth left there. Do a survey in Chinese comminuty to find how many people trust them. Over the last two years, there have been numerous reports of riots in Chinese cities over factory closures, environmental disasters and the aggressive enforcement of the one-child policy in rural villages. Does it make the country more stable to try to cover up information about dissent and unrest? That is because media here enjoy those news, it is part of the culture of China, it can not happen in Canada because Canada, which has 'zero tolerence' policy, are more like a police state than China. For example if the striking workers don't let people put the garbage to the collect stations in Beijing like Toronto did, the residents will sure attact the strike workers and beat them away. While in Toronto, people just wait for the favour given by the strike workers because there are powerful cops waiting there. Media here need not a filter, because they have already filter out the positive information themselves. There are problems in China, they are making efforts to solve them. Not if we start doing what China does with its own domestic economy -- putting up tariffs to stop the flood of cheap imports, so we can rebuild our own manufacturing sector. You need to ask bosses if they are willing to do this. Edited June 25, 2009 by bjre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 (edited) When i first read this coffee actually came out my nose as i choked and spit all over my key board ....i can not believe you could down play this incident as you've tried....as some trival matter to be brushed off....shit you and BJRE can not even get your story straight, one says it did'nt happen and the other says it was a minor military crack down.....If this had happened in say toronto every major and minor hospital across the city would have quickly been overwhelmed trying to deal with the dead and wounded......i know one can not compare the size of toronto to any city in China but that is still is enough to perhaps make someone take pause and think.....every hospital.... What is a massacre, let's see the dictionary: massacre The act or an instance of killing a large number of humans indiscriminately and cruelly. Let's assume there were two kings. The first king's kingdom named Kanada, the second named Kina. The first kingdom only had 100 blacksmithes and the second had 1000. One day, the blacksmithes in both kingdoms decided to uprising to kick their kings' asses. Of course, the kings didn't like the idea, so they sent their crown tanks to crack down the rebels. In Kanada, 20 blacksmithes was killed during the crackdown, and in Kina, 200 got killed. So do you think Kina's king is crueler than Kanada's king, becasue he killed 200, that's a massacre; but Kanada's king only kill 20, so he is a merciful ruler? Beijing is a city with 16 million citizens, it's about half of Canada's population---that means if each Beijing citizen can live 100 years, there will be 160 thousand dead each year. In 2008, 100 thousand Chinese died in car crash, and India 86 thousand, America 40 thousand. The concept of large or small life loss does not alway depend on arithmetic-correctness. Do you think the video of tank-confrontation means the soldiers killed people "indiscriminately"? How many British and Canadian rebels got killed when they were cracked down by British king's army? Are those crackdown all massacres and your Queen whom you vowed to loyal to is a descendant of criminals who commitied numbers of massacres? LOL. Put another way during the D Day beach landings at Juno there was just over 1200 cas for the entire day....and serveral hundred killed....that was a dug in enemy using mines, rifles, Machine guns, Mortars, arty, and planes on men as the streamed helpless across open beaches....and they where trying to kill as many as possiable, this went on for the entire day.....and still just over 1200 cas where incured...and those men that where there describe it as being in hell.....Omaha Beach perhaps the worst beach of them all suffer just over 2100 cas for the day....once again this was a very detremined enemy gunning down soldiers as the crossed the beachheach.....trying to kill as many as them as possiable knowing they had to stop them on the beaches, or give the allieds a foot hold in Europe....so they continued to rush into machine gun fire Now with all that in mind, how can anyone sit there and say this was not a massacre unless there has been so many of these types of massacres as to trivalize these numbers....how could the Chinese soldiers accomplish this in mere hours when the Germany army took all day, with machine guns, mortars, arty guns and planes .....perhaps it was because they where unarmed civilians in mass panick, with no training, just trying to flee for thier lifes.... If on Omaha Beach there was 1 million Americans confronted a hundred thousand German soliders... This was not a military crack down seen in any western country....as it's government would have been ripped apart by it's citizens.... So this is Canada's ruler massacred its people? LOL. Rebellions of 1837 This event was called massacre by the writer, a bit of exaggerated. But it was definitedly a military crackdown. Kent State shootings By the way, Bjre and me are irrelative forum members. I don't know him and he don't know me. What I agreed with him is no more than "many Canadian people have inaccurate knowledge of China" and I will be surprised if there are a lot of Canadian have accurate knowledge of China or any other countries, just as most people in other countries may also have inaccurate knowledge of Canada . Edited June 25, 2009 by xul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 I is not my responsibility to provide news, it should be done by media.But since you are so interested in this, you can find it at http://english.people.com.cn/90001/90776/90882/6273763.html It is your responsibility to back up your claims as Canadian media take great care to back up theirs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 It is your responsibility to back up your claims as Canadian media take great care to back up theirs. It's easy to reduce Chinas poor by "20%'. Just keep enforcing the birth rate policy of one child - forced abortions for others - and toss in a few executions and down goes the poverty rate - people who are dead are rich...they have no need for money or food or lodging...no ------ the fact that they are bragging about the reduction of the poverty rate but still stomp on basic human rights and freedoms...makes no sense - besides - when has a communist dictatorship bothered telling the truth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 It's easy to reduce Chinas poor by "20%'. Just keep enforcing the birth rate policy of one child - forced abortions for others - and toss in a few executions and down goes the poverty rate - people who are dead are rich...they have no need for money or food or lodging...no ------ the fact that they are bragging about the reduction of the poverty rate but still stomp on basic human rights and freedoms...makes no sense - besides - when has a communist dictatorship bothered telling the truth? This child policy is inducing the Chinese population to lie and lower the number of their (poor) children in census. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 This child policy is inducing the Chinese population to lie and lower the number of their (poor) children in census. Best to have twins - you can hide one under the bed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Best to have twins - you can hide one under the bed... The poor sleep in the floor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry J. Fortin Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Chinese birth rates have fallen since the one child policy. But wait for it.......India will have a larger population than China within the next 30 years. Between the two nations there will be nearly 45% of the world population. It is hard to imagine that many people, nearly three billion, using up consumer goods so far away from us. The number of manufacturing plants in Asia is growing rapidly as are power and utility companies. In North America manufacturing is falling as rapidly as it is growing in Asia. Wealth WILL accumulate there at the expense of the rest of the world. There is no way around it with current economic models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Chinese birth rates have fallen since the one child policy. But wait for it.......India will have a larger population than China within the next 30 years. Between the two nations there will be nearly 45% of the world population. It is hard to imagine that many people, nearly three billion, using up consumer goods so far away from us. The number of manufacturing plants in Asia is growing rapidly as are power and utility companies. In North America manufacturing is falling as rapidly as it is growing in Asia. Wealth WILL accumulate there at the expense of the rest of the world. There is no way around it with current economic models. What are these economic models? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 As they fire up a new coal fired electical plant and pollute the air - we will all think green - until their cloud chokes us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 As they fire up a new coal fired electical plant and pollute the air - we will all think green - until their cloud chokes us. Even with its new coal-powered utilities, China will still be responsible of only a disproportionally small share of all accumulated pollution so far worldwide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Even with its new coal-powered utilities, China will still be responsible of only a disproportionally small share of all accumulated pollution so far worldwide. That's not true--- there is nothing disproportionate about hundrends of coal fired plants - as long as we continue to have the same attitude as you and continue to mindlessly profit though labour and product from China -things will not improve but incrimentally decay as far as the global environ...looks as though you might be one of those people who put profit above breathing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 That's not true--- there is nothing disproportionate about hundrends of coal fired plants - as long as we continue to have the same attitude as you and continue to mindlessly profit though labour and product from China -things will not improve but incrimentally decay as far as the global environ...looks as though you might be one of those people who put profit above breathing. Ha! It's like having hundreds of new Nanticoke plants....every year! Cough....cough....choke...choke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Ha! It's like having hundreds of new Nanticoke plants....every year! Cough....cough....choke...choke. I heard that up to 200 a month get up and running - that's a lot..so we can run clean over hear and in the end it will not matter - It's like keeping the smoke in one half of the room - expecting it not to spread.....I guess there is no such thing as something for nothing. If the west wants to profit from eastern slave labour - no way are they going to walk away clean. The public does not get this hypocracy and small over sight...that as we enrich our selves and gloat in our greeness - we indirectly pollute and destoy the atmosphere - Like I said - those that do not believe in global warming and climate destruction are those that are afraid of their bank account dropping a few digits - It's a conundrum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 That's not true--- there is nothing disproportionate about hundrends of coal fired plants - as long as we continue to have the same attitude as you and continue to mindlessly profit though labour and product from China -things will not improve but incrimentally decay as far as the global environ...looks as though you might be one of those people who put profit above breathing. China puts these plants on the negotiation table to get some (technological) transfers from the West. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 China puts these plants on the negotiation table to get some (technological) transfers from the West. Why does the West owe China any technological transfers? We've been doing that for over fifteen years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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