jdobbin Posted January 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 No - the atheists believe in the great nothing - and are humanists - humanism fails without hope and faith. You said it is a belief system just like religion. Don't you believe in equality of treatment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 I asked him if there was a god, and he said he didn't know, so perhaps he was an agnostic after all. He was, however, able to direct me to the electronics department. Just in case you needed the latest equipment to talk to God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 I have nothing against athiests. But anyone who can get militant about atheism to the point they are prostletizing as though it were a religion is, frankly, nuts. That is what some call Christopher Hitchens. He blasts right back. My personal view is that the atheists should be able to run ads if they fall within the present accepted ads that religious groups run. Do we need to have ads from cranks facing our poor commuters? I bet they'd far rather see pictures of cute butts in jeans. Those ads were chased away in 2001 if I recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 Being an atheist is not going "against the state". For a lot of people though, even some atheists, atheism does go against the very basis of their governments including ours. If you really want to give these sorts of people chest pains and diarreah though try casting doubt on their faith in the economy. I'd like to see big ads that say, "The economists probably don't have a clue. Put your head between your knees and kiss your ass goodbye." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huston Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/090116/...atheist_bus_adsI wonder if Toronto will support this or back away from it. Isn't this finacnial fiasco the result of people enjoying their lives through cheap money? I know god is merely a concoction of the human mind, but there are still many thing to worry about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Isn't this finacnial fiasco the result of people enjoying their lives through cheap money? I know god is merely a concoction of the human mind, but there are still many thing to worry about. So the endless universe and all the variations of nature that are a miracle on this speck of blue - are just a "concoction" of the human mind - Jezzz that's really god like! There are two types of people - those that can concieve the idea of eternity and the concept that the universe has a mind - call it God - while there is a second group that worships the sun because they can not grasp the concept of what created the sun....as for atheists pushing the idea on the public that some how if we go back to sun worship that the world would be rosey and happiness would abound...as if the idea and the hope of God detracts from the quality of life - I say if you are going to tear down the temple - you had better have a replacement ready to go that is superiour to the old way - but the atheists have no replacement - they want us to have no tradition - no culture - and rely on humanity for hope - Humanity has always failed humanity - that's the nature of the natural game - where as the super - natural -----grants hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noahbody Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 There are two types of people - those that can concieve the idea of eternity and the concept that the universe has a mind - call it God - while there is a second group that worships the sun because they can not grasp the concept of what created the sun I think you forgot the third group that understand both how people work and the significance of there being many gods, just as there are many suns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huston Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 So the endless universe and all the variations of nature that are a miracle on this speck of blue - are just a "concoction" of the human mind - Jezzz that's really god like! Huh, what miracle? There are two types of people - those that can concieve the idea of eternity and the concept that the universe has a mind - call it God - while there is a second group that worships the sun because they can not grasp the concept of what created the sun.... Are you sure that is why the sun worshipper worship the sun? There are way more than two type in your silly little head. as for atheists pushing the idea on the public that some how if we go back to sun worship that the world would be rosey and happiness would abound... Atheists worship the sun? as if the idea and the hope of God detracts from the quality of life Huh? I say if you are going to tear down the temple - you had better have a replacement ready to go that is superiour to the old way Replacement? but the atheists have no replacement - they want us to have no tradition - no culture - and rely on humanity for hope - Humanity has always failed humanity - that's the nature of the natural game - where as the super - natural -----grants hope. Humanity provides culture, tradition and hope, as it defines what it is. WTF are you on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stignasty Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 I was at a Wal-Mart a while back You poor dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB Globe Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 If some group wants to pay a bunch of money to put up ads on the TTC that won't work (since when has anyone changed worldviews based on a salesline of: "Hey you, you're wrong, I'm right, get with MY team!" - ???) I'm sure they'll be able to, the TTC has faith-based ads, such as "Learn about Jesus" and the like, this is no different really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 If some group wants to pay a bunch of money to put up ads on the TTC that won't work (since when has anyone changed worldviews based on a salesline of: "Hey you, you're wrong, I'm right, get with MY team!" - ???) I'm sure they'll be able to, the TTC has faith-based ads, such as "Learn about Jesus" and the like, this is no different really. Exactly. At the end of the day this kind of marketing -- especially when it comes to making a choice about faith -- has historically failed miserably. I don't think there's one among us -- Christian, Jew, atheist, whatever -- who would actually make a change in their choice of faith based on an ad on the side of the bus. I know as an atheist I'm hardly moved by the guys down at Yonge and Dundas screaming about how "Jesus saves" and trying to hand me pamphlets; I assume I would be no more moved by an atheist slogan on the side of the bus I take to work. This is pretty harmless stuff in the grand scheme of things, folks. Besides -- this is Canada. You're allowed to sell your faith (or lack of it) on the sides of buses all you like. Long as you have the money for it, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noahbody Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Exactly. At the end of the day this kind of marketing -- especially when it comes to making a choice about faith -- has historically failed miserably. The marketing to this point has cost nothing and it has created discussion so it has had some success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I was at a Wal-Mart a while back and noticed a young man wearing a black t-shirt with a huge white question mark on the front. At first I thought he might be a proud agnostic, but when I got closer I noticed the fine print on the t-shirt indicated that he was a Wal-Mart employee who would be happy to answer my questions. I asked him if there was a god, and he said he didn't know, so perhaps he was an agnostic after all. He was, however, able to direct me to the electronics department. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 The marketing to this point has cost nothing and it has created discussion so it has had some success. How could it have cost nothing? Does the TTC not charge to put advertisements on their buses? If they don't I should look into putting my face all over this city! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 How could it have cost nothing? Does the TTC not charge to put advertisements on their buses? If they don't I should look into putting my face all over this city! I think he means to this point.....as in so far no ads have been placed but people are talking about it...gone viral as they say in the intraweb ad rooms... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Well seeing as the TTC is largely publicly funded and we're to have separation of Church and State I find it would be inappropriate to have Atheist Ads on TTC property proclaiming there is no God unless the Christian Groups can advertise that there is. I don't think either of these would happen so it's better just to not allow either side to advertise. Problem solved. BEfore someone points to the Sally Ann or Covenant House, they are advertising either for funds or for helping the homeless not discussing God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontario Loyalist Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I was at a Wal-Mart a while back and noticed a young man wearing a black t-shirt with a huge white question mark on the front. At first I thought he might be a proud agnostic, but when I got closer I noticed the fine print on the t-shirt indicated that he was a Wal-Mart employee who would be happy to answer my questions. I asked him if there was a god, and he said he didn't know, so perhaps he was an agnostic after all. He was, however, able to direct me to the electronics department. -k I suppose the pic on your profile is of your grand-daughter, then...? You have a keen whit and a wonderful ability for conveying the irony and conflicting social vlaues of post-modernist, post-colonialist Alberta in the midst of an 'historic' economic crisis... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Well seeing as the TTC is largely publicly funded and we're to have separation of Church and State I find it would be inappropriate to have Atheist Ads on TTC property proclaiming there is no God unless the Christian Groups can advertise that there is. I don't think either of these would happen so it's better just to not allow either side to advertise. Problem solved.BEfore someone points to the Sally Ann or Covenant House, they are advertising either for funds or for helping the homeless not discussing God. First of all, I've seen church-related advertising all over the TTC (not on buses, per se, but definitely in subway stations etc...I think the last one I saw was for Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints), so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to go atheist the other way. And as far as Covenant House or the Salvation Army -- okay, they're not discussing God in their advertising, but they're public about their Christian affiliations. Just because the word "God" isn't in the advertising doesn't mean it's not implicit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I find it hard to believe the TTC would allow a Mormon ad but you never know. Mormons aren't Christians anyhow so it's unimportant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noahbody Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 (edited) I suppose the pic on your profile is of your grand-daughter, then...? Well duh! I'm sure by now that Awesometon has indoor plumbing? Edited January 19, 2009 by noahbody Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Mormons aren't Christians anyhow so it's unimportant. Thats rather unkind of you considering that many evangelicals don't consider Catholics to be Christians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck U. Farlie Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I didn't read the ads closely enough to see who sponsored them, but I definitely have read ads on both buses and subways that include a bible quote - usually something about how Jesus will save you. As long as religious groups can advertise, then anti-religious groups should be allowed to advertise. The money for these ads, according to www.atheistbus.ca has come entirely from donations. Now I, as an atheist, don't think that atheists should be trying to convert people in any way or treating atheism like a religion - which it is not, but I definitely agree with fighting for equal and free rights. And equal rights means atheists can advertise their non-belief if the religious can advertise their belief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noahbody Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Mormons aren't Christians anyhow so it's unimportant. Gee, I would have thought that having Jesus Christ in their church's name would have indicated they believe in Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANADIEN Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 First of all, I've seen church-related advertising all over the TTC (not on buses, per se, but definitely in subway stations etc...I think the last one I saw was for Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints), so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to go atheist the other way. And as far as Covenant House or the Salvation Army -- okay, they're not discussing God in their advertising, but they're public about their Christian affiliations. Just because the word "God" isn't in the advertising doesn't mean it's not implicit. I have seen some too. Even, a few years back, from the Cathollic Church. They pay for the space, they get the space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Now I, as an atheist, don't think that atheists should be trying to convert people in any way or treating atheism like a religion - which it is not, but I definitely agree with fighting for equal and free rights. And equal rights means atheists can advertise their non-belief if the religious can advertise their belief. From what I have read about the ad campaign, the primary goal is more about recognition and getting noticed. If atheists were able to form a cohesive lobby group, we would have more political clout than all but the largest religions. I'm still not sure how I feel about the ad campaign though! I don't think you can convert people to a a naturalistic worldview if they are looking for supernatural and/or paranormal explanations. When most people leave mainstream religions, they look for substitutes. In much of Western Europe, traditional religions have been in steep decline for several decades, but mysticism and psychic phenomena have filled a big part of the supernatural gap. The best we can hope for is that the supernatural (in all of its various forms) gets left at the door, when decisions are being made about public policy issues like abortion, stem cell research and euthanasia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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