Explosives Found in World Trade Center Dust

[Oleg Bach]

9/11 may well be the result of cynics being overly annoyed by too many of their own kind.

Do you think that someone like Cheney actuall cared when 3000 people died on American soil? Do you think he even gave it a second thought when the body count in Iraq incrimentally increased form a few dozen to thousands? You had better get it straight - those that you elect don't care if those that elect them are alive or dead. They allowed 9 11 to take place - a nation with the great technologial advances militarily - could not keep a few bearded god delluded freaks at bey...can only be considered unconscious facilitators.

[benny]

Do you think that someone like Cheney actuall cared when 3000 people died on American soil? Do you think he even gave it a second thought when the body count in Iraq incrimentally increased form a few dozen to thousands? You had better get it straight - those that you elect don't care if those that elect them are alive or dead. They allowed 9 11 to take place - a nation with the great technologial advances militarily - could not keep a few bearded god delluded freaks at bey...can only be considered unconscious facilitators.

To Halliburton and Blackwater catering is just as worthwhile as caring.

[Oleg Bach]

To Halliburton and Blackwater catering is just as worthwhile as caring.

Those that kill for money or allow citizens to die for profit do not have my respect - to hell with all of them...justice will come - it will be slow and devine - all will pay for what they secretly whispered in their darkend offices while the niave perished - The way they look at people is simple - "If I lie and they believe - then they are inferiours and their death is justified" _ These are creeps - the former administration could have protected the domestic population - they simply did not love them - a great leader loves his people - those that do not eat them.

[benny]

About the planting of the explosives, Jim Hoffman wrote: "The labor-intensive portions of the operation might be made more secure by using undocumented workers who are naturally disinclined to raise questions about the work."

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/thermit...g_scenario.html

[Oleg Bach]

About the planting of the explosives, Jim Hoffman wrote: "The labor-intensive portions of the operation might be made more secure by using undocumented workers who are naturally disinclined to raise questions about the work."

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/thermit...g_scenario.html

So they kill their own citizens -? Whatchya gonna do about it - It was brazen but so is the affair in Iraq -grow up and understand that we have people in power that kill - other and you if they deem it neccesary - forget about these people - and live - so what ----that you discovered that those elected and trusted will eat you alive..what do you expect from such a system?

[benny]

So they kill their own citizens -? Whatchya gonna do about it - It was brazen but so is the affair in Iraq -grow up and understand that we have people in power that kill - other and you if they deem it neccesary - forget about these people - and live - so what ----that you discovered that those elected and trusted will eat you alive..what do you expect from such a system?

If you are not living for its fall, you are wasting your time on a forum.

[bush_cheney2004]

If you are not living for its fall, you are wasting your time on a forum.

Even if you are "living for its fall", you are still wasting time on a forum. But it is good for laughs!

[benny]

Even if you are "living for its fall", you are still wasting time on a forum. But it is good for laughs!

(Covert) frustrations get recycled on a forum.

[bush_cheney2004]

(Covert) frustrations get recycled on a forum.

(Overt) frustrations get recycled on the street.

[benny]

(Overt) frustrations get recycled on the street.

Agora, forum, street are all public places.

[segnosaur]

About the planting of the explosives, Jim Hoffman wrote: "The labor-intensive portions of the operation might be made more secure by using undocumented workers who are naturally disinclined to raise questions about the work."

Well, here are the problems with that particular 'theory'...

- Undocumented workers would not necessarily be experts in handling explosives, building demolition, etc.

- Even if you could find a pool of undocumented workers willing to cart explosives into a building and they miraculously knew how to handle them properly and place them in just the right spots, you would still have to explain:

* How the dozens if not hundreds of security personel managed to overlook

large numbers of people caring explosives around

* How the thousands of workers never noticed, at any time, suspicous packages, holes

in the walls necessarily to plant charges, etc.

- You'd also have to assume that each and every worker that was involved was dumb as a brick and wouldn't bother putting 2 and 2 together after 9/11 (racist much?)

- Not only would you have to arrange the demolition of the building, you'd also have to arrange:

* the hijackings

* arrange things with Norad to prevent them from intercepting the planes (be a bummer to

plant the bombs only to have the planes shot down before they hit the buildings)

* Get pretty much the entire community of civil and structural engineers to throw out years

of experience

Once again... I'm still waiting for you to come up with a complete description of what you think happened on 9/11.... who was involved and when at all stages. (Not just picking little bits and pieces.) Until you can come up with something that actually resembles something plausible, you'll never convince a skeptic.

[benny]

Once again... I'm still waiting for you to come up with a complete description of what you think happened on 9/11.... who was involved and when at all stages. (Not just picking little bits and pieces.) Until you can come up with something that actually resembles something plausible, you'll never convince a skeptic.

What you still have to understand is that, whatever 9/11, any event happening in the World that doesn't capture your enthusiasm should be treated by you as very suspicious.

[bush_cheney2004]

Well, here are the problems with that particular 'theory'...

....Once again... I'm still waiting for you to come up with a complete description of what you think happened on 9/11.... who was involved and when at all stages. (Not just picking little bits and pieces.) Until you can come up with something that actually resembles something plausible, you'll never convince a skeptic.

Not going to happen, because we know that the Truther mentality and conspiracy theorist mind thrives not on facts, analysis, or plausibility, but rather on the very uncertainty of the question at hand. Like a Black Hole, it devours any and all tidbits that challenge the baseline even while embracing some of the "official theory" when convenient.

IMO, you, more than any other member (as others have certainly made their contributions), have beaten back the hoards of nonsense with reason and logic, their worst enemy.....without so much as a nod to the Bush Administration.

[GostHacked]

He was born in Connecticut, his family is New England old money. He spent some time in Texas during his formative years, then went back to New England for his education. The Texan image was forged for political reasons.

If it was just for an image, it is a missrepresentation of what and who Bush really is and what he stands for. Image comes from having substance. Substance drives what your image is. If you have to create the image first to even say you have substance, I don't want you around.

As for the rest of your post - it makes me think that GW Bush is just an image to you, and not a real person. Otherwise, you wouldn't just toss off an accusation of mass murder of his fellow countrymen, I'm sure.

Well when you put on the image which is false, then yes Bush IS just an image and not a real person.

[segnosaur]

Do you think that someone like Cheney actuall cared when 3000 people died on American soil? Do you think he even gave it a second thought when the body count in Iraq incrimentally increased form a few dozen to thousands?

First of all, congratultions on your ability to mind-read. Really quite impressive that you know exactly what's going through the minds of our political leaders at any one time. (By the way, I am being sarcastic... You know, we do elect our leaders to make the tough decisions, even some that result in deaths. That doesn't necessarily mean that whomever is the leader isn't affected by such tragedies.)

Secondly.... lets assume that you were correct, and that Cheney and/or Bush were apathetic monsters who don't really care about lives... That still doesn't prove that they were involved with 9/11. After all, even if they (for some reason nobody has ever explained) wanted to carry out 9/11, they would still need hundreds if not thousands of henchment to carry out their plans. Not exactly likely that they'd be about to find thousands of people with a similar lack of morality, most of whom wouldn't even benefit from any 9/11 operation.

You had better get it straight - those that you elect don't care if those that elect them are alive or dead. They allowed 9 11 to take place - a nation with the great technologial advances militarily - could not keep a few bearded god delluded freaks at bey...can only be considered unconscious facilitators.

Ummm... The U.S. is a country with around 300 million people, thousands upon thousands of potential targets, and a wide range of attitudes from workaholic to utterly apathetic.

Those "bearded god delluded freaks" were not some primitive aboriginies who are out of touch with the western world. Many of the terrorists came from middle class families. Many had higher education.

Why exactly is it so suprising that a group of determined, intelligent (even if delluded) individuals wouldn't have the ability to identify and expliot weaknesses in the system?

[benny]

Not going to happen, because we know that the Truther mentality and conspiracy theorist mind thrives not on facts, analysis, or plausibility, but rather on the very uncertainty of the question at hand. Like a Black Hole, it devours any and all tidbits that challenge the baseline even while embracing some of the "official theory" when convenient.

IMO, you, more than any other member (as others have certainly made their contributions), have beaten back the hoards of nonsense with reason and logic, their worst enemy.....without so much as a nod to the Bush Administration.

When you will be able to understand that the defining element of any state is top secrecy, you will begin to ear a call to empty the place of head of state (whatever particular individuals are doing, good or bad, occupying such a position).

[segnosaur]

What you still have to understand is that, whatever 9/11, any event happening in the World that doesn't capture your enthusiasm should be treated by you as very suspicious.

Enthusiasm is irrelevant.

I ignore 9/11 conspiricy theories because they are utter nonsense. I am a skeptic and I believe in following where the evidence leads. So far, the only 'evidence' provided by 9/11 conspiricy theorists has involved bad science, put forward by unqualified individuals.

You want to capture people's enthusiasm? Try putting together some sort of scenario for what happened on 9/11. Until you can do that, you're going to continue to be a perfect illustration about how conspiricy nonsense thrives when logic breaks down.

[bush_cheney2004]

When you will be able to understand that the defining element of any state is top secrecy, you will begin to ear a call to empty the place of head of state (whatever particular individuals are doing, good or bad, occupying such a position).

Trust me, you don't know what you are talking about. The very many elements of compartmentalized state secrets often has nothing to do with the leadership at all. "Top Secret" is not the top.

[GostHacked]

Anyone watch the two vids I posted? Comments?

[bush_cheney2004]

Anyone watch the two vids I posted? Comments?

Yes, the Fifth Estate video is old news....nothing there that hasn't been discussed before. I got bored with the other video. Got anything better?

[benny]

Enthusiasm is irrelevant.

I ignore 9/11 conspiricy theories because they are utter nonsense. I am a skeptic and I believe in following where the evidence leads. So far, the only 'evidence' provided by 9/11 conspiricy theorists has involved bad science, put forward by unqualified individuals.

You want to capture people's enthusiasm? Try putting together some sort of scenario for what happened on 9/11. Until you can do that, you're going to continue to be a perfect illustration about how conspiricy nonsense thrives when logic breaks down.

What you still don't understand is that it would be stupid for people to wait to have the best reason in the world before celebrating; any excuse is good enough reason to party.

Edited April 21, 2009 by benny

[segnosaur]

...Once again... I'm still waiting for you to come up with a complete description of what you think happened on 9/11....

Not going to happen, because we know that the Truther mentality and conspiracy theorist mind thrives not on facts, analysis, or plausibility, but rather on the very uncertainty of the question at hand.

Yeah, I know... but hey, I'm not doing it for his benefit... I'm doing it for the benefit of others who might have stumbled upon the thread and are currently unsure of 9/11. If they can see how empty-headed their non-sense is, and how they are incapable of putting together anything that passes even the most basic of scrutiny, hopefully we'll prevent others from falling for the same garbage.

IMO, you, more than any other member (as others have certainly made their contributions), have beaten back the hoards of nonsense with reason and logic, their worst enemy.....without so much as a nod to the Bush Administration.

Thanks. Normally I hang out on skeptics forums, so I'm used to seeing these things debunked.

[segnosaur]

Anyone watch the two vids I posted? Comments?

Yeah, here's a commnet...

Why exactly is most of the 'evidence' that conspiricy theorists rely on in the form of videos?

Perhaps conspiricy theorists, instead of wasting time watching videos of documentaries and speeches by their favoirite 'believers', would be better served by taking a few remedial science classes.

Meanwhile, while the average conspiricy theorist is wasting time watching videos, scientists and engineers are publishing articles in peer reviewed journals debunking the nonsense of conspiricy believers.

[bush_cheney2004]

....Meanwhile, while the average conspiricy theorist is wasting time watching videos, scientists and engineers are publishing articles in peer reviewed journals debunking the nonsense of conspiricy believers.

And there is even more direct action.....my building's exposed steel beams were sprayed with insulation.

[benny]

Yeah, here's a commnet...

Why exactly is most of the 'evidence' that conspiricy theorists rely on in the form of videos?

Perhaps conspiricy theorists, instead of wasting time watching videos of documentaries and speeches by their favoirite 'believers', would be better served by taking a few remedial science classes.

Meanwhile, while the average conspiricy theorist is wasting time watching videos, scientists and engineers are publishing articles in peer reviewed journals debunking the nonsense of conspiricy believers.

A forum is the place where one gets in control of ideology and science is also an ideology.