Palin Democrats

[Shady]

She's one of us': Palin wins over Obama women

Jessica Goral had pretty much made up her mind two weeks ago: she was going to vote for Barack Obama. Then John McCain picked Sarah Palin as his running-mate.

“She empowers a lot of women,” said Mrs Goral, a mother of two in Macomb County – a national bellwether in the battleground state of Michigan and an area rich in white, working-class swing voters who will play an important role in deciding the election in November.

“I like that she’s a brand new mother, and that she has the courage to stand behind her pregnant daughter. She relates to working women. For all of us who have children at home but have to go to work every day – she has given us a sense that we can still do it and can be an excellent mum,” she said. “Sarah Palin is a role model. She’s made me more likely to vote Republican.”

If Mr Obama should be in any doubt how gravely the vice-presidential nomination of the Governor of Alaska has imperilled his White House ambitions, then a day spent in Macomb County will make this clear: white women who voted for John Kerry in 2004 are suddenly deserting the Democratic Party.

This is Mount Clemens, in the heart of Macomb County, where the pollster Stan Greenberg first identified the phenomenon of the Reagan Democrats – the working-class, socially conservative, traditionally Democratic whites who deserted the party for Ronald Reagan in 1980. It is fair to say that this critical swing group now has a new name: Palin Democrats.

Times Online

As I stated in previous threads. Obama's only REAL choice was Hillary Clinton. This just proves that my political instincts are golden. If this amounts to any kind of trend, Obama's finished, and could go down as the biggest loser ever to walk the political landscape.

[WIP]

What on earth would a woman who is a member of the Democratic Party find in Sarah Palin that would persuade them that she is worth voting for?

Either they are totally uninformed voters that believe in Rick Davis's philosophy of casting votes based on an evaluation of the likeability or personality of the candidates and not the issues -- or they are part of an unknown number of white Americans who will refuse to vote for a black candidate, but feel the need to concoct a cover story for their voting preferences.

[bush_cheney2004]

What on earth would a woman who is a member of the Democratic Party find in Sarah Palin that would persuade them that she is worth voting for?

Ask the men who were members of the Democratic party and voted for Reagan...twice.

Either they are totally uninformed voters that believe in Rick Davis's philosophy of casting votes based on an evaluation of the likeability or personality of the candidates and not the issues -- or they are part of an unknown number of white Americans who will refuse to vote for a black candidate, but feel the need to concoct a cover story for their voting preferences.

Or answer c)... None of the above.

[betsy]

Everyday mothers can relate with her.

The media and opponents had used her teenage daughter's pregnancy to attack her.

Just look around you. How many mothers are there on this planet that face the problem of having an unwed young daughter pregnant?

Attacking Palin and making it seem that somehow she is a failure as a mom for this reason....is giving the same message to all the other moms.

And I'm just curious....I wonder how many Democrat moms have young unwed pregnant daughters compared to Republican moms? Liberal-thinking moms to Conservative-thinking moms? I'm talking pre-abortion census.

Edited September 13, 2008 by betsy

[Guest American Woman]

Everyday mothers can relate with her.

Some can, some can't. I'm an every day mother who doesn't relate to her.

The media and opponents had used her teenage daughter's pregnancy to attack her. Just look around you. How many mothers are there on this planet that face the problem of having an unwed young daughter pregnant?

If they've been "using it" at all, it isn't to attack her personally so much as to attack the hypocrisy of the conservative Christian right along with their views.

And I hope you don't think for a minute that if it were Obama with a pregnant unwed 17 year old daughter that the media and opponents wouldn't be "using it to attack him."

Attacking Palin and making it seem that somehow she is a failure as a mom for this reason....is giving the same message to all the other moms.

The Obama campaign isn't attacking Palin for this reason, and that's all that should matter. There are extremely stupid people with blogs posting extremely stupid things on both ends of the political spectrum. The "Obama is a Muslim" accusation, clearly as a bad thing, could certainly be seen as giving a negative message to all Muslims.

And I'm just curious....I wonder how many Democrat moms have young unwed pregnant daughters compared to Republican moms? Liberal-thinking moms to Conservative-thinking moms? I'm talking pre-abortion census.

I can show you where conservatives have insulted parents of teenage girls who are pregnant too, so why would you wonder such a thing? Do you truly believe this is one-sided criticism?

[CANADIEN]

Everyday mothers can relate with her.

The media and opponents had used her teenage daughter's pregnancy to attack her.

Just look around you. How many mothers are there on this planet that face the problem of having an unwed young daughter pregnant?

Attacking Palin and making it seem that somehow she is a failure as a mom for this reason....is giving the same message to all the other moms.

And I'm just curious....I wonder how many Democrat moms have young unwed pregnant daughters compared to Republican moms? Liberal-thinking moms to Conservative-thinking moms? I'm talking pre-abortion census.

Perhaps what Democrats need is another 16 year-old "celebrity" like Jamie Lynn Spears getting pregnant and right-wing pundits criticizing the parents. Looks like a lot of people need to be reminded of the hypocrisy of people who were all over the Spears and called them irresponsible parents because of their daughter's pregnancy only to praise the Palins when the same thing happens to them.

[jay22]

Everyday mothers can relate with her.

The media and opponents had used her teenage daughter's pregnancy to attack her.

Just look around you. How many mothers are there on this planet that face the problem of having an unwed young daughter pregnant?

Attacking Palin and making it seem that somehow she is a failure as a mom for this reason....is giving the same message to all the other moms.

And I'm just curious....I wonder how many Democrat moms have young unwed pregnant daughters compared to Republican moms? Liberal-thinking moms to Conservative-thinking moms? I'm talking pre-abortion census.

It has more to do in her policys then anything.

Edited September 13, 2008 by jay22

[Guest American Woman]

Perhaps what Democrats need is another 16 year-old "celebrity" like Jamie Lynn Spears getting pregnant and right-wing pundits criticizing the parents. Looks like a lot of people need to be reminded of the hypocrisy of people who were all over the Spears and called them irresponsible parents because of their daughter's pregnancy only to praise the Palins when the same thing happens to them.

It would be interesting to see how that would be handled by the Republican pundits now, wouldn't it? Teenage "pinhead" gets pregnant and obviously the "blame" rests on "bad parenting" while for the Palin family, "life happens." But evidently everyone is supposed to sweep that hypocrisy under the carpet; pretend it never happened.

[Guest American Woman]

It has more to do in her policys then anything.

Actually, this thread is about "Palin Democrats," so it doesn't have anything to do with her policies. Democrats would oppose her policies. It's all about their supporting a woman because she's a woman and a mother, and as such, they relate to her on a personal level.

Edited to add: I think this is important enough to point out. Along with all the enthusiasm for Palin quoted by the woman in the article, she says "She’s made me more likely to vote Republican." That's not saying she is going to vote Republican, just that she's more likely to. When push comes to shove, if she's not set on voting for her at this early 'star struck' stage, she (and others) very likely could end up voting Democrat.

Edited September 13, 2008 by American Woman

[Shady]

Some can, some can't. I'm an every day mother who doesn't relate to her.

Most every day mother's aren't hyper-partisan. So I don't think the comparison is apt.

It has more to do in her policys then anything.

You're exactly right, but for the reasons why they hate her. She's a strong and independent woman, but she doesn't worship at the alter of extreme liberalism. For instance, she rejects the left's most revered sacrament, which is abortion. That alone makes her enemy number one.

[Guest American Woman]

Most every day mother's aren't hyper-partisan. So I don't think the comparison is apt.

On the other hand, most Christian Conservatives are hyper-partisan, with you being among the biggest of the hyper-partisan conservative cry-babies, so your judgment of me isn't apt, much less even close to being correct.

QUOTE=jay22: It has more to do in her policys then anything.

You're exactly right....

He's exactly wrong. Democrats aren't supporting Palin for her policies.; they are supporting her in spite of her policies. I should say "liking" her, not "supporting" her, since we don't know how they will ultimately vote.

[CANADIEN]

Most every day mother's aren't hyper-partisan. So I don't think the comparison is apt.

You're exactly right, but for the reasons why they hate her. She's a strong and independent woman, but she doesn't worship at the alter of extreme liberalism. For instance, she rejects the left's most revered sacrament, which is abortion. That alone makes her enemy number one.

Abortion as a sacro-saint sacrament. As someone who opposes abortion, i am always surprised by the absurdity of the "they treat abortion as a sacrament" label. It is an insult to facts, and an insult to logic.

It's funny, by the way, to see all the social "the place of a woman is at home and God calls her to be obediant" conservatives now praising Palin for being independant. Social conservative politicians are granted an exemption.

Edited September 13, 2008 by CANADIEN

[CANADIEN]

On the other hand, most Christian Conservatives are hyper-partisan, with you being among the biggest of the hyper-partisan conservative cry-babies, so your judgment of me isn't apt, much less even close to being correct.

He's exactly wrong. Democrats aren't supporting Palin for her policies.; they are supporting her in spite of her policies. I should say "liking" her, not "supporting" her, since we don't know how they will ultimately vote.

Neither Democrats or Republicans are monolithic blocks. There may be a lot registered Democrats with social conservative views that you think. These people now have a reason to vote Republican.

Edited September 13, 2008 by CANADIEN

[Guest American Woman]

Neither Democrats or Republicans are monolithic blocks. There may be a lot registered Democrats with social conservative views that you think. These people now have a reason to vote Republican.

It's a safe bet to say that generally people with "social conservative views" are not registered Democrats, in spite of your belief that there "may be a lot" who are. As for Palin, she is a social conservative Republican, and her policies reflect that, and that's what my comments are based on. So I don't need to be told that "neither Democrats or Republicans are a monolithic block," but thanks for the pedantic lesson just the same.

[August1991]

It's a safe bet to say that generally people with "social conservative views" are not registered Democrats, in spite of your belief that there "may be a lot" who are. As for Palin, she is a social conservative Republican, and her policies reflect that, and that's what my comments are based on. So I don't need to be told that "neither Democrats or Republicans are a monolithic block," but thanks for the pedantic lesson just the same.

Well, the thread's title is "Palin Democrats" which is derived from "Reagan Democrats" which in turn started with "Democrats for Nixon".

In each of these cases, we're talking about people who are registered Democrats but who were not comfortable with the presumably left wing direction of the Democratic party. Was the problem abortion, gun control, gay marriage or another social issue? Nixon and Reagan appealed to these Democrats in a populistic way as the best defence of America's silent majority or its true values.

There's a red state/blue state divide in America and the red states tend to be ordinary folk who have little patience with sophisticated bafflegab. Bill Clinton knew how to get these people and so did Jimmy Carter in 1976. Gore knew how to do it but he chose not to. I don't think Obama can.

To win, a Republican has to appeal to these nominally Democratic voters and McCain can but with Palin, it will be that much easier.

[Guest American Woman]

Well, the thread's title is "Palin Democrats" which is derived from "Reagan Democrats" which in turn started with "Democrats for Nixon".

Right. It's PALIN Democrats, not McCain Democrats. They weren't "more likely" to vote Republican until McCain brought Palin on board.

In each of these cases, we're talking about people who are registered Democrats but who were not comfortable with the presumably left wing direction of the Democratic party.

If that were the case now, they would have been "McCain Democrats" because they wouldn't have been comfortable with the direction of the Democratic party prior to her nomination. But they weren't "more likely to vote Republican" until McCain chose Palin as his running mate. Look at the comments. They're all about her personally. The "Palin Democrats" aren't saying they are enthused about her because of her stand on the issues/the Democrats stand on the issues; they're saying that they're enthused because she's a woman, a mother, a role model for working women. In other words, once again, it's not about her policies.

[Sulaco]

Right. It's PALIN Democrats, not McCain Democrats. They weren't "more likely" to vote Republican until McCain brought Palin on board.

If that were the case now, they would have been "McCain Democrats" because they wouldn't have been comfortable with the direction of the Democratic party prior to her nomination. But they weren't "more likely to vote Republican" until McCain chose Palin as his running mate. Look at the comments. They're all about her personally. The "Palin Democrats" aren't saying they are enthused about her because of her stand on the issues/the Democrats stand on the issues; they're saying that they're enthused because she's a woman, a mother, a role model for working women. In other words, once again, it's not about her policies.

Except that social conservative, whatever the party affiliation, never felt McCain was a good conservative social values warrior. Most viewed him as somewhat derisive of social conservatives as a cultural/political group. The intorduction of Palin is what energized socially conservative republicans - that's why the enthusiasm now in places like Colorado Springs. Why is it so hard to beleive that until Palin was added to the ticket democratic social conservatives were also uninspired by McCain. Now they feel far more reason to switch votes.

By the way, your belief that the Dems are bereft of social conservatives is exactly the attitude that causes those dems to so often switch to Repubs for presidential elections (they vote dem at the local leves more often than not but consistently vote Repub at the presidential levels.) You might be surprised but some percentage of Americans are culturally conservative but when it comes to government involvement in societal issues and programs they prefer the Dems. But hey - keep driving them our way!

[Sulaco]

Addendum:

A great example is Catholic Democrats who, while not helping Bush much in the EC probably assisted in pushing him over 50% in '04.

I would also add of all Repub pres candidates the Huck probably spoke most closely the outlook of culturally conservative dems. Which is why he could enver win. The republicans too have a varied electorate and the Huck could never win over western style conservativism or the conservative intellectual elite in the northeast.

Yes American Woman - neither party is monolithic, in fact they are quite varied internally.

[Guest American Woman]

Except that social conservative, whatever the party affiliation, never felt McCain was a good conservative social values warrior. Most viewed him as somewhat derisive of social conservatives as a cultural/political group. The intorduction of Palin is what energized socially conservative republicans - that's why the enthusiasm now in places like Colorado Springs. Why is it so hard to beleive that until Palin was added to the ticket democratic social conservatives were also uninspired by McCain. Now they feel far more reason to switch votes.

Riiiiiiight. McCain wasn't socially conservative enough, so until Palin came along, they were going to vote for the even less socially conservative Democrats. Makes perfect sense.

I already covered everything you've said. That goes for your addendum, too, so I suggest you "LERAN TO RAED!!!" so you don't waste your time repeating what I've already addressed, and even more importantly, you don't waste any more of my time.

[Sulaco]

Riiiiiiight. McCain wasn't socially conservative enough, so until Palin came along, they were going to vote for the even less socially conservative Democrats. Makes perfect sense.

I already covered everything you've said. That goes for your addendum, too, so I suggest you "LERAN TO RAED!!!" so you don't waste your time repeating what I've already addressed, and even more importantly, you don't waste any more of my time.

Let's go through this in more detail. Culturally conservative democrats are democrats because they share democratic views on many issues, including many social issues. But they also are just that, culturally conservative. When the Republicans didn't have a culturally conservative ticket (prior to Palin) these dems would gain nothing by voting Repub. While they could gain something by voting Obama with whome they share societal values. Now that Palin has come on board the McCain ticket is more attractive (in the cultural conservative sense). These dems are now more likely to shift their votes. This is all very clear to anyone not engaged in partisan wishful thinking.

It's the same reason Clinton drew Republican votes in 96. To simplify, welfare reform, among other things, made him a viable candidate for republicans who were conservative on societal issues but note all that wedded to cultural conservativism. He provided a viable alternative to a Repub ticket ran by Dole who was seen as a Rockefeller-like republican and thus not that much different from Clinton.

Edited September 13, 2008 by Sulaco

[bush_cheney2004]

...It's the same reason Clinton drew Republican votes in 96. To simplify, welfare reform, among other things, made him a viable candidate for republicans who were conservative on societal issues but note all that wedded to cultural conservativism. He provided a viable alternative to a Repub ticket ran by Dole who was seen as a Rockefeller-like republican and thus not that much different from Clinton.

Absolutely.....Clinton was a moderate who pissed off a lot of liberals and progressives. He even BOMBED people! Imagine that.