Is it just me...

[NDP4Montreal]

...or does Dion seem like a rebirth of John Turner?

I feel like he is going to lead the Liberals to near (not complete) oblivion in this election. I can only hope that most of those votes go to the NDP...maybe the greens...and not to the Cons...which is what I'm very worried about.

[jdobbin]

...or does Dion seem like a rebirth of John Turner?

I feel like he is going to lead the Liberals to near (not complete) oblivion in this election. I can only hope that most of those votes go to the NDP...maybe the greens...and not to the Cons...which is what I'm very worried about.

Is that the John Turner who in his second turn at an election surged past the NDP?

[betsy]

...or does Dion seem like a rebirth of John Turner?

I feel like he is going to lead the Liberals to near (not complete) oblivion in this election.

He started his campaign in Ottawa today with this: "I am happy and unhappy. But first I will tell you about why I am happy."

By the looks on David McGuinty's face as he stood behind Dion, it doesn't bode well. For the Liberals.

[NDP4Montreal]

Is that the John Turner who in his second turn at an election surged past the NDP?

For the record, I was a Liberal until late 2005. You can guess why.

He started his campaign in Ottawa today with this: "I am happy and unhappy. But first I will tell you about why I am happy."

By the looks on David McGuinty's face as he stood behind Dion, it doesn't bode well. For the Liberals.

Tell me when I should flush the toilet.

[jdobbin]

For the record, I was a Liberal until late 2005. You can guess why.

I have no idea why. Because you like Jack Layton?

[cybercoma]

Speaking of Jack Layton, I cringed when he was on the news saying, "Stephen Harper just quit his job today.... And I'm here to tell you that I'm applying for it," or something along those lines.

[Ontario Loyalist]

Speaking of Jack Layton, I cringed when he was on the news saying, "Stephen Harper just quit his job today.... And I'm here to tell you that I'm applying for it," or something along those lines.

Invoking Obama is a lame, too.

[NDP4Montreal]

I have no idea why. Because you like Jack Layton?

Gee, you don't sound like a typical Liberal. Let's just pretend the past didn't happen....

[jefferiah]

Is it just me........

or does Jack Layton eerily resemble Vladimir Lenin?

[jdobbin]

Gee, you don't sound like a typical Liberal. Let's just pretend the past didn't happen....

I am asking honestly. Here in Manitoba, there is still anger at the NDP for the thuggery they showed at removing Bev Desjarlais.

You say you left the Liberals in 2005. I have no idea what the triggering event might have been.

[Ontario Loyalist]

Is it just me........

or does Jack Layton eerily resemble Vladimir Lenin?

He should read this article:

http://www.socialimage.net/2006_09_20_the_hill.html

[blueblood]

Is it just me........

or does Jack Layton eerily resemble Vladimir Lenin?

just give him a little beard and i guess you have a point.

[jdobbin]

Is it just me........

or does Jack Layton eerily resemble Vladimir Lenin?

Be careful. Some might say the same about Vic Toews.

[Ontario Loyalist]

I suppose this has been mentioned elsewhere, but the Liberals still don't have candidates in thirty or so ridings in Quebec from what I understand...

[betsy]

Speaking of Jack Layton, I cringed when he was on the news saying, "Stephen Harper just quit his job today.... And I'm here to tell you that I'm applying for it," or something along those lines.

That line has been the mantra of the NDP for a couple of weeks now. Everytime an NDP MP or strategist opens his mouth, you bet that line is going to come out.....followed by another, the "kitchen table." You'd think he'd have something new to say yesterday at his official campaign speech. The NDP and Liberal speech writers are running out of creative ideas it seems. I wonder why they still go along with their writers and strategists and spout such lines?

Can't they see for themselves how silly and ineffective some of these lines sound?

I've heard of politicians throwing away their practiced speech and doing it their own way! Both Clintons are said to have done that.

I mean, how can one sell himself as a good leader if he can't even discern and break away from a strategist/speech writer's bad line? They can't tell that the line is becoming irritatingly and phoney-soundingly repetitive?

Another thing, this campaign is turning into a battle of cliches between Dion and Layton. Diuceppe is also vying for the cliche-king title.

The good old "hidden agenda" recital had been dugged out, recycled and repackaged into "secretive." The fear-mongering-gamut galore ranging from the big, bad rightwing to the sky's falling is back again.

Of all Opposition leaders, only Elizabeth May had taken this into a new high...or low, with her cracking voice-about-to cry passioned speech. It must be the Toronto Film Festival! But hey, women voters are up for grabs so that must be it. Who would have thought I'd be needing a hankie watching this drama?

Edited September 8, 2008 by betsy

[betsy]

Invoking Obama is a lame, too.

And that's how Dion will whack Layton. Yesterday Dion said: "Jack thinks he is Obama. Jack! You are Jack Layon, not Barack Obama!"

I mean this is just it. Why would these leaders allow themselves to be set up like this? It's mind-boggling for these are seasoned politicians so they should know what is effective and destructive.

To me, it is a clear glimpse of their lack of leadership skills....blindly trusting and following with hardly any thought of the consequences...at a time when their personal losses such as their political careers are at stake.

Edited September 8, 2008 by betsy

[cybercoma]

I suppose this has been mentioned elsewhere, but the Liberals still don't have candidates in thirty or so ridings in Quebec from what I understand...

They'll have absolutely no problem putting candidates in all of the ridings because their base is so large, but this does show a considerable lack of preparation.

[August1991]

They'll have absolutely no problem putting candidates in all of the ridings because their base is so large, but this does show a considerable lack of preparation.

They have no one nominated in Outremont yet.

Check this out.

An Environics poll released last Thursday put the Conservative Party at 38 per cent support nationally, and the Liberals at 28 per cent. A slew of polls that came out at the end of August had the governing Tories and the opposition Grits in a statistical tie. However, a Strategic Counsel poll conducted for The Globe and Mail and CTV News released on Monday last week had the Conservatives at 37 per cent and the Liberals at 29 per cent, hinting that the tide was turning in favour of the Conservatives.

...

The Environics poll revealed that 39 per cent of Canadians believe Mr. Harper would make the best Prime Minister, with NDP Leader Jack Layton (Toronto Danforth, Ont.) coming a distant second at 15 per cent, and Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion (Saint-Laurent-Cartierville, Que.) at 13 per cent.

Hill Times

If Dion doesn't turn these numbers around in the next few weeks, it's a safe bet that his speech on the evening of October 14 will include his resignation as Liberal leader.

Edited September 8, 2008 by August1991

[myata]

If there's any illusions about who's going to stand up to Harper's conservatives, just think about who brought them to power.

Dion or no Dion, the only way to stop them, is to vote Liberal.

On the other hand, I don't mind, and often recommend bitter medicine. What could be better against social conservative ideology, than Harper's majority? Especially if combined with new Republican administration in the US. Wouldn't that be a stellar opportunity for Canada to show its independence and gain international respect?

[jdobbin]

If Dion doesn't turn these numbers around in the next few weeks, it's a safe bet that his speech on the evening of October 14 will include his resignation as Liberal leader.

He could possibly lose his own seat.

[Moonbox]

What could be better against social conservative ideology, than Harper's majority? Especially if combined with new Republican administration in the US.

Comparing Canada's CPC to the USA's Republican party is about as out of touch with reality as would be comparing Canada's NDP or Liberals with Chinese Communism.

The US is so right wing that even the democrats would be 10x more conservative than Canada's Conservative party.

With that being said, only an idiot (Jean Chretien/Pierre Trudea) would make special efforts to antagonize what has been our strongest ally, trading partner and friend for the last 100 years. When 70+% of Canada's exports go to the US, it might be wise to at least stay cordial with them.

Trudeau/Chretien, however, found that they could score points with lowest common denominators in Canada by purposely souring relations with the US.

What did this do for Canada? Nothing. It didn't impress the rest of the world. It didn't score Canada points anywhere else. All of it was cheap theatrics that impressed the less intelligent and made it harder to do business on our own Continent.

Do I think Canada should support Iraq? No, but our Prime Minister should be looking out for Canada, not playing stupid games that get us nowhere and anger our friends.

[August1991]

He could possibly lose his own seat.

I doubt it. Dion's riding covers Cartierville/Cote Vetu/VSL. His seat is safe.

Indeed, one of the reasons that I have never underestimated Dion is that for a guy from Quebec City, he negotiated a safe seat from Chretien. Dion's father was no fool.

Dion will not give this up without a fight.

The US is so right wing that even the democrats would be 10x more conservative than Canada's Conservative party.

If you listened to the CBC all day and only read the Toronto Star, you might have that impression. (As I have often said, if Canada became part of the US, Onatrio would become another Michigan and Toronto would become another Detroit.) The English Canadian nationalist elite based in Toronto has an interest in drawing a stark divide between their "Canada" and their presentation of the US.

In fact, the US is far more diverse and interesting than describing it as "so right wing". And Canada is not Toronto.

Edited September 8, 2008 by August1991

[Ontario Loyalist]

Comparing Canada's CPC to the USA's Republican party is about as out of touch with reality as would be comparing Canada's NDP or Liberals with Chinese Communism.

Conservatives who think the NDP or Liberals are communists are quite common it would seem.

For what reason should the CPC and Republican party NOT be compared. They're on the same page in many respects. Harper makes himself out to be a Canadian patriot, but he would happily turn this country into a republic. Rememeber, he's only in power to serve the West, and the current political structure is perceived to be more beneficial for central Canada. This in part his is much suspected "hidden agenda"...

[myata]

Do I think Canada should support Iraq?

What about Iran, though? Would Harper's Canada support another liberation mission? Not on the ground, granted (Harper's got that wonderful excuse of Afghanistan for another few years), but in democratic spirit? As war (sorry, "right to defend") in Lebanon, separation of Kosovo, Georgia?

[Moonbox]

If you listened to the CBC all day and only read the Toronto Star, you might have that impression. (As I have often said, if Canada became part of the US, Onatrio would become another Michigan and Toronto would become another Detroit.) The English Canadian nationalist elite based in Toronto has an interest in drawing a stark divide between their "Canada" and their presentation of the US.

In fact, the US is far more diverse and interesting than describing it as "so right wing". And Canada is not Toronto.

What??? I mean really....WHAT??? Ontario would become Michigan? Toronto would become Detroit?? Why would that thought even occur to you in this thread? I can't even begin to grasp how we went from my quote saying the US is way more right wing than Canada to yours where you talked about the annexation of Ontario.

Wow.

Now as to Ontario Loyalist, you can compare Canadian parties to whoever you like. The rationale behind these comparisons, however, is weak at BEST. Comparing the Liberals and NDP to communists IS stupid, but I can do it easily by saying that the Liberals and the NDP are just tax and spend socialists who are anti-big business and want to turn the country into a welfare nation. That sort of assertion is JUST as fallacious, ill-informed and weakly supported as 99.9% of the comparisons made between Harper and Bush.

The fact of the matter is that all of the parties in Canada are so far removed from either communism or the American right wing that these comparisons are pointless.

All they are is stupid rhetoric invented to provoke emotional responses from an ignorant audience.

The right says: "NDP and Liberal is like communism. You all know communism is bad. The NDP is therefore BAD."

The left says, "CPC is like Republican. You all hate Bush. Harper is like Bush. You should hate Harper."

The problem is that when you get right down to the issues and differences between Canadian politics and any of these stupid comparisons, they don't float any better than a boat full of holes.